Author Topic: Tibetan youths question Dorje Shugden ban  (Read 14249 times)

DharmaDefender

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Tibetan youths question Dorje Shugden ban
« on: June 12, 2014, 07:48:42 AM »
Looks like the PMs running scared. If this is how he answers KIDS hahaha Id hate to see how he performs during question time. Not that it matters since he hasnt got any real political opposition who can cause trouble for his career. In a real democracy leaders have some actual worthy opponents. I know Ed and Nick arent much but at least they put up a better fight with good ol Dave when it came to our elections. Theres no one else to challenge Lobsang Sangay and hes pretty much got a free hand of the Tibetan parliament. This leaves him free to do and say whatever he wants.

So if kids are questioning him and hes not happy, whys that? Because hes not getting political practice in parliament where everyones got to agree with him and theres no dissent. So hes not used to being debated against. Can you imagine, a Harvard educated lawyer has his hypocrisy exposed by a bunch of teenagers whove probably never left India? What an embarrassment for him and doesnt say much for the level of his education. What exactly did he learn in Harvard, Id like to know.

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In an effort to appear more open and democratic, the Central Tibetan Administration (CTA; Tibetan leadership) held a question-and-answer session with a group of Tibetan students. Assuming the students would ask questions that gave the leadership a chance to look modern, open and democratic, Sikyong (Prime Minister) Lobsang Sangay soon realised he had severely underestimated the analytical and observant nature of this new generation of Tibetan youth.

READ MORE: http://www.dorjeshugden.com/all-articles/features/tibetan-youths-question-dorje-shugden-ban/

DharmaSpace

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Re: Tibetan youths question Dorje Shugden ban
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2014, 09:16:47 AM »
SIKYONG STOP LYING

I have never seen this day coming, but it is awesome because it is the sign of a government that has lost touch with reality and its people. A PR relations melt down and nightmare.

CTA has no basis to pursue unity or freedom, because it splits its people and oppresses them.

I felt so excited when I heard that the students are saying the Tibetan who practice Dorje Shugden are doing despite ( Assuming Dorje Shugden were funded and supported by the Chinese)  two conditions - once Chinese hands over Tibet, the Dorje Shudgen would have no more use by the Chinese, and the other is despite the Dorje Shugden practitioners being a pariah within Tibetan community they still do it. What will happen to those who engage in Dorje Shudgen practice, in the end if they are traitors they will have nothing and no support yet they remain loyal. I felt that student feels respect for Dorje Shugden people and something different than people who practice for worldly gains.  It has been Pakistan and India for a long time now.

A simple acid test, to test if the Sikyong is lying or he is telling the truth, CTA can admit an active Dorje Shugden worshipper chosen by Dorje Shugden leaders to be in CTA and work alongside the CTA?

One thing missing that the students did not mention is that CTA's ban if its getting picked up by the Tibetan people what about the Indian people and government, such undemocratic actions how long will India tolerate?
Every demonstration points back to the ban, the ban related to CTA and the Dalai Lama.

This draconian ban will soon be an embarrassment for the Indian government. How long India tolerate Tibetans who do actions contrary to the 2nd largest democracy in the world? India already got a lot of flack from the women's rape issues, is it time for another crisis to hit India again? India has much revenues at stake from tourists and etc. CTA does not need Dorje Shugden people to love them, but they need to endear themselves to the super powers, given the financial crisis looming in the developed world, we need more friends than enemies. In that respect why would India still cause rifts with China the biggest economy in the world now?       


 

jagger

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Re: Tibetan youths question Dorje Shugden ban
« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2014, 10:40:10 AM »
Haha, I can't agree more with you Dharma Space, the looks on his face shows it all. In due time, we don't need no peaceful protests but the Tibetans within their own community will come to their senses and question their own CTA. At that time, there won't be any hiding hole for the CTA to keep themselves to. We have waited with so much patience for so long for today to come where our efforts of exposing the truth about Dorje Shugden has come.

What is amazing is even at this juncture when CTA is hurling so many vulgarities at our sacred lineage, our root gurus and great masters have advised us to keep calm and practice patience throughout this period of hardship. This I see is the true spirit of Buddhism. May we lift the ban soon and many more come to realize the true nature of things.
Jaggerboy

dsiluvu

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Re: Tibetan youths question Dorje Shugden ban
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2014, 11:56:49 AM »
Yeah! I am so glad to see this and I rejoice that smart, young, intelligent Tibetans are speaking up. Because what they've been told and what they themselves have seen and heard and read with their own eyes sure is contradictory! And it's about time because you can't keep covering up with lies and think people won't notice CTA!

Tibetan Youth are not illiterate and uneducated like their parents or fore fathers and CTA you've belittled and underestimated your people for far to long. Looks like you are running out of lies, to cover, times up! You've deceived your own people and created so much disunity, it's about time you are questioned for your blatant acts of discrimination!

Where is the so called dialogue you Mr. Sangay claim to have been trying to have with Dorje Shugden leaders? Prove it if it was true please as we have been urging you and the Dalai Lama for one!

These young impressionable Tibetans, who are sincere, innocent and genuine can see through the contradictions and well, everyone knows if there is a monastery for Shugden practitioners only means there is a separation and who cause this separation? Isn't it due to the ban? It is not because of religious freedom, what a load of baloney! I am sure these young intelligent Tibetans are going to go back and discuss amongst themselves and realise that with different students, the answers contradicts and some totally ignored and diverted. Now what are you going to say that these young Tibetans are Chinese spies and are being paid by Chinese??? It would just make you more unfavourable.

Tibetans need to be united and hence the ban need to be lifted completely!!! Learn from you host country mother India and respect all religion please!

lotus1

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Re: Tibetan youths question Dorje Shugden ban
« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2014, 02:10:46 PM »
Bravo to the students!

With the exposure of internet and to the world, the Tibetan nations has grown to be more exposed, knowledgeable, open-minded and have logical thinking. They would be great leaders to lead Tibetan to unity next time! They are in the Tibetan community and witness that how the Shugden practitioners are discriminated by the society.

The students are asking very sincere and valid questions to Mr Lobsang Sangay. However, Mr Sangay has been beating around the bush and do not answer the truth.
1.   He told that “the CTA had tried to initiate dialogue with Shugden practitioners since ‘75, and especially from 1995”. Can he show the prove? All this while CTA has been avoiding to conduct the dialog despite many requests from the Dorje Shugden practitioners.
2.   It is clear that the students have noticed Shugden practitioners are poor but Mr Sangay still insist that they received financial reward from the Chinese.  >:(
3.   Mr Sangay said that CTA gives Shugden practitioners freedom by letting them to have their own monastery. What logic is that? Shugden practitioners are force to leave their origin monasteries! In the recent incident, we can also see that anti-Shugden practitioners forced into Domo Geshe monastery in Phedong (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/all-articles/features/breaking-news-domo-geshe-rinpoches-monastery-in-phedong-attacked/ )
4.   Mr Sangay keeps insisting that Shugden practitioners have their rights by having their ID cards. However, he keeps ignoring to answer the questions of the students on why they have seen and experienced that Shudgen practitioners are discriminated with their own eyes. 

I especially like the statement made by Student #6. He is brave enough to politely request Mr Sangay to consider that “Dhogyal people are also Tibetan, and they have Tibetan blood and bones. Being Tibetan, give them rights to religion. Even in India has this rights called “secularism ethic” so, I think we should also follow that rules.”

The way that Mr Sangay replied was full of lies, without facts to support him and contradicting with his own answers.

I do hope CTA would not make the same mistake again. They should would lift the ban and unite all the Tibetan to show that they are truly democratic.

On a side note, I hope the students are safe and will not be penalized by their school or CTA like those participated in the protest and have their names and pictures being published on the CTA website.

Manisha Kudo

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Re: Tibetan youths question Dorje Shugden ban
« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2014, 04:15:34 PM »
This is indeed a turning point for Tibet, the Shugden practitioners and CTA. Gone are the days when Tibetans were afraid to speak up not because they are backward but because they were unaware that their rights have been violated by the same group of people called the government. Next, they were promised by their religious leader HH Dalai Lama that there will be democracy for Tibet. When these group of young intellectuals pondered and analyzed the truth of what is happening within the Tibetan community, they noticed that  there was discrimination amongst their own people, curtailing a person or a group of people the right to religious freedom. It appeared more like dictatorship.

As Student #6 succinctly addressed the issue with Mr Sangay, he was indeed brave and kind in stating that he no longer wants to oppress a fellow Tibetan just because he has chosen a different religious path. In fact, Dorje Shugden is a harmonious practice, which has benefited many people even from the West.

Why do people who are not part of the retribution actually stood up against the Dalai Lama? They could have practiced quietly and not be bothered with some strange monks living in exile in India. The Western demonstrators took this cause up with the CTA and the Dalai Lama because they know that what is happening in Tibet goes against the Buddha-Dharma especially, Bodhicitta. How can one call himself a Buddhist, propitiating the precious Protector, knowing very well someone else can't do the same because of the afflictions brought about by their leaders? And yet, these group of strong Shugdenpas persevered and lasted for nearly 40 years standing their ground.

I am sure the students can see this for themselves. As some have claimed in the video that they received teachings from the Dalai Lama. If they put into application what has been taught, then, they will surely face a heap of contradictions. Thus, they did what a normal human being would do. They investigated, researched, learned and asked questions. With the emphasis now being put on the protection of Human Rights, which the Dalai Lama vehemently advocates, the young Tibetans will want a different treatment for the Shugdenpas. One that is fair, just and kind, reflective of the charter that humanity upholds.

When students or young intellectuals take up arms via their mighty pens (now laptops) and hungry voices, it is a sure sign that the society itself has taken leap away from ignorance and lies. This means, the CTA and the Dalai Lama must be prepared to come head on with Tibetans that now value freedom and the pursuit of happiness on the path to Enlightenment. Really, no more lies.   

gohdi

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Re: Tibetan youths question Dorje Shugden ban
« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2014, 07:05:47 PM »
I can't find the video  :( could you please tell me where I can find it?

vajratruth

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Re: Tibetan youths question Dorje Shugden ban
« Reply #7 on: June 12, 2014, 07:32:13 PM »
I can't find the video  :( could you please tell me where I can find it?


Gohdi,

Click on the link here for details http://kadamemanation.com/political-pollution. Or watch on You Tube:
Tibetan youths question Sikyong Lobsang Sangay on Dorje Shugden


gohdi

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Re: Tibetan youths question Dorje Shugden ban
« Reply #8 on: June 12, 2014, 09:04:14 PM »
Got it ???? 1000 x 1000 x 1000 thanks to the ISC for achieving that it is now publicly discussed.

Blueupali

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Re: Tibetan youths question Dorje Shugden ban
« Reply #9 on: June 13, 2014, 06:13:48 AM »
Wow, this Lobsang Sangey dude does not look pleased at how this is going.  It's hard when you aren't like the golden boy Buddha of compassion that everyone fears, no?
  I thought the students seemed very intelligent and articulate, as opposed to the CTA which seemed.... illogical, lying.... moronic....
  So, as usual Dorje Shugden practioners are getting money from China?  To pray?  Really?  No one, ever, has offered me money to pray, and if they did, of course we would refuse it--- because that would mix our motivation---- we can't take money to pray.
  What is wrong with these people?

rossoneri

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Re: Tibetan youths question Dorje Shugden ban
« Reply #10 on: June 13, 2014, 08:54:47 AM »
It is nice to know that the younger Tibetans are concern over the issue of Dorje Shugden which leads to discrimination, non- religious freedom, suicide and taking it seriously. It shows them care and do not take an answer without questioning and thinking the logic behind of those answer which CTA has been feeding to them (the older generation) for years.

No matter where did you graduated from it does not matter because a lie is a lie no matter how wonderful you tried to cover up from the ultimate truth.

Solomon Lang

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Re: Tibetan youths question Dorje Shugden ban
« Reply #11 on: June 13, 2014, 09:03:48 AM »
The following is from the Wikipedia entry for Lobsang Sangay:

In 1995, he won a Fulbright Scholarship to Harvard Law School, where he subsequently received his LL.M. degree the same year.

In 2004, he became the first Tibetan (among six million) to earn a S.J.D. degree from Harvard Law School.

He is an expert in Tibetan law and international human rights law.

Hypocrite or not?
Solomon's Judgement: 2 women came to resolve a quarrel over which was d true mother of a baby. When Solomon suggested they should divide d child in two with a sword, one said she would rather give up d child than see it killed. Solomon then declared d woman who showed compassion 2b the true mother.

vajrastorm

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Re: Tibetan youths question Dorje Shugden ban
« Reply #12 on: June 13, 2014, 09:06:18 AM »
There are a couple of things Lobsang Sangay and the CTA forgot, when they decided to carry out a  question-and-answer exercise with the young Tibetans, who grew up in India, and have been exposed to the new, emerging world culture of democracy and freedom of speech. They forgot that these young people, unlike the generation of their fathers who had grown up in a 'closed-door' Tibet, while respectful of authority, would question whatever they find illogical or unacceptable or contradictory to what they themselves have observed on the ground.

These are sincere youngsters , who speak the language of honesty and integrity, and from the heart. From the heart they say "Dhogyal people are also Tibetans, and they have Tibetan blood and bones. Being Tibetan, give them rights to religion. Even India has this rights called 'secularism ethics". so, I think, we should also follow rules".These are people who are expressing their sincere feelings,as they watch their Shugden practitioner friends suffer from oppression and persecution by the Tibetan leadership .

Sikong Lobsang Sangay and CTA forget that these young people will be the leaders who will form the government of tomorrow, if Tibet gains Independence ,or, they will be the leaders of the community of Tibetans -in -Exile . They will be inheriting the mantle of leadership from them. So how can they be so short-sighted and attempt to deceive by lying, covering and contradictions?

Tenzin K

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Re: Tibetan youths question Dorje Shugden ban
« Reply #13 on: June 14, 2014, 05:22:55 AM »
I’m surprise with the youths on how they question Sikyong Lobsang Sangye. Those youth are not rude but observed what had happen around them and witness the suffering of the Shugden practitioners. They request for clarification, not that they are practitioners and I don’t think they concern about the practice but it’s more on the concern of humanity, fair treatment to their own Tibetan people.

The reply from Sikyong is so weak and baseless. He keeps saying the government trying to solve but what is the proof or evident from CTA ‘trying’ to solve this issue?  The big lie from him saying that CTA has never restricted Shugden practitioners from whatever they are doing. I’m glad that the youths aware of what is going on and the discrimination towards the practitioners was so obvious and it have all the proof to justify it.

I’m so happy to see the Tibetan youths which are so brave to seek for the answers on what happen to the countrymen. They question and request for clarification based on what they observed and experienced. CTA can never lie and escape from all the ugly work cause all the suffering towards the Shugden practitioners. The discrimination is so obvious where the youth can even point out.
I love one of the youth which he said let the practitioners practice and make all Tibetan the same, equal, irregardless of their religion just like India.  Wonderful!

Big Uncle

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Re: Tibetan youths question Dorje Shugden ban
« Reply #14 on: June 14, 2014, 07:09:17 AM »
A Tibetan by the name of Thinley wrote this comment in the article which I thought that everybody should read as its from a Tibetan perspective. I appreciate his comments because we get very little Tibetan feedback for these articles and coverage, probably because they are afraid of reprisals from within they own community. Check it out:-

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I really wish His Holiness and our Sikyong-lak sees this news because so many important questions asked by the children which is the truth. Tibetan peoples will not dare to ask this type of questions because we are afraid what will happen if we ask. Village will not like us, they say we are not real Tibetan, they say we are chinese spies, they say we are dolgyal people. Even me who is not Shugden practitioner, they will say the same thing and then my family will be having many problems.

These school children they are born in India, they know about democracy, they live in free society, they know english and they know how to use computer. They learn lots more than older Tibetan people and what they ask is truth. They are Tibetan in the mind, but they are modern Tibetan.

Sikyong-lak must give respect to them, don’t look so angry. He is their leader also. They are young and they are important to Tibetan’s future. Much more benefit to explain properly, so everyone can understand the answer. Because on http://bod.asia/ government is talking the same things about Shugden everyday so they must have the proof and the answers. If it is not possible to answer then something is not good. Then must say sorry and you are wrong.

We are not like old Tibetan style anymore. Last time Tibetans only stay in Tibet, not going out, not knowing new things, every thing is ok. Now we going to USA, France, Switzerland, things are different now. Inside every country it is allowed to ask the government why they doing things that make people not happy, and to make protest and demonstration if there is a problem. CTA need to learn about this. Be the real government, learn the real democracy way, have dialogue. Even the children knows this now.

My friends is very much suffering from what His Holiness is doing with Shugden. It is difficult for them. I think it is already enough problems happening to our people. Bod Rangzen is for all Tibetans not only some.

Thank you also to dorjeshugden.com team for letting more people know about this and what is happening. It is very much important.