Author Topic: Beijing’s Tibet lama choice enters politics  (Read 6795 times)

WisdomBeing

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Beijing’s Tibet lama choice enters politics
« on: January 29, 2013, 05:10:07 PM »
Wow. Reting Rinpoche has returned! The incarnations of Reting Rinpoche had been banned (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/all-articles/the-controversy/banning-of-tulkus-in-history/) but obviously someone forgot to tell the Chinese government that! It is interesting that the spokesman for HH Dalai Lama did not mention that either, though perhaps it might sound too ridiculous.. after all, how can you ban a highly attained incarnation??

Like the banning of Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/all-articles/the-controversy/recognizing-tulkus/)... i hope his incarnation will be recognised and found soon!


Beijing’s Tibet lama choice enters politics
http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2013%5C01%5C29%5Cstory_29-1-2013_pg14_6
Tuesday, January 29, 2013

BEIJING: China’s choice as one of the most important figures in the Tibetan religious hierarchy has been given his first political appointment, state media said Monday, aged just 16.

China enthroned Sonam Phuntsok in 2000 as the seventh Reting Rinpoche, a line of figures who have traditionally taken charge between the death of Tibet’s spiritual leader, the Dalai Lama, and the identification of his successor.

His selection was seen as an attempt by Beijing to increase its control over reincarnations of Tibetan lamas and to legitimise its rule over the region, with monks at the Reting monastery protesting at the time.

Now, as Tibet is roiled by ethnic tensions, the teenager has become the youngest member of the Tibet Committee of the Chinese People’s Political Consultative Conference (CPPCC), the China Daily said, and has pledged to uphold “patriotism”.

The CPPCC is a nominated advisory body which plays a key role in policy debate in China and officially performs “democratic supervision” of the ruling party.

In an interview with the state-run newspaper following his appointment, the teenager was quoted as saying he would “keep the Reting lineage of patriotism and the love for the religion”.

The newspaper listed his interests as learning languages, surfing the Internet and posting on his online blog.

“I have more than 5,000 fans. I talk about Buddhism with people online quite often,” he was quoted as saying. “My favourite exercise is sit-ups,” he added, “because I am fat”.

There was no mention of the Dalai Lama in the article and his latest blog post was quoted as saying: “Don’t care about who is the leader, but care about who treats the people well.” The China Daily interview ran in a prominent position on page three, at a time when nearly 100 Tibetans have set fire to themselves since 2009 in protest against the Chinese government.

Beijing blames the self-immolations on separatist forces and the Dalai Lama, accusing the Nobel laureate of inciting the acts.

Many Tibetans in China accuse the government of religious repression and eroding their culture, as the country’s majority Han ethnic group increasingly moves into historically Tibetan areas.

China rejects that, saying Tibetans enjoy religious freedom. Beijing also points to huge ongoing investment it says has brought modernisation and a better standard of living to Tibet.

The Tibetan government-in-exile in Dharamsala, in India, dismissed the report.

“The Chinese just want to add names but any kind of cosmetic change will not be able to win hearts and minds in Tibet,” said Chhime Chhoekyapa, a spokesman for the Dalai Lama. “Look at Tibet now.”

The fifth Reting Rinpoche played an important role in identifying the present Dalai Lama, who was enthroned in 1940, the Tibetan Centre for Human Rights and Democracy said. Sonam Phuntsok was enthroned as the seventh Reting Rinpoche following the escape of the then 14-year-old Karmapa Lama to the Tibetan exile government headquarters in Dharamsala in 1999.

The Karmapa Lama’s flight was a major embarrassment for Beijing as he is one of the four most important Tibetan spiritual leaders and recognised by both Chinese authorities and the Dalai Lama. afp
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Ensapa

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Re: Beijing’s Tibet lama choice enters politics
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2013, 06:59:50 AM »
Actually, there is a bit more to this story. the Reting Rinpoche that was the Dalai Lama's regent and first Guru is the 5th Reting Rinpoche. After he was accused and tortured to death, the Chinese invaded Tibet and they recognized their own Reting Rinpoche (the 6th). Some historical accounts (on the Dalai Lama's camp) would say that China's 6th Reting Rinpoche was born before the 5th died, so it is not possible that the Chinese one is the right Reting Rinpoche. The 6th one has since passed away and has reincarnated into the 7th now. there is also a website that claims to be created by the real 6th Reting Rinpoche but it only contains anti Dorje Shugden propaganda and no real teachings.

Obviously it is not possible to ban Lamas from reincarnating and CTA is just too stubborn to admit that they were wrong to do so and unban the rest of the lamas. Tulku Dragpa Gyaltsen will only come back with more reincarnations that are way beyond any control from the CTA.

vajratruth

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Re: Beijing’s Tibet lama choice enters politics
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2013, 08:41:42 AM »
Beijing seems to be in the process of constructing a substitute Lama-based  religious framework out of the Dalai Lama and CTA’s control. It is a system that the Tibetans have become used to over the centuries and therefore rather than force the people into a new system which they are not culturally accustomed to, the Chinese Government is smart to replicate a system with which to control the Tibetans.

However, China’s efforts would not have worked so well if the CTA had not at the same time provided China with the opportunity by the CTA’s sometimes malignant and sometimes negligent policies that has harmed the Tibetan Buddhist culture and systems. In creating schism within the their own monastic community with the politicizing of spiritual matters, banning of unpopular tulkus, interfering in sectarian matters, and even prohibiting religious practices they undermine the support system of the Tibetan society. China is increasingly filling up high-ranking and key positions in the Tibetan Buddhist hierarchy and whatever their objectives may be, their efforts will work in the longer run especially after the passing of the Dalai Lama and the vacuum left by His Holiness’s passing becomes filled by Chinese-approved lamas.

The CTA took their eyes off the ball and severely damaged the foundation of Tibetan society, especially with the Dorje Shugden ban. How can they ban a Buddhist deity that is being practiced by so many Tibetans and well-respected lamas without knowing that the repercussions would be dire.

DharmaDefender

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Re: Beijing’s Tibet lama choice enters politics
« Reply #3 on: January 30, 2013, 08:53:52 AM »
Hang on a second - vajratruth has a point there. Given that Beijing has selected the Panchen Lama, the Karmapa AND now Reting Rinpoche, it would seem they are making their way through the leadership of Tibetan Buddhism and having those within the tulku system be replaced with their own candidates. "Those within the tulku system" meaning people whose roles are not subject to elections e.g. the Gaden Tripas.

So what makes the Tibetans think that the Chinese WONT select their own Dalai Lama?

And is it just a matter of time before the Chinese select their own Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen? I mean, they already practise Dorje Shugden (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/all-articles/news/the-first-lama-that-china-sent-abroad/). Is it just a matter of time before they catch on that Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsens incarnation is very important, and that in banning his line of incarnations the Tibetans have left the field WIDE OPEN for the Chinese to step in and select their own?

And especially if the other high DS lamas accept that Chinese-approved incarnation as the valid recognition of Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen...hahaha that would be a feather in the Chinese governments cap

Big Uncle

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Re: Beijing’s Tibet lama choice enters politics
« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2013, 10:47:10 AM »
Hang on a second - vajratruth has a point there. Given that Beijing has selected the Panchen Lama, the Karmapa AND now Reting Rinpoche, it would seem they are making their way through the leadership of Tibetan Buddhism and having those within the tulku system be replaced with their own candidates. "Those within the tulku system" meaning people whose roles are not subject to elections e.g. the Gaden Tripas.

So what makes the Tibetans think that the Chinese WONT select their own Dalai Lama?

And is it just a matter of time before the Chinese select their own Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen? I mean, they already practise Dorje Shugden (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/all-articles/news/the-first-lama-that-china-sent-abroad/). Is it just a matter of time before they catch on that Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsens incarnation is very important, and that in banning his line of incarnations the Tibetans have left the field WIDE OPEN for the Chinese to step in and select their own?

And especially if the other high DS lamas accept that Chinese-approved incarnation as the valid recognition of Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen...hahaha that would be a feather in the Chinese governments cap


Dear Ensapa,
That's right. China right now is just waiting for the Dalai Lama to pass on. They are patient and they know that time will eventually come and they will definitely meddle with the Tibetan selection of a future incarnation of the Dalai Lama. I think the Chinese had started to exert their influence on the selection process in preparation for the real prize - the selection of a Chinese controlled Dalai Lama incarnation.

That is what the Chinese are hoping for all along and they will get their chance because the Dalai Lama is not young and he would eventually have to leave this body for a new one. Somehow, I know this fact is somehow related with the Dalai Lama is going all out with the ban because it has somehow made China promote Dorje Shugden even more. Anyway, I think that China is looking more into controlling the Dalai Lama incarnation for political reason than resurrecting Dorje Shugden's incarnation line which has little to no political implications.

Ensapa

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Re: Beijing’s Tibet lama choice enters politics
« Reply #5 on: January 31, 2013, 04:23:14 AM »
Hang on a second - vajratruth has a point there. Given that Beijing has selected the Panchen Lama, the Karmapa AND now Reting Rinpoche, it would seem they are making their way through the leadership of Tibetan Buddhism and having those within the tulku system be replaced with their own candidates. "Those within the tulku system" meaning people whose roles are not subject to elections e.g. the Gaden Tripas.

So what makes the Tibetans think that the Chinese WONT select their own Dalai Lama?

And is it just a matter of time before the Chinese select their own Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen? I mean, they already practise Dorje Shugden (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/all-articles/news/the-first-lama-that-china-sent-abroad/). Is it just a matter of time before they catch on that Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsens incarnation is very important, and that in banning his line of incarnations the Tibetans have left the field WIDE OPEN for the Chinese to step in and select their own?

And especially if the other high DS lamas accept that Chinese-approved incarnation as the valid recognition of Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen...hahaha that would be a feather in the Chinese governments cap


Dear Ensapa,
That's right. China right now is just waiting for the Dalai Lama to pass on. They are patient and they know that time will eventually come and they will definitely meddle with the Tibetan selection of a future incarnation of the Dalai Lama. I think the Chinese had started to exert their influence on the selection process in preparation for the real prize - the selection of a Chinese controlled Dalai Lama incarnation.

That is what the Chinese are hoping for all along and they will get their chance because the Dalai Lama is not young and he would eventually have to leave this body for a new one. Somehow, I know this fact is somehow related with the Dalai Lama is going all out with the ban because it has somehow made China promote Dorje Shugden even more. Anyway, I think that China is looking more into controlling the Dalai Lama incarnation for political reason than resurrecting Dorje Shugden's incarnation line which has little to no political implications.


If Tulku Dragpa Gyaltsen was resurrected by China, they would have someone who is as powerful as the Dalai Lama to control the Tibetans. Remember that during the 5th Dalai Lama's time, Tulku Dragpa Gyaltsen was his equal, until to the point where Tulku Dragpa Gyaltsen was considered as a candidate for the Dalai Lama's position. Thus, it would be interesting if China resurrects the Dragpa Gyaltsen line and promotes him as the Dalai Lama's equal in Tibet. What is more interesting is how the CTA would react to this (well their reactions dont matter anyway, and neither can they make any difference at all in any way) and probably it would distract everyone away from the Dalai Lama...

WisdomBeing

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Re: Beijing’s Tibet lama choice enters politics
« Reply #6 on: January 31, 2013, 11:37:01 AM »
I am curious - now there is a 7th Reting Rinpoche but i didn't find news of the death of the 6th Reting Rinpoche.

According to wikipedia, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reting_Rinpoche, there were two claimants to the position of 6th Reting Rinpoche, one of whom has since died. What happened to the other one? He is apparently in India? Also on the website http://www.reting.org/lineage.html, it only shows the lineage up to the 5th Reting, which implies that the 6th Reting who wrote that truly offensive letter about Dorje Shugden (http://www.reting.org/openletter.html) is still around? From the tone of his letter, he seems to be trying to ingratiate himself with the Dalai Lama by criticising Dorje Shugden to gain acceptance.

And how does being anti-Shugden gel with the Chinese-endorsed 7th Reting Rinpoche? Would Sonam Phuntsok endorse Dorje Shugden now? Surely a Chinese-endorsed lama would be pro-Shugden (since it is anti-Dalai Lama). Anyone shed any light on this?
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Ensapa

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Re: Beijing’s Tibet lama choice enters politics
« Reply #7 on: January 31, 2013, 11:45:18 AM »
I am curious - now there is a 7th Reting Rinpoche but i didn't find news of the death of the 6th Reting Rinpoche.

According to wikipedia, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reting_Rinpoche, there were two claimants to the position of 6th Reting Rinpoche, one of whom has since died. What happened to the other one? He is apparently in India? Also on the website http://www.reting.org/lineage.html, it only shows the lineage up to the 5th Reting, which implies that the 6th Reting who wrote that truly offensive letter about Dorje Shugden (http://www.reting.org/openletter.html) is still around? From the tone of his letter, he seems to be trying to ingratiate himself with the Dalai Lama by criticising Dorje Shugden to gain acceptance.

And how does being anti-Shugden gel with the Chinese-endorsed 7th Reting Rinpoche? Would Sonam Phuntsok endorse Dorje Shugden now? Surely a Chinese-endorsed lama would be pro-Shugden (since it is anti-Dalai Lama). Anyone shed any light on this?


One thing for sure is that the website reting.org was not made by the real Reting Rinpoche as it does not have any Dharma at all. Also, information on that website can be easily googled on the net or can be easily formulated after reading many books on Tibet's history. I do not believe at all that the website was done by the real Reting Rinpoche but probably by someone infected with the crusader syndrome and wanted to use Reting Rinpoche's name to smear Dorje Shugden...or it could be a crazy person who genuinely thinks he or she is Reting Rinpoche's reincarnation. The last and only mention of Reting Rinpoche can be found in the book Buddha's not Smiling, where Reting Rinpoche is supposedly keeping a very low profile in india/nepal and told the Sharmapa and Thaye Dorje that if they needed his help, he would be happy to lend it.

WisdomBeing

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Re: Beijing’s Tibet lama choice enters politics
« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2013, 11:50:52 AM »
Ensapa, that is interesting news - that Reting Rinpoche is hiding out in India. After all, if he was banned by the Dalai Lama, i guess that's a good reason to hold a low profile. I'm curious whether he IS still alive though or the Chinese were just too impatient and thought what the heck, just enthrone the 7th Reting Rinpoche!!!! LOL
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Ensapa

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Re: Beijing’s Tibet lama choice enters politics
« Reply #9 on: February 01, 2013, 04:21:37 AM »
Ensapa, that is interesting news - that Reting Rinpoche is hiding out in India. After all, if he was banned by the Dalai Lama, i guess that's a good reason to hold a low profile. I'm curious whether he IS still alive though or the Chinese were just too impatient and thought what the heck, just enthrone the 7th Reting Rinpoche!!!! LOL

Similar to the karmapa issue, there were 2 6th Reting Rinpoches. As soon as China took over Tibet, they recognized their own Reting Rinpoche. This Reting Rinpoche -- as you have guessed it, is not recognized by the CTA or the Dalai Lama as they think  that this Reting Rinpoche was born before the previous one died. China's Reting Rinpoche has since passed on and now his reincarnation is back -- it is to show that they do not need the Dalai Lama to recognize incarnations and they can do it perfectly well with the Golden Urn that was probably blessed and consecrated by none other by Chankya Rolpa Dorje. My guess is, the 6th reincarnation emanated another one in India/Nepal and he has to lay low, while the other leads the Tibetans in Tibet.

Tenzin Gyatso

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Re: Beijing’s Tibet lama choice enters politics
« Reply #10 on: February 01, 2013, 09:57:07 AM »
Ensapa,

An urn is used for storing ashes of dead people. Why choose a high incarnation from an urn. You simply drop in the names and pull out the 'right' one? That sounds fishy wouldn't you say. China is atheist and does not believe in Buddhas. So their urn 'divining' methods highlights their contradictions and hypocrisy.

No lama recognized by China will ever have acceptance by the Tibetans. Panchen Lama today is still not accepted nor will ever be. Only HHDL has the final say and that is really the truth we have to accept.

 :)

honeydakini

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Re: Beijing’s Tibet lama choice enters politics
« Reply #11 on: February 01, 2013, 03:35:30 PM »
The politics and internal battles arising out of Buddhism is sad to see but perhaps, if we look for a glimmer of hope, we might see this as another way for the buddhas to manifest in more ways, to reach more people.

Who says there can't be more than one Reting Rinpoche? More than one Karmapa? Panchen Lama? Domo Geshe Rinpoche? Is it really so bad to have more spiritual leaders to inspire faith in people?

Anyway, my lama has always told me that the recognition and enthrone is only the first step. It is more important these days to regard the actions and teachings of the recognized incarnations, and this also depends heavily on the samaya of practitioners in the world today. If we are practising well and sincerely, then we should have no anxiety about who the real lama is or not. We should believe that if we are truly practicing well, we will always be able to meet with the right teachers again.


Ensapa

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Re: Beijing’s Tibet lama choice enters politics
« Reply #12 on: February 02, 2013, 02:54:21 AM »
Ensapa,

An urn is used for storing ashes of dead people. Why choose a high incarnation from an urn. You simply drop in the names and pull out the 'right' one? That sounds fishy wouldn't you say. China is atheist and does not believe in Buddhas. So their urn 'divining' methods highlights their contradictions and hypocrisy.

No lama recognized by China will ever have acceptance by the Tibetans. Panchen Lama today is still not accepted nor will ever be. Only HHDL has the final say and that is really the truth we have to accept.

 :)

Urn here is just a container. Do you know that there are methods for divinations? Even the Dalai Lama uses the tsampa balls method where he throws 3 tsampa balls into a container. That sounds so much like the Golden Urn. In addition to that, I have also heard of various urns that are highly consecrated that belong to various high lamas. Are you saying that those containers blessed by high Lamas should be used for containing the ashes of the dead, and that the Lamas doing divination are fishy if they use that method to do divination?

I'm sorry, but I dont believe that the Dalai Lama must approve the reincarnations of each and every Lama in the world. The Dalai Lama can only recognize Lamas that are beneficial to the Tibetans in Dharamsala  and also the ones that agree with the CTA, while Lamas that do not agree with CTA will just reincarnate elsewhere. Jetsun Khalka does not need the Dalai Lama's permission to reincarnate. Neither did Domo Geshe Rinpoche or Kundeling Rinpoche. It's sad that the Dalai Lama recognized a stand in Domo Geshe Rinpoche and Kundeling Rinpoche for political purposes while the authentic ones are being suppressed.