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General Buddhism => General Buddhism => Topic started by: hope rainbow on February 09, 2012, 07:11:25 PM
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Remember the lamrim teaching on the three pots?
If you were to have to identify the pot that is the strongest in your attitude/behavior, which one would it be?
1. the up-side down pot?
that is a closed-mind that can not receive any Dharma, or that resists to the Dharma.
2. the leaky pot?
the pot that receives the Dharma, understands it but then forgets it quickly afterwards.
3. the dirty pot?
the pot that listens to Dharma but with bias intentions (wordly intentions) and pollutes the Dharma in its mind, making it worldly for all that it can be possible.
4. or all pots equally?
Please vote, you will see the result of the poll right after you have indicated your choice.
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I would say number 4 because :
1) sometimes when certain teachings are pointing directly to the fault I'm guilty of, I will be like the upside turned pot - nothing can go in. In other words, I'm being selective in receiving the dharma.
2) Most , if not all of us, are leaky pots at one time or other. If we were not, we would have results to show in our practice.
3) Well, I can't honestly say my motivation is completely pure and sincere - smelly pot.
Ya, I am guilty of being like a combination of all the 3 pots :-\
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I am the no 4 pot.
I am thinking even after many years of learning the dharma, what are still the causes for me being the no 4 pot?
selectiveness, stubborness, egoistic, not being mindful, excuses, just to name a few.
Got to work on all these to be a better pot to receive the dharma.
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I am more towards LEAKY POT, I want to get rid of this in order to receive and understand dharma in depth
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Leaky pot... but I wonder if one pot can be inter-related with the the other 2 pots?
Example 1: Leaky pot --> forget what was taught --> equivalent to not listening to Dharma --> indirectly is an upturned pot since not making effort to remember what was Dharma, this is sort of like a passive aggressive way of resisting Dharma?
Example 2: Leaky pot --> forget what was taught/ selective memory --> bias intentions (why remember some, forget some, if we are truly sincere in learning Dharma?) --> not remembering fully what was taught would result in wrong understanding of Dharma --> contaminated Dharma knowledge --> dirty pot?
I was told that for people who have met with the Dharma, it is most dangerous to be a leaky pot. Anyone know why this is so?
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i would think i have all the three pots but more strongest on the leaky pot...
i am so fortunate to receive Dharma, do not have much bias on Dharma, but still always forget the teaching.
Currently, i learn to jot down notes and i still need to refer back to the notes to contemplate more so that the teaching can sink in. i believe we should also collect more merits for Dharma to get to us.
May i know if there is any way to help to counter 'leaky' effectively? Would chant more Manjushri mantra will help?
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I would say all pots almost equally as I have traits of a closed mind, forgetfulness and with bias intentions. It is part of my practice to actually realise that these traits indeed exist in me and that it should be irradicated in order for my Dharma journey to flourish. Failing which it would all be just a waste of time... as it is no different from samsara if we view Dharma from a samsaric point of view.
Hence it is most important that we find a Guru that can and will put a big fat mirror in front of our faces to show us who we really are. Most of us have aeons of habituations that need to be shattered like the mirror in front of us and our Guru is the one that can see right through to the real us inside and wants us to realise this.
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I would say No 4 as all of them are inter related but the strongest is leaky pot.
Having the fortune to meet with a Guru that patiently guides me in my spiritual journey, I am putting more effort to remember what is taught (cos i am the leaky pot) and not be selective on what is taught (like the up side down pot) . So even though I have the fortune to receive the dharma, my mind still needs to be free of bias intentions (dirty pot). Got to work harder to mend the leaky pot and clean up the dirty pot before its too late and turned into upside down pot.
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I would say No 4 as all of them are inter related but the strongest is leaky pot.
Having the fortune to meet with a Guru that patiently guides me in my spiritual journey, I am putting more effort to remember what is taught (cos i am the leaky pot) and not be selective on what is taught (like the up side down pot) . So even though I have the fortune to receive the dharma, my mind still needs to be free of bias intentions (dirty pot). Got to work harder to mend the leaky pot and clean up the dirty pot before its too late and turned into upside down pot.
Well said !
I guess this represents most of dharma practitioners as we need to work hard to be a clean and perfect pot with its mouth facing up!
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For me, I am mostly a leaky and dirty pot.
I contaminated the Dharma with worldly concerns hoping the Dharma will bring worldly happiness; which it does; but I am not so sure if my motivations are pure enough.
I am leaky because, once I understand a certain Dharma I do not meditate on it enough to internalise it. Then I tend to forget.
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I would be the leaky pot most of all.
Everything I have been taught, still has not been practiced by myself - because I have forgotten the teachings...or more accurately, chose not to improve myself.
What would a lazy pot come under, I wonder?..If there was a category for lazy pot, I'd totally top it. I guess a lazy pot is a combination of upside down and leaky pot.
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I am guilty of being leaky pot! As much as i enjoy teachings and understand them when it was delivered, however sometimes I find it hard to recall what I have just learned!
I think I have to recite more of Manjushri's mantra to increase my memory!! :o
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I'm the leaky pot. I practise some dharma teachings and the rest I forget. Perhaps it's a deep habituation of selectiveness manifesting into forgetfulness.
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I am all the 3 pots depending on what I hear and react to the Dharma. I am complex and so different aspects of Dharma challenges my believes and stupidity.
But knowing so, is the first step to practise for perfect pot, if there is one in samsara.
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When I started learning the Dharma about three years ago, I was all the three pots rolled into one. Now, with practice and effort, I've overcome most of the obstacles to learning, except for the leaky pot and the upside down pot. This is also because I have poor memory and cannot remember all that I've heard or read. During teachings, I take notes so that I can refer to them when necessary. Sometimes, when listening to a talk, my mind is distracted and some information is lost. To overcome this, I've to learn to focus and concentrate.
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A leaking pot for me.
Many teaching were being taught and read. After a while will forget the teaching unless re read the note I made during the teaching.
I noticed that those teaching that we put into practice we can remember better as we are reminding ourselves daily, every moment. One of the reasons to be the leaking pot is being selective on what to practice. We choose what is convenient for us and not so painful (protecting the ego). I agree with Positive Change that having a Guru is very important. A Guru who is non stop pressing our weak points, until we change or let go.
Besides, daily do a lot of Shugden Kawang and Mantra helps to improve my memory and stamina during Dharma teaching.
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I would say No 4 as all of them are inter related but the strongest is leaky pot.
Having the fortune to meet with a Guru that patiently guides me in my spiritual journey, I am putting more effort to remember what is taught (cos i am the leaky pot) and not be selective on what is taught (like the up side down pot) . So even though I have the fortune to receive the dharma, my mind still needs to be free of bias intentions (dirty pot). Got to work harder to mend the leaky pot and clean up the dirty pot before its too late and turned into upside down pot.
I saw the poll results and so far the highest is the Leaky Pot -- all of us are guilty of either any of the pots and maybe no. 4. I am guilty of being pot no. 4 --- leaky. I too must get my leaks patched so that the dharma that has been lovingly parted to me by my guru is not wasted.
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I'm no.4, all of the 3 pots. I feel ashamed that I was not fully open for Dharma, therefore I was being selective, choose to listen to the good one and ignore the bad one. My forgetfulness and and stubbornness had made the dharma teachings that i've received gone in the wind. My motivation and intention in dharma was vague, i have to admit it honestly.
Dharma can never be wrong. Only our impure mind and delusions make us have wrong views on dharma, that's why we kinda reject it in a way to cover our mistakes, bad habituations and refuse to change.
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Me - Leaky pot
All the teachings that I listen or learn, I don't take the time to contemplate deeply to truly understand it and then apply it. Because of that it's easy to forget. Same as in school. When I truly listen to the teacher and understand what the teacher is teaching, I will remember it always and not even need a text book or notebook to refer too. I should apply the same with dharma. Instead of trying to memorize, try to understand instead so that it goes in deeply to my heart and to have dharma teachings constantly in my mind always 24/7.
Sigh. Looks like the leaky pot is the winner. Pretty bad seeing that it means we have the fortune and perhaps (some) merits to receive dharma but use it to the full advantage. With effort, this can change.
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Though I would like to think of me as ONLY the leaky pot, I have to be honest that actually I am all 3 pots at one time or another :P
I can blame it on degenerate ages, modern day distraction etc., but I can"t deceive myself :(
Most of the time we try to convince ourself that oh actually I come to dharma because I want to help people or I want to benefit others, bla bla bla but the truth is... well... perhaps we just want to be accepted or find friends, to take advantage of other people etc... bad me... or rather smelly me hehe... yep the smelly pot...
Then we start to receive teachings, unfortunately we never really pay attention or bother about improving ourselves. We will say oh this or that teaching is so wonderful, it touched my heart, oh I shed tears hearing it... but then we never chnage our old habits... still the same anger me, the same lazy me... everything I learnt goes out immediately within days... leaky pot is like my 2nd name...
When our teacher started to intensified his teaching for us... he pushes our 'buttons' but we refuse to listen... we stubornly hold on to our ideas, our opinions, our attachments... no one knows better than me! So what is that my friend? Yep the over-turn pot... that's me too...
I'm not proud to admit this but I know at one time or another I am guilty of all the 3 pots...
Now after realising my own short-comings, then what? There is only one choice - CHANGE!
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Oopss... i would say 3 of them :(.
Learn dharma but no apply. Give excuse to myself and hide. Is time to face all this weakness and transform myself immediately through read more dharma and gain more knowledge from there.
Manjushri mantra is work! I get the Manjushri prayer from my Guru, is work! It really help to improve my memory.
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I think I'm more to the leaky pot.
Forgetting things that being taught quickly.
We will not get any benefits by forgetting, especially a big loose in Dharma.
I have heard this from my Lama that he push him self to stay focus every time his Guru gives teaching and never ever fall asleep. This is how he shows his appreciation to his Lama who has been so compassionate to teach in long hour.
Actually being in any of the 3 ports is a big no no in studying dharma because nothing goes in to our mind that able to benefit others.
Thinking it deeper they could be al sort of excuses but mainly is focus!
There are retreat or puja we can do to help our memory but if we can't stay focus we are unable to do the puja/retreat too.
There are still effort and determination needed for us to push ourself in order to prepare ourself.
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i would say no.4 all 3 types of pot..
but mostly will be leaky pot as lot of teaching i understand well during the teaching but after i woke up in the next day i could not remember about it already.. very scary. because of our selective mind that why what we like we remember and then forget about the rest of things.
i think to take a note for read later and always contemplate about it, will help to refresh our mind.. Otherwise it back to square one and just wasting time as will be no progress.
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Actually, in the Lamrim, the order in which the pots are presented has a reason .
1. upside down 2. smelly 3. leaky
(1) mental block = cannot learn = no results
(2) ineffective learning = no results
(3) forgetting all = wasted learning = no results
All the above really means the same thing from point of view of getting results. The order of it is to teach us that unless we study correctly and diligently, even if we had put successively more and more effort from (1)-(3) , results will not come. The last example of leaky pot means we might as well not study in the first place !
Generally, we are all three.
Pot 1: Can anyone follow all the instructions of our Guru or the Lamrim?
Pot 2: Only enlightened beings hv pure mind.
Pot 3 : Our mindfulness have to be highly developed through meditation and /or we have gained realizations whereby the object of study had mixed with our mind and no longer as an external one.
As to the question of whether we are all 3 in equal proportion, that would be subjective experience.
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Actually, in the Lamrim, the order in which the pots are presented has a reason .
1. upside down 2. smelly 3. leaky
(1) mental block = cannot learn = no results
(2) ineffective learning = no results
(3) forgetting all = wasted learning = no results
All the above really means the same thing from point of view of getting results. The order of it is to teach us that unless we study correctly and diligently, even if we had put successively more and more effort from (1)-(3) , results will not come. The last example of leaky pot means we might as well not study in the first place !
Generally, we are all three.
Pot 1: Can anyone follow all the instructions of our Guru or the Lamrim?
Pot 2: Only enlightened beings hv pure mind.
Pot 3 : Our mindfulness have to be highly developed through meditation and /or we have gained realizations whereby the object of study had mixed with our mind and no longer as an external one.
As to the question of whether we are all 3 in equal proportion, that would be subjective experience.
Thank you KhedrubGyatso for a very precise explanation based on Lamrim.
I wonder if I got the meaning right... so can I say that we will still be all the 3 pots until we achieved enlightenment? As long as I am not enlightened yet, I am ALL the 3 pots?
I used to think that we got better chance with the smelly pot - thinking that we can change our motivation when we learn more dharma... seems there is no change at all until we became "enlightened being"... so very long way to go worr..
Anyway, we should not use this as excuse not to change from the 3 pots. One way we can try to change is by contemplating the benefits of listening to Dharma. We should think of all the benefits as motivation so that we continue to try to change.
“We have to learn the teachings on order to know how to meditate and how to discriminate between constructive and destructive thoughts and emotions. We have to hear teachings so that we know how to counteract our disturbing attitudes and how to increase our good qualities.” - Venerable Thubten Chodron
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I am mostly the leaky pot. i do not focus all the way when listening to Dharma and I forget easily what I have been taught unless I take down notes.For a long while, I have been taking down notes studiously and copiously. I now find a mountain of notes and don't know how to sort them out. I believe, one needs to contemplate and reflect daily on the Dharma teachings one has received. Otherwise they're easily forgotten and lost.
At times, i'm also the dirty pot as my strong negative habituations have caused my mind to close up and to 'resist' some of the teachings.
At other times, I have also been the upside down pot. This is when the eight worldly concerns get the better of me.
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I think I'm more of a leaky pot. I have to keep on reminding myself and always forgetting and have to go back and learn and read up again and again. Something stays put in my mind some just need constant reminder and checking. I guess this is due to countless bad habituations. But overall i think I'm all of the pots, which it think it is all co related. I have to stay focus more and more determined to be better.
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I see from the survey results that the most common pot is the "leaky" pot and on reflection, I am also a leaky pot. We become a leaky pot when we listen, understand , agree but very quickly forget the dharma we heard. There is only one reason for that, i.e. we take the information in and hold it merely as head knowledge and we fail to APPLY the dharma we hear.
The surest way not to forget is to apply the teachings and incorporate it into our lives and daily routine. Our heads are so full of mundane knowledge that are actually useless to our spiritual well-being. And we give so much attention and application to things that are actually harmful to us.
Dharma knowledge has the most benefit when it is immediately applied and when applied properly it causes our understanding of dharma to increase even more. The best evidence that we are learning dharma properly is this...we see results.
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To all you leaky pots out there, and myself as well, I suppose the best thing to do would be to organize ourselves and our dharma knowledge much more. Having the fortune to actually understand the dharma when taught, we should be writing notes during teachings, contemplating on them before bed or perhaps when we are doing our sadhana for the day, and revisiting our notes in some organized fashion. Then to apply it of course.
A difficult step is to even understand the dharma and knowing how we can apply it. So what's next? To actually do something about it and force ourselves to repair our leaks...
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From the classes, I foundout that I have all the three pots (!) But which is normal for samsara. We have the fortune to meet Dharma this life and should hold it seriously to us and should not give it up as it is precious! It was another case when I first started to learn about Dharma many years back where my ego mind only tells me I have one of those pots but upon reflections after reflections I found myself to be having all the pots!
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Hmm...Confession time! I am as guilty as many of us here being the leaky pot! As much I enjoy teachings and understanding them I find myself at times could not remember fully of what has been taught. It has come to a point that it is important to write notes but yet again I have to put them into practice. No point to write so much yet not practising and no results.
At times during teaching and trying to understanding, selectiveness creeps in hence the upside down pot for not accepting truth. Well, so much to work on yet still I have to as I do not wish to disappoint my Guru and love ones for not being a better person since I have the fortune to meet dharma and my Guru in this life. Such rare opportunity.
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In the society today, I’m sure everyone will be a combination of all pots, because due to the uncertainty of our mind, we tend to twist and turn the situation to make it become a situation that suits us.
But in this combination of 3 pots, one of it should stand out the most obvious, like for me, I should be the leaky pot, because if I absorbed all the Dharma knowledge and practice it, I would be a much better person by now, but unfortunately I’m still not.
Hehe, felling guilty is a definite, but what happen next? To find ways to attack my leaky pot is the priority, since we know the problem, it mustn’t let it be already.
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Surprisingly the more technology advanced our world is, the more distracted we became. With modern communication tools such as computers and smart phones, people tend to spending more time by looking and communicating to their friends via these tools rather than the good old fashioned way (communicate face-to-face).
But in another hand, thanks to these communicating tools we are able to have this wonderful site and forum be able for all of us to discuss and learn the Dharma with a click of button. I still have a lot more to learn and i am definitely a leaking pot but i'll keep on learning.
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I would say that out of these four options I would be the second one the leaky pot the most. The characteristics of a leaky pot, is like a mind which always forget things. It is usually associated with a lack of care towards a Dharmic action. I have been working on 'fixing my pot'. What I decided to use as a remedy to my 'sickness' is reciting the mantra of Dorje Shugden and Manjushri (who are both one and the same) in the morning. I chant around 3 malas. I am also guilty to be like the other pots at one point or another. I am sometimes like the upside down pot because when people scold me for doing things wrong, my mind is usually closed to advice and I end up not learning my lesson. Also, I am like the dirty pot because there are certain times where I mix up Dharma and Non-Dharma in my mind, when I share the Dharma with my friends, I end up giving a wrong explanation or such. But I have improved since then.
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I would say all of them equally.
There are times I can't remember the teachings that I have read. I admit my brain is not so effective. Haha.. More Manjushri definitely. Sometimes I pick up here and there as time pass as I will reread those that I have forgotten.
Then there are times when there are certain teachings that I find that the Dharma don't match what and how I want it to be, I become bias. My mind that is ignorant causes this. Sigh!
And yes, at one time I was unable to practice Dharma because I wanted things my way and knowing that it is wrong I still went ahead and did it.
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Personally, I would say i'm more of a leaky pot. The main cause of it is my laziness. Usually when I receive the Dharma, I understand part of it quite quickly but not entirely. I always tell myself I should study it further but ended up I don't.
Because of that, whatever I have understood from the Dharma teaching I forget very quickly because I do not understand it entirely. Hence it is important after every after teaching we study further or read, listen over and over again to truly understand the entirety of it.
Whatever pot we are though, there is a cure as long as our mind transforms and realized that Dharma knowledge is above all.