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General Buddhism => General Buddhism => Topic started by: beggar on November 05, 2010, 09:28:16 AM
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I've always been quite intrigued by this: that many, many people go around saying, "I'm a good person, I don't harm anyone" and believe that that is enough.
When you study Dharma and are shown the many opportunities for doing something more meaningful and beneficial for others, simply being a good person is not enough. Yes, you may be not be harming anyone. If you lie in bed all day doing nothing or just sit in front of your television, of course you are not harming anyone... or so you think.
There are hundreds of people out there who are suffering at the exact moment that we are lying in bed or sitting in front of the television. What could we be doing to alleviate the suffering of some people out there, instead of just watching TV? In fact, our inaction alone is actually harming someone because we allow someone out there to continue suffering. An interesting way of looking at things isn't it?
My question is: how do you get this point across to people? I have met with a lot of apathy from people who remain content in simply doing nothing, citing over and over, "but I'm a good person". How do we get people off the couch and into action?
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BEING A GOOD GUY
I heard on Gelug lama say this that I never forgot:
"Being spiritual is not about being the "good guy", it is about doing "the right thing!""
Those that have kids will know what this means, the worse parents aften are the "good guys" kindda parents.
I DO ENOUGH
One could not possibly do enough if one understand the suffering going on and how we all are involved in this mess.
And on that basis, one should logically develop the wish to become more efficient, more skillful, to become a Buddha so as to be of effective help.
The "I am a good guy" and "I do enough" language are expressions of a deluded mind.
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My question is: how do you get this point across to people? I have met with a lot of apathy from people who remain content in simply doing nothing, citing over and over, "but I'm a good person". How do we get people off the couch and into action?
So how do we kick off the Good Guy Syndrome?
Let's be honest,...we are all not free of the 8 worldly concerns, constantly seeking for pleasure and avoiding displeasure. On that basis, work with that person in terms of understanding what makes the person tick. It does take a lot of listening and observation before we know what to even share in hopes of helping someone change their ways.
It took hell-of-alot for me to change even the slightest...so being patient and consistent with others is a way of repaying kindness..
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In the world of samsara, the words "being good" are limited to not actually killing anyone or causing one real harm and danger. They are mostly equated with physical things/acts.
And as long as they have not done any real physical damage to anyone - they would classify themselves as good.
But if we ask them further if they have done anything right by anyone or have done anything more than NOT doing anything wrong, their answer would probably be silence.
Many people think that by abstaining from causing harm is enough.
They simply do not understand that DOING ACTUAL GOOD and MORE would actually make them really good people.
They do not understand the words "to benefit others".
Yes, many may not have done anything wrong to others, but can they start benefiting others as well?
There is a huge difference being a good person and a person who benefits others. I guess that is the difference between good and GREAT.
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This is a great topic - love it! Some of my friends do charity work and think that they are 'good' but i have a few questions.
I wanted to ask your opinions - if we do good but it's stained by the 8 worldly concerns, do we still get good karma?
If we have good motivation and do good without the 8 worldly concerns, do we gain merits if we are not Buddhist?
I understand that merits help our Dharma path so if we are not Buddhist, does merits make us be closer to Buddhism in future? How do merits work for non-Buddhists?
Sorry for so many questions and thank you Admin for this board to address the broader buddhist questions!
*eagerly awaiting answers*
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This is a great topic - love it! Some of my friends do charity work and think that they are 'good' but i have a few questions.
I wanted to ask your opinions - if we do good but it's stained by the 8 worldly concerns, do we still get good karma?
If we have good motivation and do good without the 8 worldly concerns, do we gain merits if we are not Buddhist?
I understand that merits help our Dharma path so if we are not Buddhist, does merits make us be closer to Buddhism in future? How do merits work for non-Buddhists?
Sorry for so many questions and thank you Admin for this board to address the broader buddhist questions!
*eagerly awaiting answers*
Dear WB,
Yes, good deeds are the causes for good karma even though mixed with the 8 worldly concerns. They will be causes for us to experience good results either in this life or future lives.
Doing good with good motivation and without the 8 worldly concerns would definitely gain merits even if done by non Buddhist. As the law of karma is universal irregardless of religions or faith. There are many Buddhists acting non Buddhisticly, similarly there are also many non Buddhists in name act in accordance to the teachings of Buddha eg. Gandhi, Mother Theresa.
I would think the true merits collected by non Buddhists would help them to be closer to Buddhism in their future lives because with merits they would be able to understand Buddha's teachings easier and they also create the good karma to meet a qualified Guru in the future.
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It is easy to be good and do the good deeds that we like and enjoy to do - especially if it is within our preferences.
Fo example, if an animal lover saves animals - it is really within the realms of his or her comfort zones. It is something beyond this individual.
Where as, if we ask a non-animal lover to save animals, it might be a lot more challenging to this individual. Because it is not within this person's comfort zone.
So, if we are doing whatever good deeds within our comfort zones, then it is really not much of an effort. It would not amount to much of a MIND TRANSFORMATION now would it?
Mind transformation attacks what we are so accustomed to and what we prefer or like.
It pushes us out of our comfort zones in order for us to achieve a higher state of consciousness.
So, if we doing a lot of good deeds yet we remain within our comfort zones - how would that truly benefit our own spiritual development?
Just wondering out loud.
Sorry, I seem to have added my own set of questions onto WB's?
My thoughts on WB's questions - I think a good person can be of any race, culture, religion and name.
No matter who we are, Karma is still working and moving. No one can escape Karma, even if you say you don't believe in it.
So, if Karma does not discriminate against anyone - then, my guess is that merits would not as well.
The only real difference is whether one's religion would actually teach one the way out of samsara.
Now, that is a different story altogether.
As I am not familiar with any other religion, I cannot comment further.
But just knowing the Lamrim and having the Lamrim - one does have certain benefits, especially if one practises Dharma well and hold their vows very well.
Just my 2 cents worth, if we can even call it that.
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A lot of my friends fit into this category – people who profess they are good and do no overt harm to others. They spend their time looking after their own interests and welfare. When they read in the newspaper about a great catastrophe like an earthquake, they just cluck in sympathy and then get on with their own lives without any further thought of the beings whose lives have been devastated by the earthquake.
When they see stray animals hanging around their homes, they can’t wait to get rid of them.
I guess it takes tremendous merits for people to meet with the Dharma and, through studying it, reflecting upon it and putting it into practice, develop an awareness that we beings are not just separate entities, but are inextricably linked together interdependently as parts of a whole. Hence our wellbeing is dependent on others’ wellbeing. Hence we must reach out to help and care for others. Buddhist ethics is an ethics of care and love.
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Karma is non-sectarian, non-religious whether you believe it or not.
by the same token...
Merits is non-sectarian, non-religious also.
Think about it. The results of merits can throw you into a good rebirth of having all the necessities to practice dharma, ie. good family, good upbringing, immense wealth, no health worries whatsoever, maybe even sexy to boot.
But what would cause you not to come across the Dharma, our karma of course.
Having said that, it doesn't mean that we would stop doing virtuous actions that would acrue towards merit. What of those people in history that created soo much good for the world that weren't buddhist, like the guy who created penicillin, or the guy who created electricity.
That must be meritorious actions to spend your lifetime to research and create something for mankind to benefit.
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I guess it is the perennial excuse for most people when they are presented with a spiritual path. Some even think being the average good person is spiritual practice. If only doing that would ensure everything would alright. For now, being a good person seem to help for some people because everything is deceptively alright but that too is impermanent. Everything can change for the worse and then what? We become bad?
When situations change for the worse, can we always be sure that we will be a good person? Are we even ready to face difficult situations? That is when our spirituality is tested. Hence, following a real spiritual path like Buddhism that has all the guidelines would be much better than just making our own path. It will also prepare us for difficult situations and of course, the most inevitably difficult situation of all - death.
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I had a very good conversation with my Dharma sister about this.
I am sure most people would like to think that they are good people. But whether they are good people in the Dharma sense, that is really another story altogether.
We concluded that the majority of the planet would equate being good as someone who did not harm anyone, or hurt anyone intentionally. But this does not mean that it would include doing good and helping others.
Doing good, sacrificing oneself for others and giving more to others - all these seem to fall into another category in the samsaric world. That would most probably be tagged with social heroic deeds, community work and charity.
At the end of the conversation, I realised that these people are essentially self-grasping at the core because they will only do something which they like and it is at their convenience. Or if doing that deed brings them pleasure, gains, joy or a boost to their reputation.
It is about them and not others.
When our thoughts and motivation naturally arise for others, and we will have no hesitation in wanting to do more for others, then I think we have progressed from a self-serving individual to one who just wants others to be happy.
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I've always been quite intrigued by this: that many, many people go around saying, "I'm a good person, I don't harm anyone" and believe that that is enough.
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My question is: how do you get this point across to people? I have met with a lot of apathy from people who remain content in simply doing nothing, citing over and over, "but I'm a good person". How do we get people off the couch and into action?
What appears to be good may not be good. What appears to be bad may be good! If a person whose motivation is for the benefit of others, without a single trace of selfishness then we can call him a good person. Even if we claim that we dont harm others, it does not mean we are a good person. For example, knowing that someone is wrong and continue to do wrong but we don't do anything to rectify the situation is actually harming that person who is wrong.
Why is this so? Vajrastorm raised an important point on interdependency. Our every single action performed through our thought, speech or body or combination thereof will have an impact on others. In this exampe, our inaction has caused harm to others!
Hence, there is the need to educate those who think they are good persons and don't harm anyone on Dharma. Unless they understand and practise the teachings of Dharma, they will remain couch potatoes!
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Well said, Dondrup!
I love these words especially -
Unless they understand and practise the teachings of Dharma, they will remain couch potatoes!
Many a times, we may seem some people go through a tough time. This could even apply to our own Dharma community of brothers and sisters. And because of our own dislike for that person, we may not be as eager to help or even notice this person's "fall from grace", so-to-speak. Hence, we do nothing.
In doing nothing, we have attributed to this person's fall in one way or another.
And we may not even think we are in any way guilty or we may not even realise that we have anything to do with it.
Which brings us back to the point of interdependency.
If we truly understand and practice Dharma, we will always do something and keep trying for anyone or everyone.
After all, a Bodhisattva will never leave anyone behind.
And if someone is left behind, a Bodhisattva still has to return to samsara and help this person. Even if this person is the last sentient being in samsara.
That is the whole point of Dharma - to put into practice and not be "couch potatoes".
We do not wait for others to do something, we do it.
We take it as our responsibility to do it.
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I've always been quite intrigued by this: that many, many people go around saying, "I'm a good person, I don't harm anyone" and believe that that is enough.
...
My question is: how do you get this point across to people? I have met with a lot of apathy from people who remain content in simply doing nothing, citing over and over, "but I'm a good person". How do we get people off the couch and into action?
What appears to be good may not be good. What appears to be bad may be good! If a person whose motivation is for the benefit of others, without a single trace of selfishness then we can call him a good person. Even if we claim that we dont harm others, it does not mean we are a good person. For example, knowing that someone is wrong and continue to do wrong but we don't do anything to rectify the situation is actually harming that person who is wrong.
Why is this so? Vajrastorm raised an important point on interdependency. Our every single action performed through our thought, speech or body or combination thereof will have an impact on others. In this exampe, our inaction has caused harm to others!
Hence, there is the need to educate those who think they are good persons and don't harm anyone on Dharma. Unless they understand and practise the teachings of Dharma, they will remain couch potatoes!
For couch potatoes and loafers in the Dharma (this label makes for a good self-reflection), I don't think beautiful explanations like these will make them stand up from their comfortable position. I think it is a lot of hard work for us to exemplify the teachings, walk the talk and have a lot of compassion plus skillful means to put what you just said in a manner and language that will inspire them and not scare them or even make them defensive. Nobody likes to be told they are useless bums, even the couch potatoes. Different people have different aspects that move them and makes them who they are. Sometimes, it may not even be the Dharma or beautiful Dharma words that will make the cut. However, whatever we say must be backed up by our actions and attitude towards the Dharma otherwise couch potatoes remain couch potatoes.
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Helena and Big Uncle,
I agree.
It is so so so hard to tame all sentient beings' monkey minds! Evan Buddha Avalokiteshvara's body had broken into thousand pieces in utter despair in the past due to this ... We must change first if we want others to change. We hope our transformations will inspire others into taking the right actions!
Dharma practice had become a choice instead of necessity in the current degenerate times. One viable solution is to educate the sentient beings when they are still very young e.g. in the first three years after birth or even during the 9 months period of pregnancy of a mother. Through proper system of education, the minds of the said sentient bengs can be re-conditioned and re-habituated into purer minds.
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Came across an old friend this past weekend. We chatted briefly about life.. and I commented that life is short and best to live it in the most beneficial way.
The respond i received was that he leads an already hectic life. He stated that he used to make other people happy but have had enough of it. He ended up stressed, no time for the family, and tired of it all.
This type of thinking is prevalent.
Where do we begin to shed some light with this type of self-absorption delusion.
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I’m not sure that the late Mother Theresa isn’t a Bodhisattva appearing in the guise of this lovely person who has shown unrelentingly that the world must revolve around love and compassion. Her actions of body, speech and(I am sure) mind are so pure and so full of compassion. The things she says are so Dharmic. The only difference is she takes refuge in a God who for her is Love and Compassion incarnate.
I have read a testimony of a Roman Catholic, who had prayed to the Virgin Mary, for his brother to be cured of cancer. Instead of the Virgin Mary, Avalokitesvara appeared to him, in a dream, as a Lady in White and assured him that his prayers would be answered. True enough, his brother was miraculously cured of his cancer soon after that. When this gentleman went around to check, he found a statue of the Lady of his dream in a temple and he has since become a Buddhist. He now spends all his time helping people in need.
Thus do Boddhisattvas come again and again to help sentient beings in whatever form suits us beings . There ARE Boddhisattvas working in our midst. When we are so fortunate as to have one with us, and especially when they come in the form of a Spiritual Guide, we should never let the opportunity go of growing Dharma within us and helping them to grow Dharma around us. In this way, do we do more than being good and merely helping others by benefitting them only physically.
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There is the very nature of Samsara which is the way it simply is and there is our karma - just filled with our own ugly habituations from the beginningless time.
When these two come into play, it is not a very pretty picture.
Sometimes it can be a real painful and exhausting struggle. Because we are trying to change all those bad habits into good ones, bearing in mind the bad habits have been around for eons. Of course, being trapped in the very environment that is samsara does not make it at all easy.
Nothing gets easier but if we apply the consistent effort through time and we really keep working at it - that in itself is a training to become stronger and better.
Just like the first time we went to the gym - it was painful, it was hard and boy, did all our muscles ache and we just suffered even more the next day. Why? Because we never used those muscles before. We probably never thought we had those muscles in our bodies in the first place.
But over time, if we do keep up our training and we do keep practising and training, our bodies will start to change. Our muscles will become stronger, even when we keep adding the weights - we find we can still take it.
So, Dharma practice to me, is something like going to the gym and being dedicated to my health and fitness. In this case, the health and fitness of my mind. Yes, there are days when I can grumble and be lazy. But if I allow that to consume me completely, then I would stop going to the gym altogether and my training or physical fitness will be zero.
At the end of the day, we all fall down every once in a while. The point is, do we get back up and go at it and continue or do we just sit there and grumble away?
I think it is clear to see which of the two will bring the results that we want in our lives. The more we want something and realise that it is beneficial for us, the more we will not give up so easily.
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Which is worse: a man who is capable of doing harm and does, OR a man who's capable of doing much good but doesn't.
It's incredibly frustrating to see others profess that they do much good in life, when all that they do (even if at all!) give 2% of their annual salary to an orphanage and be happy as a clam for the rest of the year.
It's even more frustrating when they take their religion to justify their actions e.g. we *name-of-religion* sacrifice animals every year, we see nothing wrong with it, in fact we believe it's for the greater good and for a better purpose.
I just want to scream "MY FOOT", but to do so without sounding patronizing is almost close to impossible.
For those who do not understand karma - how?
Is it actually possible that human beings really do have the capacity to understand what goes around comes around. Regardless of religion?
If we have good motivation and do good without the 8 worldly concerns, do we gain merits if we are not Buddhist?
I understand that merits help our Dharma path so if we are not Buddhist, does merits make us be closer to Buddhism in future? How do merits work for non-Buddhists?
I do think that you do gain merits even if you're not a Buddhist. I think that yes, the merits will bring them closer to Buddhism in the future... and that merits work the same for both Buddhists and non-Buddhists.
However, by not understanding the concept of karma from the very beginning and you end up doing nothing - you'll only bring yourself away from Buddhism even more!
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Which is worse: a man who is capable of doing harm and does, OR a man who's capable of doing much good but doesn't.
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hard to say which is worse. But what's for sure is the karmic effects will be there for whatever actions done or not done. The effects will return similar to the causes.
pray for them, dedicate merits to them, teach the dharma by example (easier said than done) ... last thing we want to do is to be angry and frustrated at them, look down at them.
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It is easy to be good and do the good deeds that we like and enjoy to do - especially if it is within our preferences.
Fo example, if an animal lover saves animals - it is really within the realms of his or her comfort zones. It is something beyond this individual.
Where as, if we ask a non-animal lover to save animals, it might be a lot more challenging to this individual. Because it is not within this person's comfort zone.
So, if we are doing whatever good deeds within our comfort zones, then it is really not much of an effort. It would not amount to much of a MIND TRANSFORMATION now would it?
Mind transformation attacks what we are so accustomed to and what we prefer or like.
It pushes us out of our comfort zones in order for us to achieve a higher state of consciousness.
So, if we doing a lot of good deeds yet we remain within our comfort zones - how would that truly benefit our own spiritual development?
Just wondering out loud.
Sorry, I seem to have added my own set of questions onto WB's?
My thoughts on WB's questions - I think a good person can be of any race, culture, religion and name.
No matter who we are, Karma is still working and moving. No one can escape Karma, even if you say you don't believe in it.
So, if Karma does not discriminate against anyone - then, my guess is that merits would not as well.
The only real difference is whether one's religion would actually teach one the way out of samsara.
Now, that is a different story altogether.
As I am not familiar with any other religion, I cannot comment further.
But just knowing the Lamrim and having the Lamrim - one does have certain benefits, especially if one practises Dharma well and hold their vows very well.
Just my 2 cents worth, if we can even call it that.
This is a questions I have been thinking about, do we do something that we are so good at, we like so much and familiar with to and in our own opinion can contribute more or do we do something we are not competent with that contributes less?
Helena has pointed out that in order to have mind transformation, we have to constantly challenge our comfort zone. By doing something we are familiar with, we are staying in our comfort zone, we are not falling behind and yet we are not progressing. By doing something we are less competent or not familiar completely, we are challenging ourselves and really getting out of our comfort zone. This helps to train our mind and transform our mind for better, thus spiritual progress.
I have concluded that while doing something we are familiar with we should take on task that is completely new to us, something we are not familiar. This way, we are able to contribute and we are able to progress and grow.
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Dear beggar,
Thank you for starting such interesting topic.
Here's my humble opinion:
those people who think they are GOOD PEOPLE are ignorant - they do not know the criteria to be fulfilled to be a GOOD PERSON. e.g. they think they are good citizens because they do not go around robbing or killing people, but they forgot they are committing the sins of killing daily by eating meat !!
that's why we need dharma, with dharma and understanding of buddha's teachings, we will know what it takes to 'be a good person'...
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Interesting topic to debate. In fact, I've come across this question before among my so called very samsaric friends who never believe in spirituality or religion.
I'm quite involved in dharma activities on voluntary basis now and was thinking to join full time soon. Out of care and love for my friends, i encouraged them to join me in some activities like volunteering in events or community work during the weekends, and i got rejected 9 out of 10 times. Reasons given are :"oh it's weekend, i need to rest, i need to do some shopping, i need to accompany my family and friends, i'm lazy to go, go there for what? "
All sorts of lame excuses to cover their laziness and selfishness. Well, this is a norm when these people are not aware of the sufferings other people is bearing when they are indulging in their own sweet time doing nothing at home. Out of ignorance and indifference, they choose to shut one eye and not giving their hands to the needed.
I remembered one of my good friend whom i persistently asking her to come join me volunteering in dharma centre, gave me this very ignorant remark:" I wouldn't go dharma centre or seek for Buddha's help until i encounter something bad happen in my life, I've made myself very clear, so please do not ever ask me to go help or join them, even if i'm free, i wouldn't go." How should i help her?
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My question is: how do you get this point across to people? I have met with a lot of apathy from people who remain content in simply doing nothing, citing over and over, "but I'm a good person". How do we get people off the couch and into action?
So how do we kick off the Good Guy Syndrome?
Let's be honest,...we are all not free of the 8 worldly concerns, constantly seeking for pleasure and avoiding displeasure. On that basis, work with that person in terms of understanding what makes the person tick. It does take a lot of listening and observation before we know what to even share in hopes of helping someone change their ways.
It took hell-of-alot for me to change even the slightest...so being patient and consistent with others is a way of repaying kindness..
I totally agree that we need to be patient. Hard selling an idea to someone who's not open won't help. We have to find a suitable time and it may take years.
When I meet someone who says that "But I'm a good person.....", I may say, "But you can't help a person when he or she is dying. You can't help yourself as well when you're dying. Not only must we be a good person, we must also be equipped with knowledge and wisdom to overcome major obstacles."
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I am a good person and because I am a good person I will do more so that goodness is spread to many. Doing the right things is also good but doing the Right things so that many people benefit from the right goodness is the best kind of Good.
People in general feel/think they are good, and we should work with them from that level and not make them feel that their level of good is not good enough. Tell me honestly, who here likes to be told they are not good enough? Yes, it is ego but we all have ego and it takes time to reach a level of no ego and focus on the bigger picture. So, in getting people to the next level of goodness to contribute more and have a bigger purpose in life, we should be compassionate and not put them down but work with them from where they are and bring them to the next level.
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Good question... I'm struggling for the answer myself... haha.
I would try any method i can to bring someone into Dharma... but of course I don't push it or it'll scare them away. Most of the time, bringing people to do 'good deeds' works better with doing community service ie visit an old folks home, orphanage etc. then slowly, bring them over to your Dharma centre. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't... If you've done all you can and still they don't want to do more... then all we can do is wait, and hope that the hold of ignorance on them will come to an end soon.
Personally, i have some friends that i've totally stopped inviting to the Dharma centre I go to... i just didn't want them to reject coming to the centre too many times.... so i just stopped calling them.
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To me this is ignorant thinking. Many people have this idea that if we do not steal or kill anyone we are good people. Yes, we may not harm anyone, but how about eating meat? Indirectly we are creating the cause of killing. Isn’t that worst than harming?
Not doing anything or create harm does not equate to being a good person. If someone is wrong, have wrong thoughts and actions, if we don’t do anything to help that particular person, are we a good person?
My opinion is that a good person must do the right action with the right motivation that will benefit others.
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In my opinion, a good person is good when others say they are good. This only shows his consistency of goodness. Being good is a long term thing.
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This topic reminds me of my first meeting with a Tibetan Lama, when I professed what a good person I am, I even dared to claim that I am spiritual although not religious.
When challenged how good I am by the Lama, I had the audacity to claim how many people I have benefitted, and so on and on, until I was told that what I had been doing is exactly what an animal would do. Look after family and friends and those who would in turn benefit me or give me some form of comfort.
Now having some little knowledge of Dharma, the whole issue is whether every moment, do our thoughts and actions benefit someone or something which we may never meet or know.
The extended knowledge of what a good person is make me consciously aware that whether in public or private, I must cultivate all my thoughts and actions be of benefit to all things. AND UNCONDITIONALLY.
This new practice is not easy but at least it stops my arrogance of being a good person on hold.
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Pretty much like pgdharma said, ignorant thinking.
By not harming anyone to me is just at state called idle. Nor you are good or bad. This is because you don’t harm people but at the same time you don’t benefit people too. By being idle it doesn’t not bring you to anywhere.
As a start being idle personally to me is ok but as time goes one should be start learn up dharma and put it into practice. Spiritually we should do anything for benefitting others. By doing so we collect merits. By not doing anything beneficial there is not merits and probably just karma.
Being a good person for not benefiting other is not what we look for. Being a good person by doing anything to benefit other is a spiritual good person.
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When people tell themselves or other people that, it probably means that they want to believe that they are good people and that they don't want to go further to better themselves. Its just a lie that they want to believe to cover their insecurity most of the time. It is not easy to live life knowing that you have been the "bad" person -- everyone wants to believe they are good people, good examples and they made no mistakes but this simply isn't true..
I know because I used to do that too until I met my Lama and i realized that it was just an illusion that I should not hold on to. Because it is something that limits the mind and prevents it from expanding…I'm already good, what for i need to do more good? there is no need for me to push myself to do harder to benefit others…therefore this is a view that can stunt our spiritual and mental growth.
Nobody except for those who are ordained persons can say this because how much did they dedicate to being "good"? and if they are how come they still hurt people around them? Because they did not and they know it, that is why they say such things to hide and cover from.
As we understand the teachings more, we realize that there is no such thing as good person until we have reached enlightenment because during then we will never hurt or harm another being either consciously or unconsciously.
I also noticed that people who say "But I'm a good person" does not like to study or push themselves for the extra mile and are always afraid of Dharma teachings or to meet a Lama…if they're a good person why be afraid? hmmm…maybe they are very afraid to be exposed I guess…most people are..
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People in general feel/think they are good, and we should work with them from that level and not make them feel that their level of good is not good enough. Tell me honestly, who here likes to be told they are not good enough? Yes, it is ego but we all have ego and it takes time to reach a level of no ego and focus on the bigger picture. So, in getting people to the next level of goodness to contribute more and have a bigger purpose in life, we should be compassionate and not put them down but work with them from where they are and bring them to the next level.
I totally agree with Diamond Girl. We shouldn't feel irritated or frustrated with people who think it is "good enough" being a "good person" and minding their own business, bringing up the kids up well, hugging the spouse every day, taking out the garbage at night, leaving a tip at the counter... most of us have been brought up this way by our parents, who in turn have been brought up that way by their parents. It is nothing wrong, it is just that they didn't know any better. This concept of "being good" is a very very old ingrained habit.
I think one of the best things we can do to help open up such minds to the bigger good they can DO and not just BE, is to lead by example. This is what all the famous compassionate people did, they went on and do good everywhere and inspire others in their humble quiet way.
one such person is Pancho Ramos Stierle "If you want to be a rebel, be kind". Anyone who wants to DO MORE GOOD should REALLY read his touching story here and get inspired (if i had the merit to be able to recognise a Boddhisatva when i saw one, he would be it) http://www.dailygood.org/view.php?sid=127 (http://www.dailygood.org/view.php?sid=127)
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A good person takes care of themselves spiritually and emotionally and therefore think of others before themselves.A genuinely good person is someone who when walking down the street does not think he/she
is better than anyone else and is confident about who they are,not projecting their insecurities and what they
hate about themselves most on to others.A good person is a person who says please and thank you and means it but,are these qualities enough to make one a good person?
The practise of Lamrim is very beneficial to open up one's mind to do more with our lives.
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'I'm a good person and i didn't harm anyone' for me this statement is very subjective... for one person it could just mean i do nothing so i didn't harm anyone therefore i'm a good person but for another person it could be i hold the vows and didn't break my vows therefore i'm a good person.. or it could be i not hold vows but i only help other and i never harm people therefore i'm a good person..
i understand in this case is a first one that they do nothing and they didn't harm other therefore i'm a good person.. i believe that most of us are like that before we met buddhism and learn and understand because we are raise up in that way from our parents. But why we changed our thought and willing to do more? For some people because they understand that not to harm people is not good enough we should do thing that benefit other as much as we can. For some people because they saw someone do it and it click to their mind and it inspire them to do the same even not really understand the benefit..
so to answer the question, there are so many things to do to change their mind either by education, talk, explanation, show sample, let them feel and experience, and how our actions, how we treat people etc and it also depend on the how open of their mind to accept it.. hence to nature someone it depend on their believe and faith and the method we use with them with each person are different due to their karma ..