Author Topic: Who went to Tushita Heaven to receive the empowerment from Dorje Shugden?  (Read 27530 times)

WisdomBeing

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2096
    • Add me to your facebook!
Well, I checked in Music Delighting the Ocean of Protectors by Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche... Trijang Rinpoche wrote his text as a commentary to the praise of Dorje Shugden that was composed by Dagpo Kelsang Khedrub. It is in the introduction....


"There is a verse of praise of his three secrets by way of expressing his realization, known by its first words of 'Pagme Kel Ngon', composed by Dagpo Kelsang Khedrub with some slight amendments by he who is in essence, all? pervasive Heruka, Vajradhara Pabongka Dechen Nyingpo."


Big Uncle,

Dagpo Kelsang Khedrub may have composed that praise but not necessarily have gone to Tushita?

This seems to be quite a conundrum :)

Tenzin Sungrab - thank you for posting the picture of the current incarnation of Dagpo Rinpoche. How kind he looks.
Kate Walker - a wannabe wisdom Being

VS

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 73
My friend shared with me the following :

The Great Lamrim master, Dagpo Dorje Chang, went into meditation, left His body and travelled to the throne / place of Maitreya buddha. In the great assembly in Maitreya palace, Dagpo Dorje Chang folded His hands and requested Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen directly to please expound the mystical tantra, the mandala, the prayer, the lineage and the teachings about the dharma Proctector Dorje Shugden field.

In the text, Trijang Rinpoche said from the heart of Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen, rainbow lights eminated out and hit Lama Tsongkhapa's heart. Lama Tsongkhapa from His heart again lights came out and hit Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen's heart. Finally the last of the lights from Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen heart went out and went under Lama Tsongkhapa's throne.

From under Lama Tsongkhapa's throne, the complete mandala for the first time ever of Dorje Shugden, the 5 families, the 32 entourage, Karche Marpo appeared directly in front of the entourage, in front of the whole assembly.

And then Dagpo Dorje Chang had a vision, He saw the whole entourage, He saw who they are, instantly He received the teachings, the lineage, oral transmission, the instructions immediately. Then the whole mandala again dissolved back under Lama Tsongkhapa's throne, to show you who’s Protector they are! ;)


honeydakini

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 401
I have also heard from the Sangha the following (this corresponds with that TS has already found out from the monks in Shar Gaden):

Pabongka Rinpoche had two Gurus:
1) Tagphu Padmavajra
2) Dagpo Lama Rinpoche

His root Guru was Tagphu Padmavajra, who was the one who went to Tushita Heaven and received the teachings/empowerment from Dorje Shugden.

The current incarnation of Dagpo Rinpoche resides in France; am not sure where Tagphu Padmavajra's incarnation is but probably in Tibet.

thor

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1431
Oh dear...now I really have got a headache too? Are they the same person but spelt differently or not the same? Someone help us here. Please.

It was Tagphu Pemavajra

Crazycloud
Tagphu Pemavajra is the same as Tagphu Padmavajra? just want to confirm as it's quite confusing.

thanks


(With the suspicion that I am being mocked, but unable to ignore a possibly sincere question.....)

yes, the same. Different spellings.

Is it also Tagphu Pemavajra who taught Je Pabongka the Lamrim at Dagpo monastery? Or someone else?

hope rainbow

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 947
According to Dorje Shugden History by Trinley Kelsang:
Kelsang Tenzin passed the lineage to Dagpo Kelsang Kedrub who passed it on to Dagpo Jampel Lundrub, who then passed it on to Pabongka Rinpoche.

Therefore, Dagpo Jampel Lundrub is Pabongka Rinpoche's guru and NOT Dagpo Kelsang Kedrub.

crazycloud

  • Guest

Big Uncle,

Dagpo Kelsang Khedrub may have composed that praise but not necessarily have gone to Tushita?

This seems to be quite a conundrum :)

Tenzin Sungrab - thank you for posting the picture of the current incarnation of Dagpo Rinpoche. How kind he looks.

this is correct

crazycloud

  • Guest
My friend shared with me the following :

The Great Lamrim master, Dagpo Dorje Chang, went into meditation, left His body and travelled to the throne / place of Maitreya buddha....

This is incorrect. This story relates the experiences of Tagphu Pemavajra, not Dagpo Rinpoche.

Helena

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 653
    • Email
CC, with no disrespect - but can you please site a source from where all your info is coming from? Then we are also able to read more about it?

Although I do appreciate you answering the questions, but would value it even more if there were sources from which you are extracting these info from.

I am sure as knowledgeable as you are, there are valid sources which will back up your statements.

It will benefit everyone a great deal if you could please share them.

Thanking you in advance.
Helena

crazycloud

  • Guest
CC, with no disrespect - but can you please site a source from where all your info is coming from? Then we are also able to read more about it?

Although I do appreciate you answering the questions, but would value it even more if there were sources from which you are extracting these info from.

I am sure as knowledgeable as you are, there are valid sources which will back up your statements.

It will benefit everyone a great deal if you could please share them.

Thanking you in advance.

In the first post in the thread Kate properly cites Gurudeva Rinpoche (2001). Kyabje Zong Rinpoche also explained this in his teachings while in Canada in 1984.  Tenzin Sungrab also gave good, if anecdotal evidence earlier in the thread. Also reason can help as this practice was passed directly to Pabongka Rinpoche and Dagpo Kelsang Kedrub was not a guru of Je Pabongka while Tagphu Pemavajra was. Also see Trinley Kelsang's blog for accurate info on this topic.


WisdomBeing

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2096
    • Add me to your facebook!
Re: Who went to Tushita Heaven to receive the empowerment from Dorje Shugden?
« Reply #24 on: September 04, 2010, 02:14:29 PM »
Just to add to this topic:

http://truthaboutshugden.wordpress.com/2009/02/14/ribur-rinpoche-on-je-pabongka/

His root guru was Dagpo Lama Rinpoche Jampael Lhuendrub Gyatso, from Lhoka. He was Je Pabongka's Root Guru, Dagpo Bamcho definitely a bodhisattva, and Pabongka Rinpoche was his foremost disciple. He lived in a cave in Pasang and his main practice was bodhichitta; his main deity was Avalokiteshvara and he would recite 50,000 manis [the mantra, om mani padme hum] every night. When Kyabje Pabongka first met Dagpo Rinpoche at a tsog offering ceremony in Lhasa, he cried out of reverence from beginning to end.

The attached is a picture of Dagpo Lama Rinpoche Jampael Lhuendrub Gyatso.
(more info here too: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dagpo_Rinpoche)
Kate Walker - a wannabe wisdom Being

Helena

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 653
    • Email
Re: Who went to Tushita Heaven to receive the empowerment from Dorje Shugden?
« Reply #25 on: September 04, 2010, 02:28:04 PM »
Thank you so much, WB. So kind of you to help.

So, to re-confirm - the picture that you have just shared of Dagpo Lama Rinpoche Jampael Lhuendrub Gyatso - this is not the same Lama who went to Tushita Heaven to receive the empowerment of Dorje Shugden?

The one who went to Tushita Heaven is Tagphu Pema Vajra? Is this correct?

Can anyone confirm this?

Thank you very much.
Helena

Losang_Tenpa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 691
    • Email
Re: Who went to Tushita Heaven to receive the empowerment from Dorje Shugden?
« Reply #26 on: September 04, 2010, 04:02:50 PM »
Thank you so much, WB. So kind of you to help.

So, to re-confirm - the picture that you have just shared of Dagpo Lama Rinpoche Jampael Lhuendrub Gyatso - this is not the same Lama who went to Tushita Heaven to receive the empowerment of Dorje Shugden?

The one who went to Tushita Heaven is Tagphu Pema Vajra? Is this correct?

Can anyone confirm this?

Thank you very much.


You are correct. The picture of the Guru above in W.B.'s post is not the same as Tagpu Pema Vajra.

Here is a snip from the lineage picture. It lists Takpu Pema Vajra directly above Kyabje Pabongkha.


The Tibetan says: Homage to Drupchen Takpu Dorje Chang Padma Vajra.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2010, 04:09:02 PM by Tenzin Sungrab »

DSFriend

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 955
Re: Who went to Tushita Heaven to receive the empowerment from Dorje Shugden?
« Reply #27 on: September 04, 2010, 07:43:13 PM »
Thank you so much, WB. So kind of you to help.

So, to re-confirm - the picture that you have just shared of Dagpo Lama Rinpoche Jampael Lhuendrub Gyatso - this is not the same Lama who went to Tushita Heaven to receive the empowerment of Dorje Shugden?

The one who went to Tushita Heaven is Tagphu Pema Vajra? Is this correct?

Can anyone confirm this?

Thank you very much.





You are correct. The picture of the Guru above in W.B.'s post is not the same as Tagpu Pema Vajra.

Here is a snip from the lineage picture. It lists Takpu Pema Vajra directly above Kyabje Pabongkha.


The Tibetan says: Homage to Drupchen Takpu Dorje Chang Padma Vajra.


Dear Tenzin Sungrab
There has been quite a bit of uncertainties surrounding this very important topic of who went to Tushita to receive the teachings/empowerment. Do you by any chance has a higher resolution graphic? I was thinking it'll be invaluable to have a picture which can be downloaded and high enough quality to print out.

thank you very much TS

Losang_Tenpa

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 691
    • Email
Re: Who went to Tushita Heaven to receive the empowerment from Dorje Shugden?
« Reply #28 on: September 05, 2010, 04:47:14 AM »
The image can be found in the pictures thread. I just took out the portion of Kyabje Takpu Dorje Chang and Kyabje Pabongkha Dorje Chang.

It is a great picture and presents the lineage as it was received by Je Pabongkha.

thor

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1431
Re: Who went to Tushita Heaven to receive the empowerment from Dorje Shugden?
« Reply #29 on: September 05, 2010, 07:06:34 PM »

Dear Tenzin Sungrab
There has been quite a bit of uncertainties surrounding this very important topic of who went to Tushita to receive the teachings/empowerment. Do you by any chance has a higher resolution graphic? I was thinking it'll be invaluable to have a picture which can be downloaded and high enough quality to print out.

thank you very much TS

I find it kinda cool that Tagphu Pemavajra is always depicted as a yogi instead of in proper lama dress. I suppose that might be because he preferred to spend time in solitary retreats rather than in large institutions. When my lama first taught the Dorje Shugden lineage, i found it really odd that Dulzin Dragpa Gyeltsen had passed the lineage directly to Tagphu Pemavajra. When it was clarified that he had actually travelled to Tushita Heaven to receive the mind transmission directly, I was stunned. The lineage is so short, just a few generations of lamas apart, and how incredibly fortunate we are to be able to practice him. Just think - from Dulzin to Tagphu to Pabongka to Trijang to .... the blessings are greater with a shorter lineage.

Just as Asanga travelled to Tushita to receive teachings from Maitreya directly, thus starting the method lineage, I like to think that Tagphu Pemavajra has started a new lineage that will bring similar great benefit.