Author Topic: Dorje Shugden Is Alive and Amongst Us Today!  (Read 188645 times)

Zach

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Re: Dorje Shugden Is Alive and Amongst Us Today!
« Reply #15 on: July 08, 2010, 10:48:01 AM »
MMMM...I dont know what to say really.
Do we have any confirmation of what has been said ?  ???

WoselTenzin

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Re: Dorje Shugden Is Alive and Amongst Us Today!
« Reply #16 on: July 08, 2010, 10:54:37 AM »
OMG! This is the most incredible news I have heard in a long long time.  The unmistaken incarnation of Tulku Drapga Gyaltsen (TDG) is back!  Imagine the emanation of our holy protector is amongst us, alive, well and spreading the Dharma.  May we have the good fortune to come before his presence to make offerings to him, request him to remain for a long time to turn the wheel of Dharma and receive teachings directly from him.  This is too good to be true and my heart is beating with excitement as I type this message.

Finally there is concrete evidence that all the accusation on Dorje Shugden being an evil spirit is false.  If Tulku Dragpa Gyaltsen is back, it can only mean that Dorje Shugden is an enlightened protector and the whole basis of Dharamsala ban on Dorje Shugden has fallen apart.  Oh Oh, what’s Dharamsala going to do now? What other excuses is Dharamsala going to come out with this time to maintain their ban on Dorje Shugden?  Hard evidence is now at hand to prove that Dorje Shugden is not an evil spirit.   It means that propitiating Dorje Shugden cannot shorten the Dalai Lama’s life or harm the cause of free Tibet.  So how now?  Would Dharamsala be so gracious to finally admit their mistake, revoke their ban on Dorje Shugden practice? I can’t wait for the response from TGIE on this news.

8th July 2010 is indeed a historical day.  With this announcement, Tulku Drapga Gyaltsen is telling the world that the time has come to make his presence and enlightened activities known. How auspicious we are living at this time!! 

thor

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Re: Dorje Shugden Is Alive and Amongst Us Today!
« Reply #17 on: July 08, 2010, 10:56:20 AM »
This is new to me, despite all my research I have never seen a Tulku Dragpa Gyaltsen reincarnation mentioned.  In fact the Shugden historical accounts have used the lack of a reincarnation as a form of justification, that's how the 19th century author Tsunpa Mati justifies Dorje Shugden as being the reincarnation of Tulku Dragpa Gyaltsen, which is quoted by Pabongkha Rinpoche. 

There was a Zhide Nyungne Lama reincarnation that is said to be an emanation of Panchen Sonam Dragpa, but one of the later supposed reincarnations fell into disrepute when he and the Reting Rinpoche tried assassinating Taktra Rinpoche.

Technically there are many emanations possible, but as far as official recognitions go this is as much as I know, not to mention it is unclear if the Zhide Nyungne Lama reincarnation line was broken or not.

The lack of official recognitions would be attributed to the fact that his incarnation lineage was banned. No one would dare recognise him as such in public, for fear of the wrath of the Tibetan government (and we all know how vicious it can be).

More likely, he would have been recognised under another name, just like Changkya Rolpai Dorje's incarnation was named the reincarnated Abbot of Pabongka monastery due to the political situation at the time. I am uncertain how volatile the situation with China and the Chinese emperors would have been, but I doubt it would compare to today's global situation with Dorje Shugden.

Changkya continued to manifest his great deeds as Pabongka, and so Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen would do the same as well. TDG's line of incarnations has performed such great deeds, so much so that the majority of today's lama's achievements pale by comparison. The mindstream of such a great being will do nothing else BUT BENEFIT OTHERS. And him arising as Dorje Shugden does not exclude him from emanating as a lineage of lamas, perhaps even as the mind emanation of TDG himself.

I congratulate the website team for getting first-hand information on this news. I did a quick google search and no where else can this info be found except whatever is extracted from this announcement. Please continue to broadcast all news related to the incarnation of Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen - it will definitely cause an explosion when he emerges into public.

D

LosangKhyentse

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Re: Dorje Shugden Is Alive and Amongst Us Today!
« Reply #18 on: July 08, 2010, 12:00:52 PM »

If illustrious lamas and the Dorje Shugden oracle has recognized this incarnation many decades ago before the controversy and ban, it is an incredible insight into the future. When problems like this would arise so to keep the incarnation's existence a secret. Also for making announcement of the incarnation when Dalai Lama is already 75 years old. I find it very skilfull.

Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen doesn't need the Tibetan Govt, Scholars, Monasteries, or us to confirm who he is. It seems he has been incarnating and helping all along. Great news! After all, what are the benefits and disbenefits to this? Surely the benefits outweigh the 'disbenefits' completely. It shows the lies spewed by the TGIE and further lies to cover themselves is being revealed surely and definitely. Too bad for TGIE now. The end is near for them, sorry to say. The beginning has begun for us.

This website from past history wouldn't simply post such an announcement if it was not fully confirmed. This website team to me seems to be very accurate with their information since it's inception. I trust this website. Anyhow, Kyabje Drakpa Gyeltsen Rinpoche's whereabouts is not revealed so, nothing to worry. If he is who he is, then he will benefit Lord Tsongkapa's teachings quietly as he has been doing it seems. He doesn't seem to be in a hurry to make his precise identity open and wish any fanfare. So let's pray his activities continue. Rejoice!

In Sera Je Monastery, there is a lama recognized by Dalai Lama as the unmistaken incarnation of Shantideva (Shiwa Hla in Tibetan). So his name is Shiwa Hla Rinpoche. From Shantideva until now there hasn't been any word of an 'unbroken' line of incarnations. But it does not mean he has not been incarnating continuously with different names to benefit. So why not Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen.

I personally feel happy about the news. I remain with my gurus and practice always. But I rejoice for his students and Kyabje Drakpa Gyeltsen's sacred dharma works.

TK

« Last Edit: July 08, 2010, 12:04:27 PM by tk »

harrynephew

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Re: Dorje Shugden Is Alive and Amongst Us Today!
« Reply #19 on: July 08, 2010, 02:22:39 PM »

If illustrious lamas and the Dorje Shugden oracle has recognized this incarnation many decades ago before the controversy and ban, it is an incredible insight into the future. When problems like this would arise so to keep the incarnation's existence a secret. Also for making announcement of the incarnation when Dalai Lama is already 75 years old. I find it very skilfull.

Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen doesn't need the Tibetan Govt, Scholars, Monasteries, or us to confirm who he is. It seems he has been incarnating and helping all along. Great news! After all, what are the benefits and disbenefits to this? Surely the benefits outweigh the 'disbenefits' completely. It shows the lies spewed by the TGIE and further lies to cover themselves is being revealed surely and definitely. Too bad for TGIE now. The end is near for them, sorry to say. The beginning has begun for us.


I totally agree with you TK. In this age and time, Dharamsala and TGIE will not hold much water in their decisions/approvals. One such example is the New Kadampa Tradition headed by Ven. Geshe Kelsang Gyatso. They weren't approved by Dharamsala or TGIE but is one of the leading Buddhist organizations in the world bringing every single benefit from the unbroken lineage of Lord Tsongkhapa's teachings! I totally rejoice in their works

I feel that for a country which is so spiritual, the communication of untruth is really uncalled for. With that, the government keeps corrupting itself and will not sustain. I believe the new era of truth, harmony, justice and peace will prevail soon.

This will be marked by the birth of Dorje Shugden as the definitive deity in Buddhism and the world. I'm gonna be part of this!
Harry Nephew

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vajralight

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Re: Dorje Shugden Is Alive and Amongst Us Today!
« Reply #20 on: July 08, 2010, 02:34:23 PM »
I am actually quite underwhelmed. What proof will we get, what if the reincarnation is a fake ?
He could then potentially destroy the lineage from within. I remain cautious.

I am happy with any Lama/Teacher who spreads Je Tsongkhapa's tradition purely but I am
quite suspicious of all these tulkus etc.. Look how many tulkus have disrobed. Yes I don't know their intentions, they might be high bodhisattvas and benefit others, but it would be nice to see some examples of realized being staying in robes too.

Vajra
 

crazycloud

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Re: Dorje Shugden Is Alive and Amongst Us Today!
« Reply #21 on: July 08, 2010, 04:01:49 PM »
I am actually quite underwhelmed. What proof will we get, what if the reincarnation is a fake ?
He could then potentially destroy the lineage from within. I remain cautious.

I am happy with any Lama/Teacher who spreads Je Tsongkhapa's tradition purely but I am
quite suspicious of all these tulkus etc.. Look how many tulkus have disrobed. Yes I don't know their intentions, they might be high bodhisattvas and benefit others, but it would be nice to see some examples of realized being staying in robes too.

Vajra
 

listen to the wisdom words of Vajra....

Beware Tulkus and the Tulku system....... Beware Tulkus and the Tulku system.......Beware Tulkus and the Tulku system.......

Geshe Kelsang shows a fine example of this, having absolutely banned the promotion of tulku's within his organization, not to mention Oracles and the rest of the claptrap...

harrynephew

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Re: Dorje Shugden Is Alive and Amongst Us Today!
« Reply #22 on: July 08, 2010, 04:19:25 PM »
I am actually quite underwhelmed. What proof will we get, what if the reincarnation is a fake ?
He could then potentially destroy the lineage from within. I remain cautious.

I am happy with any Lama/Teacher who spreads Je Tsongkhapa's tradition purely but I am
quite suspicious of all these tulkus etc.. Look how many tulkus have disrobed. Yes I don't know their intentions, they might be high bodhisattvas and benefit others, but it would be nice to see some examples of realized being staying in robes too.

Vajra
 

To help u with this. We can trace the illustrious past incarnations of Dorje Shugden beginning from the great MahaSiddha Birwapa to, Duldzin Drakpa Gyaltsen, Panchen Sonam Drakpa and Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen. What do they have in common???? That'll be your key approach in finding the unmistaken incarnation of the great Kyabje Drakpa Gyaltsen.

some key points which I can think of are as follow:
1. Built monasteries and great religious institutes to preserve the teachings of Je Tsongkhapa (Gaden)
2. Be able to teach in barbaric lands and establish the sacred Dharma
3. Uphold the Vinaya strictly and purely where ever he is teaching

Anyways, I know for sure where ever his incarnation is, creditable high lamas and I think even the protector through the oracle himself will give pronouncements where ever the credit is due.

can't wait to meet him!

H1N1
Harry Nephew

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Zhalmed Pawo

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Re: Dorje Shugden Is Alive and Amongst Us Today!
« Reply #23 on: July 08, 2010, 05:20:45 PM »
I am somewhat baffled. I really do not understand why so many people are seemingly so excited by this thing. Really.

All the big time words about this happenstance being somehow world shattering, or whatever, do not ring a single bell within me. (Call me the cynic.) But really, people in general are interested in FIFA 2010, the sovereign debt crisis, the dollar printing of the FED, the possible escalation of USA war zone in South Asia... these things are important, big, and occupy people's minds. They, and just they, are world shattering facts, coming to light. If some obscure saffron robed Tibetans have said that some other Tibetan is a former Great Tibetan, that hardly constitutes as a great breakthrough of Truth into the light, or in any way a meaningful thing. This announcement will not make a ripple in the World outside Tibetan Buddhism. Truly.

This will in all probability not even shake the Tibetan Buddhist World. Some Lamas say "this guy is a Great One", and others say "surely not". That has happened with the new Karmapas, and it will happen with TDG also. If the powers that be, in Tibetan Buddhism, do not accept this tulku as a Tulku, they just say so, and all who say otherwise, will be stoned like Shamarpa, or whoever happens to disagree. There will therefore not be even a ripple in the Tibetan Buddhist World.

This will furthermore prove nothing to the World, as per any dharmic revelation, as surely all modern men know already that Tibetans believe in reincarnation/rebirth. This will be just a claim amongst the all others, proving nothing except the faith of the faithful, and therefore nothing.

But, and here is the proverbial butt, the most worrisome thing is nevertheless, that there seems to be a view that elevates Others above us. For, you see, if TDG is such a great being, his greatness has surely came through his personal practice, so shouldn't we therefore elevate personal practice above all else, claiming that just it will be the proof of the Truth of our religion? So instead of looking at an unknown and unproven emanation of a former practitioner as some sort of Saviour or an Idol, shouldn't we idolize and see the saving grace of the Practice itself? Otherwise we could just remain with the best of Idols, the HHDL, and yell in unison how great he is, while hoping that by attaching us to the Idol, we will somehow get a little star-glitter or blessing ourselves? Somehow the old saying "jumping from the frying pan, into the fire" comes to my mind. If all people want is an Idol, why take an obscure and existentially unproven one - stick with HHDL!

It is not that I dispute the appearance of TDG or in any way would detest the 'popping out', if true, but I just simply do not see a point in all the fuss. I hail him as great because he practiced and taught JT's doctrine, back then, and if he now reappeared, he will surely behave in a same way - practicing and teaching, but isn't just that what we all should be doing? Instead of hollering that "the King is the Noblest", shouldn't we all try to be Noble ourselves? Arthur might be the King, but the Table is Round!

shugdenprotect

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Re: Dorje Shugden Is Alive and Amongst Us Today!
« Reply #24 on: July 08, 2010, 06:16:05 PM »
This is just the best news one can start their day with. Thank you dorjeshugden(dot)com and team!!!

When I read this article, my first thought was the truth always prevails. After 350 years of effort to obliterate Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen (TDG) from the face of the Dharma-earth, His legacy stands firm. It gives me peace that what is pure and meant to benefit will be protected by the Dharma to remain intact.

I am sincerely touched that such a highly attained being has been compassionately and humbly returning to samsara to continue doing Dharma work. Silently, behind a veil to protect His identity, TDG remains with us to ensure the Dharma is protected and growing. I am deeply humbled by the humility of such an enlightened being who had to come to such low levels to be with us and serve us. I fold my hands in deep gratitude and hope that I will have the good fortune to be in service to you, TDG.

It is awesome that so many await and rejoice for this announcement about Tulku Dragpa Gyeltsen. This shows how significant He is whereby, despite His tangible absence in the last centuries, the faith in TDG remains stable as the victory banners! I trust that this faith is developed through the substantial work this line of incarnation has contributed to the Buddhadharma and sentient beings.

The time for a new era has arrive, may H.H the Dalai Lama, the King of Dharma who has brought Buddhadharma to the international arena, pass the beacon to Tulku Dragpa Gyeltsen to continue turning the wheel of Dharma.

honeydakini

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Re: Dorje Shugden Is Alive and Amongst Us Today!
« Reply #25 on: July 08, 2010, 06:59:22 PM »
It goes without saying that an incarnation of a highly enlightened being - whether formally recognised or not - will always return to continue his good works to benefit others. It is understood that real tulkus don't need recognition; they will do what they are doing nevertheless.

In some cases the recognitions may be political, but larger than that, I believe they do (and have been) a very valuable teaching for many students - serving as reminders of reincarnation, the ability to "return" always to carry on our previous lives' deeds, actions and practice, evidence to practitioners that there is indeed continuity in the mindstream that can only continue to contribute more and more benefit to the world.

With this recent news about the return of TDG, it is not so much a hoo-hah about his title per say, nor the politics behind it / political statements it makes. Rather, it is of great significance because of what it can mean for thousands of DS practitioners in the world - it can bring hope and great faith back into the minds of many. All that others have said to put down this practice, say that it is bad, harmful, a path of a demon etc ... well, the people on this forum may be strong enough never to lose faith and conviction in their practice and teachings, but some others may be very violently disturbed by what is going on. To hear news like this could be the impetus to revive and strengthen their faith, give them hope again.

I think when the people here mention the fact that this news will shake the Tibetan world, I think they allude to the fact that the very basis of what the TGIE has been sprouting and the reasons they have been using to put others down will be very much challenged by this. It is certainly my hope that it will amount to their being proved wrong eventually, and that therefore, all those who have been oppressed, suppressed, put down and damaged by this can begin to see a new dawn again, a space for practising again, at least without such threat of being attacked.

Yes, there could always be some people who will just blatantly say "no, this is not true" and deny it completely. But the very fact that he is there, and that many will also say, "Yes, this IS true" could be threat enough to diminish the effect of what the TGIE is saying. If nothing else, it may just give those who are oppressed the courage to stand up more for themselves, speak up and hold much stronger conviction in their practice. It may not stop what the TGIE is doing immediately, but I think the fact that it may give others much more hope and strength in their practice cannot be denied.

Zhalmed Pawo

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Re: Dorje Shugden Is Alive and Amongst Us Today!
« Reply #26 on: July 08, 2010, 07:12:22 PM »
Deja Vu

(Please, accept my apologies, in the case that I actually touch any human being - see the disclaimer below.)

There is a computer program, sometimes called a Turing Machine, that generates seemingly meaningful sentences, but nevertheless quite understandably lacks any real reason, or any understanding of even context. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chatterbot I have met this program before, in the old days, when the Buddhist discussions were principally made in the Usenet.

Some call it artificial intellect. In Usenet we called it Chinese Spam, as it was then programmed to post anti-Tibet and anti-DL posts. Or rather, it did not post, but reply to other posts; it was as if you would be discussing with someone. It quite cleverly took a clue from several words taken from posts of others that matched it's preprogrammed list, and then generated a salad of sentences seemingly discussing the issue matter - but of course the discussion never went anywhere, as the other party, the Turing Machine, was not discussing, but just spamming it's own propaganda, while of course loosely depending on the clues it got from the posts of humans. It was eventually discovered as 'a non-sentient discusser' as I once happened to ask a wholly unrelated thing, without there being any 'preprogrammed clue words'. At this point the program answered, as usual, but as there were no clues, the answer was a blank. As some professional programmers at that point noticed, that indeed, this 'Poster" had in fact behaved for a year or so in just a like manner as a Turing Machine, it all stopped. The Man Behind the Curtain knew, at that point, that he had been seen! The Turing Machine went silent.

Nice to meet the good old program again. The programmer might of course be different. And it is nice to see, that the program is multi-tentacled, and improved. ;D ::)


DHARMIC DISCLAIMER: I agree with the Forum policy that we should discuss and debate issues, not persons, but as I just realized that the behaviour of a class of posters actually resembles a Turing Machine, not human beings, I therefore must point this out. For after all, haven't we all seen how there is a repetitious barrage of sameminded blabber, without there seemingly being any semblance of trying to discuss the issues.

crazycloud

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Re: Dorje Shugden Is Alive and Amongst Us Today!
« Reply #27 on: July 08, 2010, 07:22:07 PM »
H.O.A.X

crazycloud

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Re: Dorje Shugden Is Alive and Amongst Us Today!
« Reply #28 on: July 08, 2010, 07:28:38 PM »
Ha Ha ha!
Thanks goodness our Lord Shugden is finally here to save us! He must be an amazing lama! how kind our gurus are for this new stratagem that will shake the world!!!
Quote
Finally there is concrete evidence that all the accusation on Dorje Shugden being an evil spirit is false.

That's right, because someone typing something into an input field IS concrete evidence!

crazycloud

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Re: Dorje Shugden Is Alive and Amongst Us Today!
« Reply #29 on: July 08, 2010, 07:32:32 PM »
I did a quick google search and no where else can this info be found except whatever is extracted from this announcement.

How very surprising.