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General Buddhism => General Buddhism => Topic started by: WisdomBeing on December 05, 2012, 12:41:50 AM
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I just heard that a friend gave away one of her Buddha statues to somebody. I don't know her real motivation why she gave the statue away. I do think that she gave it away because she stopped going to the centre she was affiliated to. What I wanted to know was that if someone’s motivation to give a statue away to someone else was because she wasn’t happy being a Buddhist, does she still get merits? This is based on the thought that if one gives Buddha images away and the recipient of the image makes prayers to the image, the giver/sponsor of the image receives merits.
I do believe that this happens when the donor/sponsor of the image wishes to give the recipient the opportunity to do dharma practice. However, if the motivation to give is to get rid of the statue, does the giver still receive merits? Or perhaps in a rather twisted way, the person wants to get rid of the statue as well as thinks that the statue would benefit the recipient more than herself since she was estranged from the centre.
Just one of those things that flit through my head in the middle of the night.
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One of my friends left the Dharma center that we went to, and she gave me her statues because she was very disappointed with the way the center was run, and she gave the statues to me because she had 'given' up on her Dharma practice and she has not seek another center since because she was just so sick of going to Buddhist centers. I know many other people who give their personal statues away because they converted to another religion or have given up on their own Dharma center, so it is not necessarily about merits, but rather that they do not want to see that statue again as it reminds them of their failure to thrive in those centers.
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I think the donor still collect some merit even tho her motivation is impure. I feel that at least she not just throw statue away and choose to give to someone who she think can be benefit for their practice.
I think it same as people sponsor the temple because they want fame, they don't have pure motivation but their sponsorship benefit lot of people so there is some merit from that.
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Just like how the sun shines on all beings irregardlessly... so does the Buddha's blessings to all those who help another person in their spiritual growth.
In this case, I would say although her motivation is not set right... but who are we to judge a person? As long as we are not enlightened, anything we do is not from pure motivation. Therefore, what is the difference between us and her? Neither one of us have pure motivation, so why do we get good merits and she don't? She will receive merits from this action... there are many other ways to 'get rid' of statues... the fact that she decides to give it to someone who practices Dharma rather than throwing it into the dumpster is already indicative that even if she does not believe anymore, she still respects the Buddhas.
Of course she could have generated greater merits if she have a better motivation behind it... but definitely she collected good merits. After all, how can one not get any good merits by giving away Buddha images?
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To me, it depends on motivation. If the motivation to give the statue away is to get rid of it, how can any merit be derived from that?! however if its being given away with the motivation that the statue can bless the person and their family, or give them something spiritual in their lives, then of course we will receive merits when that person prays to that statue. Whether or not we receive merits would obviously, depend on our motivation to do a certain action.
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i reckon is still the motivation...firstly, the statue represent the body of the Buddhas and also one of the triple gems. Most importantly, we propitiates Him in our practice and make prostrations to him in wanting to eventually attained the same qualities as he has. If the motivation to give away is because we do not like it ; does it mean we do not want enlightenment anymore ? if so, we created the causes in not to become enlighten in the future. Making prostrations and offerings to our Guru and the triple gems with the correct motivation create immense merits. Not only physically making offerings but whenever we think of the triple gems at any moment or period of the day, it too will create imprints in our mind to be like them and plant seeds in our mind for enlightenment.
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i reckon is still the motivation...firstly, the statue represent the body of the Buddhas and also one of the triple gems. Most importantly, we propitiates Him in our practice and make prostrations to him in wanting to eventually attained the same qualities as he has. If the motivation to give away is because we do not like it ; does it mean we do not want enlightenment anymore ? if so, we created the causes in not to become enlighten in the future. Making prostrations and offerings to our Guru and the triple gems with the correct motivation create immense merits. Not only physically making offerings but whenever we think of the triple gems at any moment or period of the day, it too will create imprints in our mind to be like them and plant seeds in our mind for enlightenment.
If we give away our personal statues because we dont want to be a Buddhist anymore, well, I think that is self explanatory right? I mean, sometimes things do happen and people do change their religion or they give up on their spiritual path and they decide that they would not want to be Buddhist anymore, then we basically will create the cause to never be Buddhist again and it would be a demeritorious act as compared to giving away a statue because we want that person to benefit.
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To me, it depends on motivation. If the motivation to give the statue away is to get rid of it, how can any merit be derived from that?! however if its being given away with the motivation that the statue can bless the person and their family, or give them something spiritual in their lives, then of course we will receive merits when that person prays to that statue. Whether or not we receive merits would obviously, depend on our motivation to do a certain action.
How I view this situation is based on her choice of who to give. The fact that she gave the statues to someone who practices Buddhism is indicative that she knows this person will be better off having these statues to practice rather than she just keep it in her house (assuming she changed religions) or worst, throwing it away. Through this low motivation of giving away a statue she 'does not want or need anymore' to someone who needs or appreciates it, will generate some form of merit.
Although I do not favor what she did, however, there really is no reason to say she have bad motivation that do not bring merits through offering a Buddha statue. None of us have pure mind or intent.... all of us is tainted, some more some less. Even for people like us, who say we practice Buddhism, and yet many times we act funny towards our Guru, a living Buddha... coming and going as we please... is that not throwing away a 'Buddha statue' too through such actions?
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What I wanted to know was that if someone’s motivation to give a statue away to someone else was because she wasn’t happy being a Buddhist, does she still get merits?
… if the motivation to give is to get rid of the statue, does the giver still receive merits?
In both the above scenarios, she will not gain merits because her motivation of giving away the statue was not to benefit others.
Or perhaps in a rather twisted way, the person wants to get rid of the statue as well as thinks that the statue would benefit the recipient more than herself since she was estranged from the centre.
Yes. She will receive merits because she has the motivation of wanting to benefit the recipient despite her intention to get rid of the statue.
As long as the recipient of the Buddha statue has faith and sees the Buddha statue as Buddha, he will receive the blessing from the Buddha and hence, the Buddha statue becomes the field for accumulating merits. Even if the said recipient has no faith and doesn’t see the Buddha statue as Buddha, he would have already printed a seed of enlightenment in his mind after he had seen the Buddha statue.
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If you are no longer interested to remain a Buddhist and want to give away your statues so that these will be of benefit to others, you will continue to collect merits because your motivation was to benefit others.
However, if you want to give away just because you just want to be rid of them, then the motivation was not to benefit, so there can be no merits to collect.
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My opinion is that if we do not wish to be a Buddhist anymore and wants to give away the statues as we need to get rid of them, it is better to give to someone who appreciates and have faith in Buddha. Even though the motivation is to get rid of them, it will still generate some merits as it shows that we still have some respect by giving them away instead of destroying or throwing them away. The motivation may not be correct, but because of the recipient's faith in the Buddha, we will be able to receive some merits when the recipient prays to the statues.
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It is very much like what has been said, its all back to the motivation that we set when we want to offer the Buddha statue to others. If the motivation is just for our Samaric benefits the givers will not collect merit but if the motivation is for the benefits of others eventhohough if we want time get rid of it by the person would still have the perception of the Buddha images would benefits others, definitely it collect merits. Offering Buddha images will plant an imprint or seed for the person to meet the dharma in future. Generally its a good practices and meritorious for one to do so but what important is to understand the reason of the act in order for one fully aware their action.
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I agree with you WisdomBeing, i would not think the merits collection process depends on whether the donor is still practicing in a particular centre or not, rather the motivation behind the gifting.
If the donor had left a centre, giving away the related holy items to someone whom he thinks would benefit from it, is a very good way of treating the statues. The statue is just a statue if we do not have perceived value on it. If we truly respect the holy beings that the statues represent, we will treat the statues properly and respect.
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I think it is the motivtion again. When a person give away the Buddha statue because they want the receiver to benefit then the merits there. If the giver gives away the Buddha statue becuase they want to get rid of it and do not want to practice anymore, well at least they didn't just dump it and gave it away to someone who can benefit from it. I supposed the giving part is important and i think the merits are there.
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I think it is the motivation. When a person gives away statues, he will gain merits through this act. But if he gave it away just because he wanted to get rid of it, then obviously the giver will only rip a little benefit from this because of the motivation.
Rather than throwing it away, I the giver can save himself from bad karma of throwing away statues. He will get some merits at least because of the act of giving. Furthermore, the receiver will get the benefit when he sees the statues and plants some Dharma seeds in him. Who knows, maybe later the receiver will start his spiritual practice because of the gift.
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WisdomBeing, this is quite a tricky one... I feel that if she told the recipient of the statue that she didn't want the statue anymore coz of the reason you gave - then she accumulated bad karma.
However, if she just gave the statue away - it'll only be her loss. I don't see what negative karma can be accumulated by giving a statue away. After all, she benefited the recipient! The only horrible thing is the intention.
Intention - Don't want the statue as to not be associated with the temple.
Action - She gives it away.
Deed is complete - Her friend receives it.
Rejoice - She rejoices in giving it away.
Only the bad part is the intention!
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As I understand it, merits are only acquired when one has good motivation. And merits are kept only if one does dedications.
So in this example here, I believe the lady in question would not have accumulated any merits at all, as her motivation is to get rid of the statues, not to benefit the recipient.
And for those who say that what she did is better than throwing the statues away --- yes that is true, but why didnt she throw the statues away then? If it was because she was afraid of negative karma from throwing away statues, she is correct... but then again, her motivation for giving away her statues was not to benefit the other person, but to save herself from accruing that negative karma.
So once again, no merits.
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Well, I think statues of enlightened Buddhas have tremendous ability to bring benefit to people. I think Rihanna's answer should be correct. There's benefit in giving away statues to further other people's practice but in this case, only half or less merits is accrued because the motivation was to get rid of the statue and actually negative karma is accrued along with it. I think there's no difference where one 'throws' away the Buddha statue, the negative karma of throwing is accrued. However, positive or negative action associated with any Buddha statue will eventually become positive by the power of the enlightened being.
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I guess in a way it is a good thing to do (giving away the statue) rather than throwing it away?
The giver will gain good karma as the receiver will benefit from the statue. But at the end of the day, the motivation is still most important.
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I guess when someone no longer have faith in Buddhism and gave up the practices it'll automatically degenerating. In this case if someone would have to gave the Buddha statue to their friend with the motivation of giving up the practice i don't think, in my opinion they will get any merits if their friend were have to pray everyday. Perhaps if their friend is kind enough to dedicate some of the merit to them, maybe they will gain some but is it enough to cover for their negative karma which they are about to create after giving up the dharma?
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I guess when someone no longer have faith in Buddhism and gave up the practices it'll automatically degenerating. In this case if someone would have to gave the Buddha statue to their friend with the motivation of giving up the practice i don't think, in my opinion they will get any merits if their friend were have to pray everyday. Perhaps if their friend is kind enough to dedicate some of the merit to them, maybe they will gain some but is it enough to cover for their negative karma which they are about to create after giving up the dharma?
Hmm... you brought up a good point.
Does one get negative karma for giving up the karma? I wonder.
The Dharma is the truth, but it is also not the only truth as there are many other religious practices that many Dharma teachers will tell u is good to practice. One can be Christian and if they follow the true practice of Christianity, they too can very much be an enlightened being, take for example the truly compassionate Mother Teresa. After all, Buddha taught 84k teachings... perhaps one of these teachings end up becoming Christianity based religion? U never know... the history of Christianity has been rewritten so many times.
So does one get negative karma if the decide to give up Buddhism? If we say yes, then that is like the Christians telling us we will go to hell for not being Christian. So what's the real answer?
In my personal opinion, I think there is no negative karma for someone to decide to leave the Buddhist practice... but the only negative karma they will be collecting is they probably dwell more into samsaric activities once they give up Buddha Dharma. And it will be worst if they become extremely repulsive towards the Dharma that they start creating schism and bad mouthing Buddhism.
So what do you all think?
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I think it is all about the motivation behind giving away statues.
If the motivation is pure , that is to give the statute away so that the recipient is able to do his practice with stronger devotion and dedication , then the person who gives the statue away gains merits ' even more so if this person is giving without any expectations but to only benefit another.
However if the motivation is to 'get rid ' of the statues, because the person no longer believes or has lost faith in the religion, then i think giving the statues away to a believer is better than smashing statues up or just throwing away in the bin. This action is most disrespectful !
I know of a family who converted to another religion, and then threw away all the parent's Buddha statutes on the road. The poor parents were in such distress as they feared that their children would reap bad karma by their action, and since then they were constantly quarreling , right up to the parents death. The children's action had harmed and hurt their very own parents.
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Motivation or intent consciously or unconsciously precedes in all our actions.The ultimate motivation for giving is to generate the causes for attaining Enlightenment for the welfare of all sentient beings.
The value of an act of giving closely corresponds to the quality of the motivation.The narrower the intention, the smaller the merit,but if if it is given with a wish to attain liberation from cyclic existence,much greater merit will be generated.If by giving we aspire to the ultimate attainment of Buddhahood for the benefit of all sentient beings,the merits we acquire will be limitless.
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Well guys, just remember that one of the additional preliminary practices that we can do in addition to the standard ones is create 100,000 images - tsa-tsas, pictures, thangkas or statues of Buddhas. In this case, we can create images of Dorje Shugden. In Tibet, they prefer to make a mould and use it to make 100,000 little individual little tsa-tsas.
Creating images is a great practice to purify negative karma arisen from bad actions, sexual misconduct and ill health. It also creates the merit to achieve the Buddha body. That means the flourishing of our Dharma work and activities. This is a potent way to collect tremendous amounts of merits especially when we couple it with the right motivation of benefitting others. These little tsa-tsas and other images are usually distributed and given out as gifts or it could be placed inside statues and stupas for posterity.
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I know that many people mention that motivation is the key to collecting merits... so in the case where people returning their Buddha statue when they decide not to be Buddhist anymore... of course they do not have great motivation behind it... however, like I said before, it is the lesser evil of throwing it or destroying the image.
If we look closely, many people that go to the temple do not have such pure motivation in the first place. The number of people that truly practice Dharma in a particular centre only a hand full. In the light of that, what is difference between the two? Neither have pure motivation...
Take for example, some people, reluctantly sponsor a statue to the temple just to look good. So what's the difference between a person who sponsor reluctantly, and even have some degree of regret... compared to one who gives away their statue to pursue another religion?
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Although motivation is the key to how much merit we collect by giving away statutes, I think that any giving away of statutes which is out of respect then there should be merits collected.
This giving of statutes happens often by people who have left a faith or the center they practise from, but the fact that it is not just thrown away or thrashed is some form of respect.
Anyways for whatever reasons the person chooses to get rid of their statutes is not the demerit point but rather having left the Dharma is.
Bear in mind that for Practitioners to give away statutes to benefit another practitioner is extremely meritorious.