Author Topic: ATTN FPMT MEMBERS & OTHER PRO-BAN PEOPLE  (Read 8159 times)

psylotripitaka

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ATTN FPMT MEMBERS & OTHER PRO-BAN PEOPLE
« on: January 25, 2014, 09:49:53 AM »
Dear Friends,

I come to you from the heart with deep concern for the harmony of our international Buddhist community and the reputation of the holy BuddhaDharma in this world. I have read many things from both sides of the ban on Dorje Shugden practice and I would like to say that regardless of what has been elaborately explained by the Dalai Lama, Lama Zopa, the CTA and others, the various histories of Dorje Shugden - who he is or what he has or has not done -are actually all completely irrelevant to the situation at hand. Completely!

Common sense see's this: The ban is not about the Protector at all, it is only about religious and human rights abuses that are extensively documented and therefore undeniable facts. You know in your hearts - though you may want to ignore the truth - that harming others is inappropriate. I implore each of you to look very closely at how much suffering has come from the ban, and at the very least please follow in the footsteps of Buddha Shakyamuni and be gentle with living beings, your Mothers, life is hard enough without you doing things to make it worse.

Though you follow the advice to avoid the practice, please be kind to Dorje Shugden practitioners and encourage everyone to be good to each other. There is a bumper sticker I see all the time that has symbols from many different faiths. The symbols spell the word: coexist. Regardless of what anybody practices, you know in your heart that everybody deserves to be treated with respect and dignity. If we cannot do this simple thing, we should feel ashamed of ourselves and start trying harder to cultivate the universal goodness Buddha taught us. I disagree with fundamentalist Christian extremists, but I am still kind to them and help them in their life as best I can. My heart of universal goodness demands this of me!

You are free to encourage people not to practice Dorje Shugden, but please, have a heart and do what you can to encourage the Dalai Lama and Lama Zopa to tell people to stop harming Dorje Shugden practitioners, especially within the Tibetan community. Please look at what is happening and take compassionate action. Please do not turn a blind eye to the immense suffering your Mothers are experiencing from this ban. Enough is enough, please help nurture the vibration of universal goodness. Write to the Dalai Lama and urge him to do the same. Of course we want the ban to be lifted because those simple words from a person whose speech has such influence will end needless disharmony. But alas, I am not asking you to debate the Dalai Lama or ask him to lift the ban. I am specifically begging you to see reason and take proactive steps to get the Dalai Lama to say these simple words to the masses:

"PLEASE DO NOT HARM DORJE SHUGDEN PRACTITIONERS. THOUGH WE DO NOT SHARE IN THEIR PRACTICE, PLEASE BE KIND TO THEM, HELP THEM WITH THE NECESSITIES OF LIFE. THIS IS WHAT LORD BUDDHA TAUGHT US TO DO SO WE MUST DO THIS"

Thank you for your kind hearts,
psylotripitaka





dsiluvu

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Re: ATTN FPMT MEMBERS & OTHER PRO-BAN PEOPLE
« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2014, 11:56:06 AM »
Thank you Psylo for writing so compassionately to FPMT.

It is true what is said in the letter we as humans, need to respect one another and co-exist despite our differences in faith. Because if we condemn Dorje Shugden practitioners and create disharmony and even start hurting them, really how are we Buddhist any different from those who are racist, those terrorist, extremist and all those who kill in the name of their religion? It is just the same as condemning the Christian faith or the Muslim faith... the attitude and mindset of such duality is the same. How can someone who talks about compassion so much, the Dalai Lama, not speak up and request his own people to be harmonious and show kindness to their own people?

It is no longer about religion, it is about human ethics and kindness that has nothing to do about religion but everything to do about humanity. This simply just isn't right.

His Holiness and Lama Zopa's influence can definitely help make this world a better place. So why not use the teachings of compassion and kindness here at this very situation that is tearing the hearts of many who are suffering from this ban. At least please discourage Tibetans who a pro Dalai Lama and anti DS to not harm. It doesn't matter who is right or wrong, in the end violence is violence and I do not see how in all sanity this is justifiable at all. If nothing put these great influential teachers is said about the violence, it is equal to saying they support and condone to such violence.

I would include this link as well Psylo http://www.dorjeshugden.com/all-articles/the-controversy/cta-creates-violence-again/

I would also like to ask... If Dorje Shugden is so terribly bad, and evil, then why would someone whose status is equal to HHDL, the Panchen Lama even bothered to compose a prayer to Dorje Shugden? See the Panchen Lama's prayer and vision here... http://www.dorjeshugden.com/all-articles/dharma-readings/10th-panchen-rinpoche-announces-visions-of-dorje-shugden/ 
Dare we now say His Holiness the Panchen Lama is wrong too?

I do not know anyone who is well verse in Tibetan Buddhism who do not know the Panchen Lama who is by right the next in line to lead Tibetans in the absence of the Dalai Lama. No Tibetan dares to refute the Panchen Lama. He is equal to the Dalai Lama.

kris

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Re: ATTN FPMT MEMBERS & OTHER PRO-BAN PEOPLE
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2014, 03:59:37 PM »
Thank you Pyslo for pointing out the obvious.

HH Dalai Lama has been promoting peace, compassion and tolerance towards all different religions, and His famous quote: "Our prime purpose in this life is to help others. And if you can't help them, at least don't hurt them."

I am sure Buddhism has some teachings which do not go 100% with Christianity or Islam, but HH Dalai Lama didn't order them to be oppressed. And this should go the same to Dorje Shugden practice. HH Dalai Lama may encourage others not to practice Dorje Shugden, but CTA and his entourage should not oppress Dorje Shugden practitioners, and definitely not denying them their basic necessities!

This is year 2014, and we all need to be kind to each other already...

DharmaSpace

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Re: ATTN FPMT MEMBERS & OTHER PRO-BAN PEOPLE
« Reply #3 on: February 03, 2014, 12:44:02 PM »
It is basic human rights, not to oppress people and also.

If we do not have compassion then how is Buddhism different from other faiths, who the moment you criticise or comment about them then they will threaten to harm you and hurt you. How is harming others spiritual? This is incorrect concept of what spirituality is.   

We buddhists are very clever to say others happiness is our happiness, well now is the time to prove it.

 

Kim Hyun Jae

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Re: ATTN FPMT MEMBERS & OTHER PRO-BAN PEOPLE
« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2014, 03:01:24 AM »
I agree with Psylo. We need to respect religious freedom and human rights of those who practice whatever else that they wish to. The ban on Dorje Shugden only highlights the practice and drive those who are discriminated into stronger determination to be more successful in their endeavors.



yontenjamyang

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Re: ATTN FPMT MEMBERS & OTHER PRO-BAN PEOPLE
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2014, 05:21:18 AM »
I agree.

What can be more logical than facts. Forget for a moment all the historical facts and arguments for it is rather difficult to be accepted by non practitioners. What we can see presently is the truth. That is Shugden practitioners are being persecuted. Lets' urge each other to practice loving kindness and compassion to our fellow mother sentient beings. We can be kind to other humans and even animals but not Shugdenites. Where is the logic and the compassion, even if you are not practicing and even you think he is negative.

Just be kind. That is the least of the Dharma we can practice.

icy

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Re: ATTN FPMT MEMBERS & OTHER PRO-BAN PEOPLE
« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2014, 10:07:39 PM »
You will be surprised what Asian Tribute writes about "Religious Intolerance".  Given that the country is India, and these pro-ban people who are living in India, they must abide to Indian laws, they should be prosecuted for religious intolerance regardless of who they are.


"Freedom of religion in the Indian subcontinent is exemplified by the reign of King Piyadasi (Asoka) (304 BC to 232 BC). One of King Asoka's main concerns was to reform governmental institutes and exercise moral principles in his attempt to create a just and humane society. Later he promoted the principles of Buddhism, and the creation of a just, understanding and fair society to be held as an important principle for ancient rulers.

What he probably desired was for his Kingdom to be at peace with itself and with others. In other words, a state of social equilibrium and religious harmony to exist within and without.

In sociology, a system is said to be in social equilibrium when there is a dynamic working balance among its interdependent parts. In this context one could argue that religion and religious tolerance may be considered key components in a society, and that religious intolerance could beget social inequillibrium, as much as social inequillibrium could be brought about by misuse of religious tolerance.

Religious intolerance rather is when a group (e.g., a society, religious group, non-religious group) specifically refuses to tolerate practices, persons or beliefs on religious grounds, and demonstrates intolerance of practice, which could also be through physical activism.

Within those countries that openly advocate religious tolerance there remain debates as to the limits of tolerance. Some individuals and religious groups, for example, retain beliefs or practices which involve acts contrary to established law. This cannot be tolerated whatever type of perceived intolerance is there in a country. The law of the land must prevail over any form of protest, either religion oriented, economic oriented or political oriented. If the law is perceived to be insufficient to meet particular situations that create social inequillibrum, then the law has to be changed first so that protests can be within the law.

Those violating the law must then be punished irrespective of who they are."


fruven

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Re: ATTN FPMT MEMBERS & OTHER PRO-BAN PEOPLE
« Reply #7 on: February 09, 2014, 03:15:21 PM »
Dear Friends,

I come to you from the heart with deep concern for the harmony of our international Buddhist community and the reputation of the holy BuddhaDharma in this world. I have read many things from both sides of the ban on Dorje Shugden practice and I would like to say that regardless of what has been elaborately explained by the Dalai Lama, Lama Zopa, the CTA and others, the various histories of Dorje Shugden - who he is or what he has or has not done -are actually all completely irrelevant to the situation at hand. Completely!

Common sense see's this: The ban is not about the Protector at all, it is only about religious and human rights abuses that are extensively documented and therefore undeniable facts. You know in your hearts - though you may want to ignore the truth - that harming others is inappropriate. I implore each of you to look very closely at how much suffering has come from the ban, and at the very least please follow in the footsteps of Buddha Shakyamuni and be gentle with living beings, your Mothers, life is hard enough without you doing things to make it worse.

Though you follow the advice to avoid the practice, please be kind to Dorje Shugden practitioners and encourage everyone to be good to each other. There is a bumper sticker I see all the time that has symbols from many different faiths. The symbols spell the word: coexist. Regardless of what anybody practices, you know in your heart that everybody deserves to be treated with respect and dignity. If we cannot do this simple thing, we should feel ashamed of ourselves and start trying harder to cultivate the universal goodness Buddha taught us. I disagree with fundamentalist Christian extremists, but I am still kind to them and help them in their life as best I can. My heart of universal goodness demands this of me!

You are free to encourage people not to practice Dorje Shugden, but please, have a heart and do what you can to encourage the Dalai Lama and Lama Zopa to tell people to stop harming Dorje Shugden practitioners, especially within the Tibetan community. Please look at what is happening and take compassionate action. Please do not turn a blind eye to the immense suffering your Mothers are experiencing from this ban. Enough is enough, please help nurture the vibration of universal goodness. Write to the Dalai Lama and urge him to do the same. Of course we want the ban to be lifted because those simple words from a person whose speech has such influence will end needless disharmony. But alas, I am not asking you to debate the Dalai Lama or ask him to lift the ban. I am specifically begging you to see reason and take proactive steps to get the Dalai Lama to say these simple words to the masses:

"PLEASE DO NOT HARM DORJE SHUGDEN PRACTITIONERS. THOUGH WE DO NOT SHARE IN THEIR PRACTICE, PLEASE BE KIND TO THEM, HELP THEM WITH THE NECESSITIES OF LIFE. THIS IS WHAT LORD BUDDHA TAUGHT US TO DO SO WE MUST DO THIS"

Thank you for your kind hearts,
psylotripitaka


Thanks for expression your voice. Obviously the CTA hasn't get it, HH Dalai Lama message of peace and harmony to others. It is within CTA control not to incite violence and harming Dorje Shugden practitioners. Obviously they 'know' that they can continue what they have been doing and get away. Therefore anyone who wish to voice their disapproval of violence against Dorje Shugden practitioners should bring this issue to CTA because CTA has the power to act. It is totally within their control to make peace or make war. At this moment CTA is using funds which could be put to better use to increase the effort of supporting the ban. Why do CTA need to support the ban? Is it even necessarily their 'job' to enforce the ban? What about public safety, education, and social services? Aren't those more important??!! CTA is so scared of this Dorje Shugden 'spirit' that they would even isolate Dorje Shugden practitioners from other Tibetans and warn Tibetans not to be associated with Dorje Shudgen.

dsiluvu

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Re: ATTN FPMT MEMBERS & OTHER PRO-BAN PEOPLE
« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2014, 07:20:43 AM »
Yes Fruven,

Good point you got there... but the thing is you must realise who started the implementation of this idea of a Ban on Dorje Shugden? It is non-other than His Holiness himself. Forgive me to put the "blame" on His Holiness, but for this a fact and the one who did this, will the one who can also stop this! All it takes is for His Holiness to tell everyone including the CTA to stop the Ban, to stop harming and to stop causing discrimination.

The CTA cannot implement anything if it was not approved by His Holiness, right up untill today. Which means His Holiness is fully aware of that separation wall between Gaden and Shar Gaden, that Tibetan Shugden children are deprived of entering or mixing with children from a "Tibetan" public school, Shugden practitioners are not allowed to purchase items in certain shops and they are not even welcome in certain monasteries and centres. People and sangha have been ostracised and being threatened from their own homes. All this I am very certain His Holiness is fully aware off but has not done anything or say anything to stop these people to continue to execute such bigotry behaviours.

I am sure that if His Holiness were to firmly announce not to harm Shugden practitioners and to give the same respect to them as they would to others with different faith... I think the CTA will stop their pro-ban campaign! 

prodorjeshugden

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Re: ATTN FPMT MEMBERS & OTHER PRO-BAN PEOPLE
« Reply #9 on: February 15, 2017, 02:24:43 PM »
Yes indeed a lot of suffering has came due to the Ban. Hundreds of families were split apart due to the ban, once close relatives become deadly enemies. Besides splitting families the ban has also caused hundreds upon hundreds of people monks and laypeople to be assaulted and abused by huge mobs of anti Shugden people, the people that are hurt did not commit any form of heinous crime they are only abused because they chose to practice Dorje Shugden.
Although the CTA claims that Dorje Shugden is a evil spirit, they don't have any evidence to prove it. Still with the lack of evidence the ban still continues until today.

I really hope that the CTA will stop all forms of abuse and violence and bring down the ban, because the Buddha's never encouraged abuse and violence instead the Teachings speak about harmony and peace.

ShugdenProtector

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Re: ATTN FPMT MEMBERS & OTHER PRO-BAN PEOPLE
« Reply #10 on: February 15, 2017, 09:08:02 PM »
But alas, I am not asking you to debate the Dalai Lama or ask him to lift the ban. I am specifically begging you to see reason and take proactive steps to get the Dalai Lama to say these simple words to the masses:

"PLEASE DO NOT HARM DORJE SHUGDEN PRACTITIONERS. THOUGH WE DO NOT SHARE IN THEIR PRACTICE, PLEASE BE KIND TO THEM, HELP THEM WITH THE NECESSITIES OF LIFE. THIS IS WHAT LORD BUDDHA TAUGHT US TO DO SO WE MUST DO THIS"

Thank you for your kind hearts,
psylotripitaka


This was commented in 2014, it is now 2017 and the Dalai Lama still has NOT STOP talking about Dorje Shugden negatively. Looking at the situation, I really doubt he will ever stop or advice people to stop all their harmful ways towrads Shugden. We can forget about him reversing the ban because that would just undermine everything he has done against Dorje Shugden, so that is not possible.

The only way this is going to blow over, and Shugden people stop being abused is that Dorje Shugden practice becomes so huge and so wide spread all over, especially in countries like China, that it becomes massively accepted as another spiritual practice, which it is. So much so that the Dalai Lama is forced to say nothing at all because if he does, it would ring even louder how bias, intolerant he is towards the Shugden people and what a huge breach of human rights' religious freedom, which is the very same things the Tibetans are fighting and accusing China of doing. And even if the Dalai Lama did say anything, it becomes so insignificant by then, no one would listen. This is probably the only logical outcome I foresee happening.

Harold Musetescu

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Re: ATTN FPMT MEMBERS & OTHER PRO-BAN PEOPLE
« Reply #11 on: February 16, 2017, 08:00:09 PM »
I wish that all of us would stop blaming the CTA.

YES, stop blaming the CTA.

They do what the Dalai Lama TELLS THEM TO DO.

The Dalai Lama has NEVER told the CTA to stop.

Wake up, the CTA is not our enemy it is the Dalai Lama.

Matibhadra

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Re: ATTN FPMT MEMBERS & OTHER PRO-BAN PEOPLE
« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2017, 01:18:55 AM »
Quote
I wish that all of us would stop blaming the CTA.
YES, stop blaming the CTA.
They do what the Dalai Lama TELLS THEM TO DO.
The Dalai Lama has NEVER told the CTA to stop.
Wake up, the CTA is not our enemy it is the Dalai Lama.

Blaming the CTA for the evil dalie's crimes is no mere mistake; rather, it is an intentional lie and serves a specific agenda, which is to cover and protect the actual criminal.

Harold Musetescu

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Re: ATTN FPMT MEMBERS & OTHER PRO-BAN PEOPLE
« Reply #13 on: February 17, 2017, 01:32:33 AM »
Hello Matibhadra

The New Kadampa has had no problem laying all the blame at the feet of the Dalai Lama.

They never declared, "CTA STOP LYING" they said "DALAI LAMA STOP LYING".

Yet there are others in the Dorje Shugden family that seem to lay all the blame at the feet of the CTA.

Then they cry out to the Dalai Lama to stop the CTA and "Lift the Ban".

This pro Dalai Lama and anti CTA group has a strong following but it lacks in my opinion simple logic.

It was the Dalai Lama and not the CTA that started this BAN and not the other way around.

It was and is the Dalai Lama that is continuing this BAN and the CTA does what the Dalai Lama tells them to do.

This pro Dalai Lama, anti CTA group is not realizing the truth that Geshe Kelsang Geshe and his New Kadampa have realized.

"Stop the Dalai Lama and you stop the CTA".


Matibhadra

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Re: ATTN FPMT MEMBERS & OTHER PRO-BAN PEOPLE
« Reply #14 on: February 17, 2017, 03:51:52 AM »
Hi Harold,

The weird condition you have just described is probably a by-product of old Tibet's Dalai Lama-centered theocratic society, where, just like in Andersen's tale, everyone will say that the god-king is beautifully clothed even though everyone can see that he is thoroughly naked.

The idea that a Dalai Lama is necessarily “Chenrezig” was concocted by theocratic politicians in order to consolidate an absolutistic power, analogous to the Christian Catholic idea of the infallibility of the pope, and many other equivalent schemes devised by different religions aspiring political dominance.

The 7th Dalai Lama had no interest in power politics, and he served Buddhism as probably no other did, but the current, fake Dalai Lama, who lies even about his own birth in a Chinese-speaking Muslim family and claims that his name was “Lhamo Dondrub”, is an insatiable, obsessive power-hungry character.

Therefore, he abuses his powers in order to achieve absolute control of Tibetans, thus mixing politics with religion in a most unscrupulous way and inflicting unspeakable suffering on his own people, all the while slavishly serving the greedy, predatory interests of his foreign Buddhist-hating billionaire sponsors.

Still, many subjects will keep praising the new clothes of the naked “god-king”.