Author Topic: Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview  (Read 2953 times)

dsnowlion

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Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview
« on: August 02, 2018, 11:45:54 PM »
The Karmapa, head of the 900-year-old Karma Kagyu school of Tibetan Buddhism, a branch of one of the four main traditions of the religion, is now in talks with the Indian government over his return and may go back as soon as November, though the exact date of his return is still unclear, the lama said.

“In November of this year, there will be an important meeting of the heads of the major Tibetan Buddhist traditions in Dharamsala, India,” the Karmapa said.

Hmmm highly suspicious to at first not wanting to return to India and now he will return. The change of tune makes me wonder if Dharamsala, the evil Central Tibetan Administration did anything to threaten the Karmapa to return. If they did I wouldn't be surprised. Does anyone know and what do you good people think about this news?


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Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview

Tibetan Buddhist leader the Karmapa will return to India, ending a stay of just over a year in the United States where he has undergone medical exams, the senior religious figure said in an interview with RFA’s Tibetan Service on Monday.

The Karmapa, head of the 900-year-old Karma Kagyu school of Tibetan Buddhism, a branch of one of the four main traditions of the religion, is now in talks with the Indian government over his return and may go back as soon as November, though the exact date of his return is still unclear, the lama said.

“I have no doubt or question that my return to India is absolutely certain,” said the Karmapa, who escaped as a refugee from China to India at the end of 1999, and who has lived under conditions of restricted travel ever since.

“In November of this year, there will be an important meeting of the heads of the major Tibetan Buddhist traditions in Dharamsala, India,” the Karmapa said.

Tibet’s India-based exile government the Central Tibetan Administration and exiled spiritual leader the Dalai Lama, with whom the Karmapa is close, are expecting him to be present at the meeting, he said, adding, “Therefore, I must attend.”

Acknowledging public speculation over the reasons for his lengthy stay in the U.S., mainly in New York, and rumors that he might wish to travel to China to visit his parents, the Karmapa said that it has been his intention all along to go back to India.

“So I wanted to clarify these things by having constructive talks with the Indian government, and we are going ahead with discussions now. If things turn out well, I am ready to return,” he said.

“When I first arrived in India, I faced many difficulties, including accusations that I was a Chinese agent,” the Karmapa said, adding that his access to Indian authorities was for a long time limited to lower-level officials.

“But now we have an opportunity to meet with higher-level Indian leaders to explain my situation, which has made a huge difference.”

No major health concerns

Though medical exams have prolonged his stay in the U.S., checkups have revealed no serious threats to his health despite a history of high blood pressure and warnings from a doctor in Germany that something might be wrong with his throat, the Karmapa said.

“In America, I have had a thorough check of my throat in a hospital, and I was told that there are no major issues to be concerned about.”

“Apart from that, there are some possible indications of diabetes, and the doctors have advised a better diet. There is also a small issue with my heart, and I am still undergoing screening and testing,” he said.

“There are no major concerns about my health,” he said.

Karmapa Orgyen Trinley Dorje, born in Tibet in 1985, was identified by the Dalai Lama and other Tibetan religious leaders as an important “reincarnate” Buddhist teacher and was installed in his predecessors’ monastery in Tibet.

But Chinese authorities prevented him, he later said, from studying with the lamas he had hoped would be his mentors.

Avoiding detection by the officials assigned to monitor his movements, the Karmapa escaped in late 1999 and fled into exile in India where, before his move last year to the United States, he has lived under conditions of restricted travel for over 17 years.

Source: https://www.rfa.org/english/news/tibet/return-07302018142644.html

Harold Musetescu

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Re: Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview
« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2018, 12:34:20 PM »
The 17th Karmapa did public condemn the Gelugpa Sect for the slaughter of his Sect by the 5th Dalai Lama.

He did it via video at this year's Monlam in India.

It did not go down well with the Dalai Lama and his CTA.

Harold Musetescu

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Re: Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview
« Reply #2 on: August 03, 2018, 12:42:03 PM »
The article I wrote about it was posted on March 9, 2018 under the title "17th Karmapa Publicly Condemns
the Murderous 5th Dalai Lama".

The Dalai Lama and his CTA may fear that the 17th Karmapa is now becoming the "Enemy".

They fear they can no longer control him.

The Karmapa may also be asking the Indian Government their permission to return to one of his own Monasteries and not Gyuto which is under the Dalai Lama's total control.

Rowntree

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Re: Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview
« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2018, 09:38:02 AM »
Can we have some decent people who are really interested in the topic who will leave constructive comments instead of attention-grabbing and self-promotional "Look At Me" propaganda and pollute this forum? How come when you have said goodbye many times but continue to return and spread your self-promotional superior toxic here? Do you not have a life? Hmmm, obviously not. If you do, you would not leave so many self-made comments here. The forum moderator is very kind, compassionate and patient person to allow you to do this. You poor old thing, so sad that you have nowhere to go and no one who really loves you. Otherwise, you won't need to pretend you have clairvoyance and suggest weird ideas for attention. Perhaps you should practise some dharma to calm your mind so you can experience true happiness internally.

Harold Musetescu

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Re: Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2018, 10:04:09 AM »
 :o :o :o :o

Rowntree

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Re: Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview
« Reply #5 on: August 07, 2018, 11:43:11 AM »
The Karmapa, head of the 900-year-old Karma Kagyu school of Tibetan Buddhism, a branch of one of the four main traditions of the religion, is now in talks with the Indian government over his return and may go back as soon as November, though the exact date of his return is still unclear, the lama said.

“In November of this year, there will be an important meeting of the heads of the major Tibetan Buddhist traditions in Dharamsala, India,” the Karmapa said.

Hmmm highly suspicious to at first not wanting to return to India and now he will return. The change of tune makes me wonder if Dharamsala, the evil Central Tibetan Administration did anything to threaten the Karmapa to return. If they did I wouldn't be surprised. Does anyone know and what do you good people think about this news?

I thought he is not interested in politics? Why did he need to talk to India for his return if he longs for true spiritual practice? He can easily seek asylum in the US and enjoy full freedom to do what he wanted. Why even bother to speak with the Indian government? The Indian government may be collaborating with the CTA to threaten him since he has expressed how the CTA was using him for their own benefits.

Perhaps this Karmapa is compassionate and he is coming back for a bigger reason but politic will definitely play a role in it.

michaela

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Re: Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2018, 10:24:13 PM »
According to the article below, the Karmapa Ogyen Trinley Dorje is negotiating the terms of his return to India with the Indian government. On top of the agenda of conversation is whether or not Delhi still believes he is a Chinese spy, although 18 years have elapsed since the Karmapa fled his monastery in Tsurphu in Tibet in December-end 1999.

The Indian government has reached out to the Karmapa and is ready to offer it five acres of land in Delhi’s Dwarka area, near the international airport so that he can build his headquarters. The Karmapa is said to be hugely relieved at the Indian government’s offer of land.

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India once thought this monk was a Chinese spy. Now, Modi govt will welcome him back

An ageing Dalai Lama and China’s rapid expansion into South Asia has forced Delhi to sit up and make amends with the Karmapa Lama.

New Delhi: The Karmapa Lama, Ogyen Trinley Dorje, is negotiating the terms of his return to India with the government, although in principle he has decided to come back by November in deference to the wishes of the Tibetan spiritual leader, the Dalai Lama.

The 33-year-old Karmapa has been in the US for the past one year for medical treatment.

On top of the agenda of conversation is whether or not Delhi still believes he is a Chinese spy, although 18 years have elapsed since the Karmapa fled his monastery in Tsurphu in Tibet in December-end 1999. As a 14-year-old, he walked the difficult, snowy terrain to the Nepal border and reached Dharamsala in Himachal Pradesh about 10 days later on 5 January, 2000.

With the Dalai Lama now 83 years old and the Chinese government rapidly expanding its presence in India’s neighbourhood, the luxury of using the Tibetan community-in-exile as a so-called “card” against Beijing is fast diminishing.

Govt ready to offer land in Delhi

The government has finally decided to reach out to the Karmapa and is ready to offer it five acres of land in Delhi’s Dwarka area, near the international airport, so he can build his headquarters, official sources said.

The olive branch to the Karmapa is a significant step. As the spiritual leader of the 900-year-old Karma Kagyu tradition — Tibetan Buddhism has four sects, one of which is the Gelugpa, whose leader is the Dalai Lama — the Karmapa has lived the past 18 years in cramped accommodation at the foothills of Dharamsala, watched over by a security guard day and night.

Much of the last year has been spent in a Karma Kagyu centre in New Jersey, US, where he travelled for medical treatment.

The Karmapa is said to be hugely relieved at the Indian government’s offer of land, according to sources. Certainly, the land in Delhi won’t come cheap, even if it is heavily discounted.

The Karmapa confirmed his return to India

In an interview with the Tibetan service of Radio Free Asia (RFA) in Washington last week, the Karmapa confirmed he is returning to India to participate in a meeting called by the Dalai Lama for the spiritual leaders of all Tibetan Buddhism lineages.

“I have no doubt or question that my return to India is absolutely certain,” the Karmapa told RFA. “In November of this year, there will be an important meeting of the heads of the major Tibetan Buddhist traditions in Dharamsala, India. Therefore, I must attend.”

According to Amitabh Mathur, an adviser on Tibetan affairs with the government, who met the Karmapa over a private cup of tea at the Russian Tea Room in New York on his birthday in late June, “The Karmapa will return when the timing and circumstances of his return are finalised.”

‘No differences with the Dalai Lama’

Mathur pointed out that the Karmapa has always paid full respect to the Dalai Lama and treated him like an elder. He denied reports of estrangement between the Karmapa and the government, pointing out that the Karmapa could travel freely inside the country, including to Sikkim, and abroad.

In an interview with this reporter last year before he left for the US, the Karmapa had openly spoken about his unhappiness over the manner in which the Indian government and intelligence agencies had treated him these past several years, refusing to believe that he was the real leader of the Karma Kagyu sect.

At the time he had acknowledged concerns that stories of him, a 14-year-old traversing the difficult journey of his escape from a country like China, sounded fantastical.

But he had insisted that it was the pure, unvarnished truth. He pointed to the fact that none other than the Dalai Lama had blessed him and recognised him as the 17th Karmapa Lama, the inheritor of the Karma Kagyu legacy.

If India didn’t want him, he had pointed out in his interview with this reporter, then he may as well look for other options.

Hope on the horizon

In last week’s interview with RFA, the Karmapa said: “When I first arrived in India, I faced many difficulties, including accusations that I was a Chinese agent.”

“But now we have an opportunity to meet with higher-level Indian leaders to explain my situation, which has made a huge difference,” the Karmapa added, implying that it was the lower bureaucracy in Dharamsala and Delhi, which had made his life hell these past 18 years.

For example, the suspicion that he was a Chinese agent was supposedly confirmed some years ago when intelligence agencies found a suspiciously high amount of a variety of foreign currency with the Karmapa, amounting to a few crores of rupees.

The Karmapa tried to explain that it was his devotees who had given him these monies, as a measure of their love and affection, but to no avail.

Delhi’s change of heart, this past year, seems to be as much a result of the fact that it has very little idea and even fewer answers to the question of “After the Dalai Lama, who?”

Burying the past

With the Karmapa Lama potentially antagonised as well, the government understood that the future could become even darker. It was therefore necessary to overcome its own skepticism about the manner of the escape of the 14-year-old Ogyen Trinley Dorje in 1999 and get over the fact that he could have been a Chinese spy.

That, in 2018, it was better to have the Karmapa inside India, than outside.

So when the Karmapa left last year for medical treatment abroad, he was allowed to go. When his travel documents expired during his stay, they were renewed. When his Indian visa lapsed, that was renewed too, without much fuss.

Messages from the Karmapa that he would return to India in June, but had now postponed his visit to November, till after the monsoons, have also been taken at face value.

Having committed to attending the Dalai Lama meeting in November for all the lineages, authorities are now breathing a sigh of relief.

https://theprint.in/governance/india-once-thought-this-monk-was-a-chinese-spy-now-modi-govt-will-welcome-him-back/94523/

Celia

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Re: Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview
« Reply #7 on: August 08, 2018, 01:05:49 AM »
Another recent reporting speculating about the return of the Karmapa to India. Whilst we might not be sure of the details, what remains clear is that there have to be very serious concerns from the Karmapa’s end for him to be reacting in that manner. And clearly such concerns involved CTA and their engagements with Indian officials. Further, one wonders if it is really the case where he would return by November 2018 given that earlier, he had promised to return by June 2018. Interesting to also note that sources say that the mood among intelligence circles has been tense after the Karmapa’s disappearance.


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The Flight of the Karmapa is Further Proof That India Has No Tibet Card

Any attempt at a dispassionate analysis of prominent spiritual figures such as the Gyalwang Karmapa is never easy, especially when one is a devotee or a practitioner of the Vajrayana tradition. Yet, it is important to sift through the critical emerging trends in Tibetan Buddhism that impact India’s national security.
As the Dalai Lama turned 83 this year, the focus of Tibet has noticeably shifted to the 17th Karmapa – Ogyen Trinley Dorje (OTD) – who had suddenly disappeared from the radar of Indian intelligence in May 2017.

Amid rumours, OTD was finally traced in Europe and later to the United States, where he has been staying under the pretext of poor health. The Karmapa is reportedly located in New Jersey’s Wharton State Forest area, where he is staying in a farm estate gifted to him by a Chinese-Taiwanese couple. Some media reports suggested the Karmapa may not return to India where he spent the last 18 years but this month in an interview to Radio Free Asia he said he was talking to the Indian government about coming back; reportedly, he may do so by November 2018. Earlier, he had promised to return by June 2018. Sources say that the mood among intelligence circles has been tense after the Karmapa’s disappearance.

The Karmapa had made a daring escape from Tibet in 1999, which had caused a huge embarrassment to the Chinese government. Many theories centring on the Karmapa are shrouded in mystery – especially about the rituals and intrigues of succession politics. The Chinese – unfazed by his flight – claimed in 2000 that OTD had gone to India just to collect the “sacred black hat” from Rumtek (Sikkim), which was left by his predecessor.

The plot thickened after his arrival in India, when the Chinese government, the Dalai Lama’s administration and the Indian establishment began to wrestle for control over the 17th Karmapa for geopolitical reasons.
In an interview in April 2001, the Karmapa said he feared the Chinese were using him for political purposes such as separating the Tibetans from the Dalai Lama. He said he would not return to Tibet until the Dalai Lama did.

Considering the Karmapa’s importance in the Tibetan Lamaist order, the Dalai Lama in 1992 endorsed OTD – the candidate chosen by the Chinese – as the 17th Karmapa, possibly for a trade-off plan to get his chosen Panchen Lama released from Chinese captivity. That, of course, couldn’t be realised. Beijing, instead, installed a Panchen Lama of its own.

But the Karmapa’s sudden arrival in 2000 had raised many eyebrows in India. Many believed his escape was facilitated by the Chinese for the purpose of him getting hold of the “sacred black hat” lying in Rumtek. The Indian media was quick to label OTD a Chinese spy.
A reference was then made about the Karmapa having left behind a secret note in Tsurphu monastery in which he promised to return to Tibet soon. Interestingly, in a video message on June 26 last year, he said he desired to return to the ‘Land of Snow’ (Tibet) within the next two or three years.
In India, he was confined to the Gyuto Tantric monastery near Dharamsala under the tight surveillance of the Central Tibetan Administration (CTA) and Indian intelligence agencies. The government had imposed travel restrictions on him, notably banning him from visiting Rumtek monastery that was built by his predecessor.


Ups and downs

In 2011, the Karmapa was caught in an insalubrious controversy over illegal recovery of a large stash of cash ($1.4 million), including Chinese currency at his monastery as well as in a benami land deal in Himachal Pradesh. Such incidents have fuelled suspicion about OTD being a Chinese plant.

Sources say even Dharamsala may have created suspicion in the minds of Indian officials to ensure the Karmapa’s popularity doesn’t dip. But it is also true that among many iconic religious masters, the CTA has played up the Karmapa’s stature to make him the next powerhouse to play a pivotal role in the post-Dalai Lama scenario.

Clearly, OTD’s escape would cause a huge embarrassment for the CTA, especially the Dalai Lama himself, for he has been vehemently defending his authenticity (as the true Karmapa) and has also dismissed accusations of him being a Chinese spy. OTD’s disappearance right under his nose raises several key questions, especially about the activities of Tibetan refugees in India.

His slip is an embarrassment for the government as well, because the decision to revoke the travel restrictions imposed on him by the Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) in 2000 was taken only recently – inspite of intelligence agencies cautioning against it.

Not surprisingly, both New Delhi and Dharamsala seemingly tried their best, though in vain, to get him back. They sent a number of special emissaries to convince him to return.


What could have triggered the Karmapa’s escape?

In March this year, the Karmapa made some stunning revelations of his full ordeal in a 37-minute long “special message” telecast from the US that sent shock waves among his supporters and opponents alike.
The Karmapa revealed how his odyssey from the age of seven was manipulated by others; how he has been denied adequate education both in Tibet and India; how he virtually lived a prisoner’s life in Gyuto monastery (under tight surveillance) and was kept away from the main Kagyu masters scattered all around India.

The Karmapa also shared how helplessly he had to witness his own sect being torn into rival factions. He confessed to having tried in vain to heal the wound and seek “reconciliation” by talking to the opponent group led by Kunzig Shamar Rinpoche who passed away in 2014.
The Karmapa regretted how he was pressured to play a political role against the historical legacy of the Karmapa institution. For he also saw that politics is about seeking short-term benefits, profiting from “dividing people into factions”, whereas, dharma offers limitless prospects to serve people.

His main frustration pertained to his inability to meet the obligation of the title ‘Karmapa’ But more shockingly, the Karmapa hinted that he is being forced into the role – he confessed to not having any high “qualities and abundant realisations” of being the 17th Karmapa inspite of best efforts. He said, “I have no reasons to say that I am the reincarnation of any great Lama to meet the limitless hopes of people” – hence his desire to “give up” and live an ordinary life” and not continue “deceiving the public.”

Finally, he confessed to having run into “disharmony and disagreements” with the Indian government and regretted having spent 18 years of a “hassled life”, with the exception being meeting the Dalai Lama and other profound Kagyu masters in India.

The Karmapa appeared helpless in the video and the fact that he had to document his personal struggles and his “troubled life” through a special message from the US implies how grave the situation is.
Initially, the Karmapa cited ill-health and the ill-health of his attendant as reason for prolonged stay in America, but denied having any “insidious plans”.

That he had spent 18 years of ‘distressed’ life in India raises several pertinent questions i.e., who was conspiring against Karmapa; why was he confined to a monastery for 18 years; why was he denied Kagyu teachings; who pressed him to take up a political role; who created a rift in the Karmapa lineage; is he not the real Karmapa or was there any error in identifying the Karmapa; why is he thinking of stepping down and living as an ordinary person; and atop all these, why the ban on his travel was suddenly lifted last year.

Full article: https://thewire.in/diplomacy/the-flight-of-the-karmapas-is-further-proof-that-india-has-no-tibet-card

Drolma

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Re: Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview
« Reply #8 on: August 09, 2018, 10:18:24 AM »
It is very suspicious that suddenly Karmapa said he is going back to India. In the video he released earlier, he has clearly expressed his dissatisfaction towards the CTA and how he was controlled when he was in India. He thought he could get a better education in India, but he didn't.

He kind of regrets escaping from Tibet, he was not staying in his own monastery, he didn't get to do what he wanted to do. He wanted to teach the Dharma, he wanted the Tibetans to be united and be in harmony. But, none of these are possible up until now

His position is quite awkward I must say, even though the CTA and the Dalai Lama have accepted him, but I think they still are doubtful of him, that is why he was living in the Gyuto Tantric Monastery which is a Gelug monastery. China on the other hand definitely is not happy about his escape to India. So it is probably better for Karmapa to stay in the west and be a Dharma teacher.

For him to suddenly say he will go back to India, the CTA must have put some pressure on him. The Dalai Lama is already 83 years old and rumors have it that the Dalai Lama is terminally ill with cancer. The CTA needs another spiritual head to command the Tibetans, so the next best person has to be the Karmapa.

Tracy

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Re: Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview
« Reply #9 on: January 30, 2019, 09:43:07 AM »
The Karmapa was telling the media that he would go back to India to attend the religious conference organised by the CTA. But in the end, he did not. The reason he gave was that the Indian government refused to give him the visa to return.

The Karmapa gave up the Indian IC was a smart choice. If he continues to use the Indian IC, he would still be under the control of the CTA. If he ever travels to India with the Indian IC, he can be easily detained by the Indian government. His movement will be very restricted.

To become a political puppet is not what he wanted, he has said he just wanted to be a Dharma practitioner and a Dharma teacher. He regretted coming to India thinking he would have more opportunities to learn from the great masters but it was not the case. This is what CTA does, they don't care about the continuity of a lineage, they just want to make use of the high lama to achieve their personal interest.

Tracy

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Re: Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview
« Reply #10 on: February 07, 2019, 12:36:06 PM »
The Karmapa, head of the 900-year-old Karma Kagyu school of Tibetan Buddhism, a branch of one of the four main traditions of the religion, is now in talks with the Indian government over his return and may go back as soon as November, though the exact date of his return is still unclear, the lama said.

“In November of this year, there will be an important meeting of the heads of the major Tibetan Buddhist traditions in Dharamsala, India,” the Karmapa said.

Hmmm highly suspicious to at first not wanting to return to India and now he will return. The change of tune makes me wonder if Dharamsala, the evil Central Tibetan Administration did anything to threaten the Karmapa to return. If they did I wouldn't be surprised. Does anyone know and what do you good people think about this news?


The Karmapa is in a retreat, he is not going back to India for sure! The CTA can dream on, their successor of the Dalai Lama has said goodbye to them and he is not going to change his mind to return to India. He has more freedom now than he had when he was India, I hope he can continue to turn the wheel of Dharma and teach more.

Perhaps his escape from China was not arranged by China like what the rumour says. Maybe it was an arrangement from the CTA to bring him out of China. Sharmapa Rinpoche was not attracted to money and power so he would not agree to let the CTA control the Karmapa Thaye Dorje, it was a wise choice to not get close to the CTA. Sharmapa Rinpoche didn't need the endorsement from the Dalai Lama or the CTA as his recognition was done following the Karma Kagyu system.

The CTA saw an opportunity in the 2 Karmapas dispute, they were not interested to help to solve the Karmapa issue but they want to use it to their advantage. Tai Situ Rinpoche probably wanted so much for Karmapa Ogyen Trinley to resume the seat in Rumtek Monastery, so he gave in to the CTA. Unfortunately, the Indian government decided to forbid both Karmapas to step into Rumtek Monastery. The CTA helped to create so much conflict and disharmony.

Alex

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Re: Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview
« Reply #11 on: February 18, 2019, 11:00:40 AM »
Now Karmapa changed his mind and wanted to go back to India to attend the meeting of the heads of major traditions of Tibetan Buddhism in Dharamsala, India. However, India refuses to let Karmapa enter its borders with a Dominican passport. I wonder if this is part of the Tibetan leadership's doing by influencing the India government do what their biddings.

There are so much commotion and troubles for anyone who is related to the Tibetan leadership. They are like a huge ball of mess that trouble everyone and anyone that goes near to them. No one ever turns out to be good when they are associated with the Tibetan leadership.

So the Tibetan leadership's plan to have the Karmapa Ogyen Trinley to be the successor of his Holiness the Dalai Lama backfired. They tried to groom him well so that he will be able to take over His Holiness the Dalai Lama's place when His Holiness passes away. It sounded like a perfect plan but then due to the ill-treatment of the Karmapa, the CTA had lost their only hope.

Tracy

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Re: Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview
« Reply #12 on: February 18, 2019, 05:14:41 PM »
No one expected the Karmapa Ogyen Trinley will run away from the CTA. It is surprising to know the Karmapa gave up his Indian IC and took up Dominican citizenship, no one really expects that. The CTA was confident the Karmapa would go back to join the conference but he didn't.

It is actually quite embarrassing for the CTA that the Karmapa ran away from them. The Karmapa must have planned it for a long time. The Karmapa has never wanted to be involved in politics, his decision to run away from the CTA further confirms this. His mission is to spread Dharma, not to gain power and money.

The CTA thinks they can continue to control the high lamas and Tibetans, they are very wrong. Even the very soft-spoken Karmapa is rebelling. The CTA is going to collapse very soon as no one wants to support them.

SabS

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Re: Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview
« Reply #13 on: February 19, 2019, 06:57:07 AM »
At this stage in time, I highly doubt that Karmapa Orgyen Trinley will return to India anytime soon. With so much negative news about him lately, there is really no point in his return to India. The Indian government is also waiting to persecute him on alleged crimes and said he is ungrateful for their courtesy extended to him when he first escaped into India. Even his new citizenship of Dominican Republic and visa application to enter India had become negative news fodder. Then his five-year relationship with his girlfriend which entails 3 sexual encounters, just somehow did not go down well with followers since he is in robes and holds vows.

On the other hand, Karmapa Thaye Dorje is doing very well. After the initial hoo-hah about his marriage, we now learn that his union brought the precious rebirth of Sharmapa into their lineage. Thankfully out of the reach and control of the Tibetan Leaders who would have manipulated to their advantage without care if harm had been done to others. Now we receive news that the Tibetan Leaders are trying to establish contact with Karmapa Thaye Dorje. He is not biting and why should he? They had created so many problems for him. Karma comes back.

No, I don't think that Karmapa Orgyen Trinley will come back anytime soon.


Alex

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Re: Karmapa Lama Will Return to India: Interview
« Reply #14 on: February 19, 2019, 07:41:30 AM »
At this stage in time, I highly doubt that Karmapa Orgyen Trinley will return to India anytime soon. With so much negative news about him lately, there is really no point in his return to India. The Indian government is also waiting to persecute him on alleged crimes and said he is ungrateful for their courtesy extended to him when he first escaped into India. Even his new citizenship of Dominican Republic and visa application to enter India had become negative news fodder. Then his five-year relationship with his girlfriend which entails 3 sexual encounters, just somehow did not go down well with followers since he is in robes and holds vows.

On the other hand, Karmapa Thaye Dorje is doing very well. After the initial hoo-hah about his marriage, we now learn that his union brought the precious rebirth of Sharmapa into their lineage. Thankfully out of the reach and control of the Tibetan Leaders who would have manipulated to their advantage without care if harm had been done to others. Now we receive news that the Tibetan Leaders are trying to establish contact with Karmapa Thaye Dorje. He is not biting and why should he? They had created so many problems for him. Karma comes back.

No, I don't think that Karmapa Orgyen Trinley will come back anytime soon.

Yes, it is not a good time for Karmapa Ogyen Trinley to go back to India because there is so much negative news about him. If he returns to India, it will because a big issue for him and he might lose his freedom that he enjoys right now without the Tibetan leadership breathing down his neck.

The Tibetan leadership had tried all sorts of nasty tricks to control the Karmapa and court cases are one of them. Since the Karmapa had adopted a Dominican passport which a move that will be seen as rebelling against them. If the Karmapa is within their reach again, I do not think they will let him go that easily anymore.

But with all those negative news about the Karmapa Ogyen Trinley, why is he trying to go back to attend some meetings? There is absolutely no benefit for him to return to India and he will lose whatever that he manages to fight for, for the past 1 year. It will be a waste of time and effort and most probably he will jeopardize his new found freedom.