dorjeshugden.com
About Dorje Shugden => General Discussion => Topic started by: Mana on July 29, 2012, 01:14:15 PM
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(Note of some interest: Shugden Monastery is also known as Yangding Monastery, throughout history there were three Gaden Tripas that originated from this monastery including His Holiness 101st Lungrik Namgyal Rinpoche who resides in France.
Two Rinpoches from this monastery who were overseas discouraged people from practising Shugden, the monks protested, the Monastery sent warning letters to them, and one was expelled. And the other one deeply regretted his wrong actions and returned to practise Shugden pleasing the thousands of people in Daocheng County. Now at that place (Daocheng County) every monasteries practise Shugden, no more controversy. People in this whole area 100% devoted to Shugden.)
Zemey Rinpoche's enthronement at Yangding Monastery-video: http://www.dorjeshugden.com/?p=376 (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/?p=376)
Mana
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Who were these two Rinpoches who discouraged people from practising Shugden?
It is rejoicing to read this news that people in this Daocheng County, every monastery there is 100% Dorje Shugden practitioners. It goes to show that in Tibet China... Dorje Shugden practice will continue and grow again and this will tehn be assimilated in other parts of China. From here I believe that Dorje Shugden practice will explode out in to Asia and other parts of the world for it is just a matter of time when you get a 1billion nation accepting it naturally.
China’s View on Shugden http://www.dorjeshugden.com/spread-the-word/write-a-letter/make-a-difference-letter-29/ (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/spread-the-word/write-a-letter/make-a-difference-letter-29/)
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(Note of some interest: Shugden Monastery is also known as Yangding Monastery, throughout history there were three Gaden Tripas that originated from this monastery including His Holiness 101st Lungrik Namgyal Rinpoche who resides in France.
Two Rinpoches from this monastery who were overseas discouraged people from practising Shugden, the monks protested, the Monastery sent warning letters to them, and one was expelled. And the other one deeply regretted his wrong actions and returned to practise Shugden pleasing the thousands of people in Daocheng County. Now at that place (Daocheng County) every monasteries practise Shugden, no more controversy. People in this whole area 100% devoted to Shugden.)
Zemey Rinpoche's enthronement at Yangding Monastery-video: [url]http://www.dorjeshugden.com/?p=376[/url] ([url]http://www.dorjeshugden.com/?p=376[/url])
Mana
This is interesting. Where the majority rules, everyone has to listen to the majority. The ban has not reached Tibet because CTA has no power in Tibet and the monasteries are operating as per normal and as per tradition since Lama Tsongkhapa's time. So in Tibet there are still monasteries that practice the pure Dharma, and they seem to be unaffected by CTA's bans and political games. No swearing in that they did not practice Dorje Shugden, no sanctions, no splits, no discriminations, nothing. Just pure Dharma and if you dont follow the rules, you are expelled. If you want to make politics out of Dharma practice (because this issue is very clearly a political one, it does not take someone very learned to see through that the protector issue is nothing more than politics at play, only people who do not want to look deeper into the issue would want to just accept what the Dalai Lama said) then you're expelled. I actually feel very happy with this piece of news because it shows that there are people who do practice pure Dharma, devoid of politics.
Dorje Shugden in China alone would make more sense than Dorje Shugden being banned elsewhere because we dont need a whole legion of Dorje Shugden practitioners who are insincere, just a few sincere ones that are committed and will go all the way. Now I see why China is a better venue.
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:P
Buddhism originated in India and died in India but spread over and rooted in China, Japan, Korea, Tibet etc. News informed that Buddhism has been returning back into India again ;D
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Just imagine the tables turned! It's the other way round now for Yangding Monastery and Daocheng County in Tibet, China. Two of Yangding Monastery's Rinpoches, residing abroad, try to discourage people from practicing Shugden. The immediate result? The monks in Shangding Monastery protest. Warning letters are sent to these two Rinpoches. One stubborn Rinpoche is expelled and the other deeply regrets his action and goes back to Shugden practice! How lovely that Yangding Monastery and Daocheng County in China are 100% Shugden practitioners! May more monasteries follow suit, keeping politics away from religion and practice. Monasteries in China can do that because the 'arm' of CTA cannot reach them. The ban on Shugden practice cannot affect them. May Shugden practice flourish in China through the monasteries.
Yangding Monastery is a Shugden Monastery because of Kyabje Zemey Rinpoche, a heart disciple of Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche. Now Zemey Rinpoche's incarnation is back and is fast growing up to soon assume his previous incarnation's role as a great Lama and practitioner of Shugden. Kyabje Choktrul Rinpoche has already been given the initiation of Shugden practice by Lama Jampa Ngodrup.
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It is a fact that the CTA has no power in Tibet and China and also is impotent in India and other parts of the world. All they can do is to Ban the practice, force abbots to enforce this ban, send thugs to enforce the ban and force families to take side and basically act like the SS in their own very backyard. What they cannot achieve ie the independence of Tibet, they take it out on their own people. It is like a loser of a husband, coming home and blame the wife and children and beat them up. Shame on the CTA.
On the bright side, regions upon regions in Tibet and China and other parts of the world are openly practicing the Protector. Daocheng County in Tibet must be the happiest place on earth. Imagine, the whole county practicing. What joy?! Eat your heart out, CTA!
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Yangding Monastery is a Shugden Monastery because of Kyabje Zemey Rinpoche, a heart disciple of Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche. Now Zemey Rinpoche's incarnation is back and is fast growing up to soon assume his previous incarnation's role as a great Lama and practitioner of Shugden. Kyabje Choktrul Rinpoche has already been given the initiation of Shugden practice by Lama Jampa Ngodrup.
It is only a matter of time before the great revival in Dorje Shugden practice takes place. The ban has been in effect for quite some time but far from having any great effect, it has in fact led to a propagation of the practice all over the world and built the resolve of it's practitioners and galvanized trust in the Protector.
Even the Dalai Lama is aware that the Dorje Shugden practice has grown tremendously but what His Holiness and the pro-ban people do not know is how large the practice is now because many great Lamas still practice quietly. The day will come soon when anti-Shugden people will be a minority and that is when harmony within the Sangha will be restored because anti-Shugden monks will surely and easily sway back to the truth again.
Zemey Rinpoche has returned like so many great Lamas, and will soon resume His Protector practice. Each great Lama and practitioner of Dorje Shugden who returns to the practice in a new reincarnation is yet another concrete proof that the Dalai Lama misled people by calling Shugden an evil spirit. How can someone who worships an evil spirit that supposedly harms the emanation of Chenrezig return as a tulku to again take up the propitiation of the same evil spirit? Makes no sense.
We see the dissemination of so many false information and news about Dorje Shugden by the CTA and the office of HHDL, but where it really counts for example in China, the ban has the opposite effect.
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Yangding Monastery is a Shugden Monastery because of Kyabje Zemey Rinpoche, a heart disciple of Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche. Now Zemey Rinpoche's incarnation is back and is fast growing up to soon assume his previous incarnation's role as a great Lama and practitioner of Shugden. Kyabje Choktrul Rinpoche has already been given the initiation of Shugden practice by Lama Jampa Ngodrup.
It is only a matter of time before the great revival in Dorje Shugden practice takes place. The ban has been in effect for quite some time but far from having any great effect, it has in fact led to a propagation of the practice all over the world and built the resolve of it's practitioners and galvanized trust in the Protector.
Even the Dalai Lama is aware that the Dorje Shugden practice has grown tremendously but what His Holiness and the pro-ban people do not know is how large the practice is now because many great Lamas still practice quietly. The day will come soon when anti-Shugden people will be a minority and that is when harmony within the Sangha will be restored because anti-Shugden monks will surely and easily sway back to the truth again.
HHDL's worldly opinion of things comes from the opinions of those around him. He knows that Dorje Shugden is growing tremendously in China and Mongolia now but those around him are barely aware about this fact because they choose not to know. They are in denial. Their insecurity of their trust in the Dalai Lama has caused them to act in ways that are negative to compensate for their lack of security and faith in the Dalai Lama.
Zemey Rinpoche has returned like so many great Lamas, and will soon resume His Protector practice. Each great Lama and practitioner of Dorje Shugden who returns to the practice in a new reincarnation is yet another concrete proof that the Dalai Lama misled people by calling Shugden an evil spirit. How can someone who worships an evil spirit that supposedly harms the emanation of Chenrezig return as a tulku to again take up the propitiation of the same evil spirit? Makes no sense.
Just because the CTA thinks a lama is evil it does not make them evil. They banned Tarantha and Chankya Rolpa Dorje but they came back to mongolia instead. THEIR LOSS. Now Zemey Rinpoche and Dagom Rinpoche are both returning, both outside the reach of CTA and CTA will never reap the benefits from these high lamas. serves them right.
We see the dissemination of so many false information and news about Dorje Shugden by the CTA and the office of HHDL, but where it really counts for example in China, the ban has the opposite effect.
In many countries where the ban is not prominent, or that the fanatics are not in control, or that there is true religious freedom, there are still many pockets of people practicing Dorje Shugden. Not just in China. CTA's ban only works for Dharamsala and fanatical people but not everyone else.
Thanks again for your points. I dont think that they are not aware that the practice is very extensive and widespread around they world, they are merely being in denial to show their blind support to the Dalai Lama which HHDL keeps telling them to not do so. Sad huh?
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It is indeed rejoicing news to know that Dorje Shugden is being practised 100% in Daocheng County in China. There is no restriction or ban whatsoever imposed in China. CTA and those who are against the Dorje Shugden practice should look at the people in the Daocheng Country – had they become worst off from practising Dorje Shugden? No! They enjoy greater spiritual freedom than the Tibetans in exile.
If Dorje Shugden is a spirit, it is impossible for Yangding Monastery to produce three Gaden Tripas! It goes without proving that Dorje Shugden is Buddha Manjushri and not a spirit as claimed. Lift the ban CTA! You have no basis to continue the ban.
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This is interesting. Where the majority rules, everyone has to listen to the majority. The ban has not reached Tibet because CTA has no power in Tibet and the monasteries are operating as per normal and as per tradition since Lama Tsongkhapa's time. So in Tibet there are still monasteries that practice the pure Dharma, and they seem to be unaffected by CTA's bans and political games. No swearing in that they did not practice Dorje Shugden, no sanctions, no splits, no discriminations, nothing. Just pure Dharma and if you dont follow the rules, you are expelled. If you want to make politics out of Dharma practice (because this issue is very clearly a political one, it does not take someone very learned to see through that the protector issue is nothing more than politics at play, only people who do not want to look deeper into the issue would want to just accept what the Dalai Lama said) then you're expelled. I actually feel very happy with this piece of news because it shows that there are people who do practice pure Dharma, devoid of politics.
Dorje Shugden in China alone would make more sense than Dorje Shugden being banned elsewhere because we dont need a whole legion of Dorje Shugden practitioners who are insincere, just a few sincere ones that are committed and will go all the way. Now I see why China is a better venue.
I didnt know that about Yangding...
But the way you write it Ensapa, makes the monastery sound like a relief, like a safe haven. Must be nice to know you can go somewhere to do what you love, without the threat of someone coming after you for it. You know to live in a culture of fear must be difficult where your constantly worried about who will grass on you.
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I didnt know that about Yangding...
But the way you write it Ensapa, makes the monastery sound like a relief, like a safe haven. Must be nice to know you can go somewhere to do what you love, without the threat of someone coming after you for it. You know to live in a culture of fear must be difficult where your constantly worried about who will grass on you.
Thank you for your comments, DharmaDefender. I am just thinking aloud, logically, from the point of view of what would have happened if the ban did not take place. Monasteries would be monasteries and they would be practicing Dorje Shugden and doing Dharma practice without the political mess that they are in now, in Dharamsala. It is ironic because with so called religious suppression in Tibet, there are pure monasteries who stick strictly to the monastic rules but in a place with so called religious freedom in Dharamsala, there is so much politics and so much obstacles for practitioners. Everyone just focuses on 'destroying' Dorje Shugden and his followers, as if that would hasten their enlightenment. But it does not, it will not, and it never will. And we have a very clear contrast on the effects of the ban on monasteries. If monasteries remain neutral towards Dorje Shugden, all they have is to follow the Vinaya. And by adhering to the Vinaya and not something that they think is the fast track to enlightenment, they truly become a place for real practitioners.
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Two Rinpoches from this monastery who were overseas discouraged people from practising Shugden, the monks protested
;D
There was a wise saying from zen master that ???????????. Which means the mind of all secularism in the context of politicalism and materialism among others can be disorientated or disenchanted, but if there are united practitioners who pursuing the path of liberation in a temple, their unison of mind must not be disunited in all costs. :-*
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??????????? http://www.sutrapearls.org/proverbs/pr09_21.htm (http://www.sutrapearls.org/proverbs/pr09_21.htm)
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This is such wonderful news to know that every monasteries in Daocheng County practise Dorje Shugden. It also amazes me that the people there are 100% devoted to Shugden. The ban on Dorje Shugden imposed by the CTA has propelled the great protector to worldwide fame. People all over the world are exposed to the truth and CTA must come out with new reasons on imposing the ban. It is so obvious now that DS is not a spirit as claimed and practicing DS does not shorten the life of HHDL. Just take a read on the stories of all the high lamas who were devoted to DS in their previous lives and came back again to continue their practice.
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Two Rinpoches from this monastery who were overseas discouraged people from practising Shugden, the monks protested
;D
There was a wise saying from zen master that ???????????. Which means the mind of all secularism in the context of politicalism and materialism among others can be disorientated or disenchanted, but if there are united practitioners who pursuing the path of liberation in a temple, their unison of mind must not be disunited in all costs. :-*
If only the Dalai Lama and the CTA sees it as this way, there would not be Shar Ganden and Serpom.
If only the Dalai Lama and the CTA sees it as this way, there would be harmony in Tibetan Buddhism
If only the Dalai Lama and the CTA sees it as this way, there would be no hate speech against Dorje Shugden everywhere online. Everyone would still be doing their own Dharma practice and forums like esangha would still exist because they promoted Dharma and harmony.
If only the Dalai Lama and the CTA sees it as this way, Lama Osel would manifest as a full fledged Lama.
If only the Dalai Lama and the CTA sees it as this way, FPMT centers around the world would have grown by now and not stagnate.
If only the Dalai Lama and the CTA sees it as this way, many Dorje Shugden practitioners need not suffer, and high lamas would not be thrown to the streets just for practicing Dorje Shugden.
If only the Dalai Lama and the CTA sees it as this way, Tibet would have been independent by now.
Sadly, the world is not perfect. The monks forgot entirely that whether or not the temple practices Dorje Shugden, it does not matter because everyone is practicing the same thing: the Buddha's teachings. They let politics affect them. sad.
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There are big provinces in China whereby majority Tibetans/Chinese are Shugden worshipper. They are very united and their devotion is very strong and not wavered over the years. Everyone knows Shugden and many of them attribute whatever goodness in their life is because Shugden assisted them. Therefore, I am not surprise that the table turns in Yangding.
Additional to this, these monasteries in these provinces are very well supported by the Chinese Government, some are made into a tourist attraction like the monastery in Shangri-la and it attracts on the average 10k visitors per day internally from China and also from other part of the world. What I want to say here is that no matter how Shugden practitioners and lamas are oppress in the world, the practice is growing bigger and more so in CHINA. The biggest population in the world.
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This is such wonderful news to know that every monasteries in Daocheng County practise Dorje Shugden. It also amazes me that the people there are 100% devoted to Shugden. The ban on Dorje Shugden imposed by the CTA has propelled the great protector to worldwide fame. People all over the world are exposed to the truth and CTA must come out with new reasons on imposing the ban. It is so obvious now that DS is not a spirit as claimed and practicing DS does not shorten the life of HHDL. Just take a read on the stories of all the high lamas who were devoted to DS in their previous lives and came back again to continue their practice.
Yet, due to wanting to be on the right side of the fence, many people choose to not see the truth or the other side of the story and they wallow in their own fears. Sometimes, I do wonder why would people refuse to actually do research on this subject matter and instead go with popular opinion? Perhaps it is their fear, or perhaps they just want to play it safe and follow the crowd, what can go wrong, they said, but in doing so they actually go against the teachings that they were looking for because their motivation to seek the Dharma was wrong in the first place: they seek the Dharma for the sake of self preservation rather than for actual practice of wanting to benefit others. If results resemble the cause, what kind of results would one get if one seeks out a teacher or follow a particular tradition or study the Dharma based on selfish fears and reasons? Nothing good, right? So perhaps, this is the reason why some practitioners dont get results in their practice, because they are too engrossed in this "cult" thing until they are unable to see both sides of the fence anymore.
Dorje Shugden is growing at a very fast rate around the world now and there will be more and more mentions of him on the news. If there isnt, HHDL will bring him up and talk about him that will make people think about what is going on and make people actually investigate about Dorje Shugden rather than just follow the crowd. For China tho, Dorje Shugden is very big and it will only grow and increase from here.
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I did a bit of research about yangding monastery but unfortunately there isn't much information available in English. However, I did find this interesting excerpt about what may be yangding monastery:
Shonden Monastery
(12,400 feet and 10Km to the northeast of the township, Geluk Sect)
Originally it was a Kagyupa monastery.In 1415 a Geluk monk with the name of Lhodzui Lunje made a change. In the background of overwhelming Gelukpa in Tibetan areas it developed into the largest one in Daocheng.
Highlights: *No.1 Mani Pile
On the left of the monastery there is a huge Mani pile regarded as the first in Kham region
*Log Genitals
The locals believed there were a lot of ogresses in Daocheng and they would stir up trouble. Lamas in monasteries were responsible for getting rid of them. Avoiding killing any life lamas erected these log genitals, with which those fleshly and conquettish succubuses would be satisfied and made no trouble.
Also this interesting story that shows just what the attitude in the Tibetan communities loyal to shugden is like:
In one of the huts, I met an old man named Tenzin:
Tenzin had one peculiar thing in his hut: a picture of the deity Dorje Shugden. This god is very controversial in Tibetan Buddhist circles. Some religious authorities have suggested that it would be better not to worship Shugden, however the deity has many devout believers, both inside and outside Tibet, who have refused to give him up. In Xiangcheng, they are especially numerous. In fact, the whole county seems to be one hundred per cent believers in Shugden. The monastery overlooking the Xiangcheng County town, Ganden Shangpo Monastery, had a large gilt relief carving of Shugden inside. It is really a splendid monastery, with 800 monks and the finest interior furnishings I have ever seen in my travels in Kham.
My translator, a conventional sort, would have preferred not to talk to these Shugden people. Having explained to me once about Shugden, he thereafter referred to the deity in veiled, derisive tones as " that god." When he spotted the picture on Tenzin's table, he said, "there is a picture of - that god." He could not, however, explain to me what's the problem with Shugden. Since then, I have discovered a great deal of information, both for and against, on the Web. The curious reader should have no problem finding out more.
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It is heart warming to learn that there is a 100% spread of people practising Lord Shugden's practice in This Daocheng County. It is important when you have everybody's support in a county believing in a practice that benefits people very much in a county together, part of the reason why the the two Rinpoches from overseas failed in their attempts to discourage people from practising Lord Shugden is the unity of the people and people see the benefits from it. And also that there are more and more Lord Shugden practitioners (some even High Lamas) revealing themselves from their 'hideout' by declaring they are Lord Shugden practitioner gave them the belief that worshiping Lord Shugden is not worshiping a spirit that can shorten Dalai Lama's life.
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If the rumor that practicing Dorje Shugden shortens the Dalai Lama's life was true, then with this amount of people praying to Dorje Shugden he would have passed by now or had a stroke or something, right? HHDL is still in one piece, so it is pretty clear that he cannot be affected by a Dharma protector. If there are so many more monasteries like this one, dotted around Tibet, then for sure there are so many more people who practice Dorje Shugden in China alone. Lets not count in NKT, Lama Gangchen, etc...