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About Dorje Shugden => General Discussion => Topic started by: Freyr Aesiragnorak on December 21, 2013, 07:58:35 AM

Title: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: Freyr Aesiragnorak on December 21, 2013, 07:58:35 AM

The 10th Panchen Lama was a bastion of Dharma within Tibet, despite some opposition from the Chinese in relation to his views and support of His Holiness the Dalai Lama. An avid supporter of the practice of Dorje Shugden, he even built a chapel to the Great Protector in his home monastery of Tashi Lhunpo. Dorjeshugden.com has an article of the Panchen Lama, here is the link:


http://www.dorjeshugden.com/introduction/history/10th-panchen-lama-writes-prayer-to-dorje-shugden/ (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/introduction/history/10th-panchen-lama-writes-prayer-to-dorje-shugden/)

I've pasted some of the article below, for pictures please visit the article itself.


10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden


His Holiness the Gyalwa Panchen Rinpoche, any of the line of this reincarnated line in Tibet, each of whom heads the influential Tashi Lhunpo Monastery (near Shigatse) and until recent times was second only to the Dalai Lama in spiritual authority within the dominant  Gelugpa sect of Tibetan Buddhism. In fact spiritually Panchen Lama is on par with the Dalai Lama. The current Dalai Lama was heard to say and echo the 10th Panchen Lama’s words that Dalai Lama will safeguard Tibet from the outside while Panchen Lama safeguard Tibet from the inside as he never left Tibet for exile. His Holiness Panchen Lama was a great hero and very much loved by the Tibetan people up till his passing.

Panchen Lama or Panchen Rinpoche was a great patron of Tibetan language, arts, culture, history, religion, scriptures, ancient texts, traditions and a scholar of Buddhism himself. He was requested to give transmissions, teachings, initiations and advice all over Tibet to hundreds of thousands constantly. When the Panchen Lama gave public discourses literally hundreds of thousands would attend. His teachings although draw from Tsongkapa’s writings would attract scholars, teachers, masters and lineage holders of all traditions of Tibetan Buddhism. From Government Ministers both Tibetan and Chinese would attend his discourses to the humblest farmer. People would queue whole days to get a glimpse or blessing by His Holiness Panchen Rinpoche.  Panchen Rinpoche is much revered in Tibet without rival except the Dalai Lama.

In his large sprawling Tashi Lunpo Monastery, he has a special temple and chapel dedicated to Dorje Shugden. Special pujas, rites and rituals are performed to Dorje Shugden within this chapel by senior monks daily. Many lay people visit this famous chapel of Dorje Shugden daily in times of need and urgency. The laity requests Dorje Shugden rituals also daily. Panchen Rinpoche in his great omniscience held Dorje Shugden as a principal dharma protector of his lineage and personal propitiation together with other protectors of Tashi Lhunpo. There was no conflict. He even wrote prayers, offerings and prayers among his works to Dorje Shugden which will be provided here. Panchen Rinpoche personally wrote extensive prayers and rites to Dorje Shugden in his collected written works.

When someone of Panchen Rinpoche’s stature practices Dorje Shugden, has a special temple and chapel for this protector and also writes rituals and rites for this deity, we have no doubts Dorje Shugden is important and enlightened. Even if the Dalai Lama says Dorje Shugden or CTA claims Dorje Shugden is not to be worshipped, this would contradict Panchen Lama’s beliefs and practices. Can Panchen Rinpoche and many other erudite masters be wrong about Dorje Shugden and only Dalai Lama is correct? We leave it for you to decide.

The fact of the matter is Panchen Lama’s stature, erudite understanding of the scriptures, teacher to millions in Tibet and China, established incarnation line and emanated directly from Amitabah could not be mistaken about his practices such as Dorje Shugden.

Some background

The title Panchen (a short form of the Sanskrit-Tibetan Pandita Chen-po, or “Great Scholar”) was that traditionally given to head abbots of the Tashi Lhunpo Monastery, who were chosen for their maturity and learning. In the 17th century the fifth Dalai Lama declared that his tutor, Lobsang Chokyi Gyaltsen (1570–1662), who was the current Panchen Lama, would be reincarnated in a child. He thus became the first of the line of reincarnated lamas named Panchen Lamas who are regarded as physical manifestations of the Buddha Amitabah.

Disagreements between the government of the Dalai Lama and the Tashi Lhunpo administration over tax arrears led to the Panchen Lama’s flight to China in 1923. A boy born of Tibetan parents about 1938 in Qinghai province, China, Kelsang Tseten, was recognized as his successor. He was taken to Tibet in 1952 under Chinese military escort and enthroned as head abbot of Tashi Lhunpo. The Panchen Lama remained in Tibet in 1959 after the popular revolt and the Dalai Lama’s flight into exile, but his refusal to denounce the Dalai Lama as a traitor brought him into disfavour with the Chinese government, which imprisoned him in Beijing in 1964. He was released in the late 1970s and died in 1989. Panchen Lama never at any time denounced or criticized His Holiness the Dalai Lama. For this he was beaten and tortured many times, but his mind could not be swayed.

 
The Lineage of the Panchen Lamas

The Panchen Lama, a manifestation of Buddha Amitabah, ranks as the highest Tibetan Buddhist religious figure next to His Holiness the Dalai Lama. The title Panchen means great scholar, and is derived from the Sanskrit term Pandita meaning scholar, and Tibetan word chen-po meaning great.

The Panchen Lama lineage dates back to 1385, when the first Panchen Lama Khedrup Geleg Pal Sangpo lived, and since then, Tibetan history has seen the seamless reincarnations of Panchen Lamas until today. Traditionally, the abbots of Tashi Lhunpo Monastery, which was built in Shigatse by His Holiness the first Dalai Lama, were known as Panchen, owing to their scholarly reputation. In the 17th century, His Holiness the 5th Dalai Lama gave his teacher, Lobsang Chokyi Gyaltsen, the then abbot of Tashi Lhunpo Monastery, the title of Panchen Lama, and declared that he would be reincarnated in a child, and that he would continue to be reborn in an unbroken lineage of successors.

 
5th Panchen Lama

From centuries past, an interesting relationship has existed between the two most senior religious leaders of the Gelug sect: the elder acting as the spiritual teacher of the younger; and the younger leading the search for the new incarnation after the passing of the elder. Herein, lies the significance of the role of the Panchen Lama, who plays a significant role in the search for and identification of the reincarnation of the Dalai Lamas, just as the Dalai Lamas leads the search for and identification of the Panchen Lamas’ reincarnation.

 
Line of Panchen Lama Reincarnations

1. Khedrup Geleg Namgyal Pelsang
(student of Je Tsongkapa)
(1385-1438)
|
2. Sonam Choklang
(1439-1504)
|
3. Losang Dondrup
(1505-1566)
|
4. (1.) Panchen Lama
Lobsang Chokyi Gyaltsen
(1570-1662)
(the title Panchen Lama was given to this
incarnation lineage by the 4th Dalai Lama)
|
5. (2.) Panchen Lama
Lobsang Yeshe
(1663-1737)
|
6. (3.) Panchen Lama
Lobsang Palden Yeshe
(1738-1780)
|
7. (4.) Panchen Lama
Lobsang Tenpe Nyima
(1782-1853)
|
8. (5.) Panchen Lama
Lobsang Palden Choki Dragpa Tenpe Wangchuk
(1855-1882)
|
9. (6.) Panchen Lama
Lobsang Choki Nyima Geleg Namgyal
(1883-1937)
|
10. (7.) Panchen Lama
Lobsang Trinley Lhudup Chokyi Gyaltsen
(1938-1989)

 
History of the Panchen Lama

The 1st Panchen Lama, Khedrup Gelek Pelzang (1385-1438), was a disciple of Tsongkapa, the monk whose teachings formed the foundation of the Gelug school. Khedrup was one of the founders of Gelugpa, especially credited with promoting and defending Tsongkapa’s work.

After Khedrup Rinpoche’s death a Tibetan boy named Sonam Choklang was recognized as his tulku, or rebirth. A lineage of reborn lamas was established. However, these first Panchen Lamas did not hold the title during their lifetimes.

The title “Panchen Lama,” meaning “great scholar,” was given by the 5th Dalai Lama to the fourth lama in Khedrup Rinpoche’s lineage. This lama, Lobsang Chokyi Gyaltsen, is remembered as the 4th Panchen Lama, although he was the first lama to hold the title in his life.

As well as being a spiritual descendent of Khedrup, the Panchen Lama also is considered to be an emanation of Amitabah Buddha. Along with his role as a teacher of the dharma, the Panchen Lamas usually are responsible for the recognition of rebirths of Dalai Lamas (and vice versa).

Since the time of Lobsang Chokyi Gyaltsen, the Panchen Lamas have been involved in Tibet’s government and relations with powers outside Tibet. In the 18th and 19th centuries in particular the Panchen Lamas often had more real authority in Tibet than the Dalai Lama, especially through a series of Dalai Lamas who died too young to have had much influence. The Panchen Lama had the most power during this time in order to hold the country together and keep the daily spiritual and secular affairs of the country running smoothly. The 9th, 10th, 11th and 12th Dalai Lamas did not live long and therefore during the weakness of this period, Panchen Lama was the de-facto ruler who oversaw the government of both internal and external affairs of Tibet.

The two high lamas have not always been congenial co-rulers. A serious misunderstanding between the 9th Panchen Lama and 13th Dalai Lama caused the Panchen Lama to leave Tibet for China in 1923. It became clear that the 9th Panchen Lama was a closer ally to Beijing than to Lhasa and did not agree with the Dalai Lama’s opinion that Tibet was independent from China. There were many misunderstandings between the Potala government and the Tashi Lhunpo ministers of the Panchen Lama.

By 1982 Beijing considered Panchen Lama Lobsang Gyaltsen to be rehabilitated and restored him to some positions of authority. At one point he was vice chairman of the National People’s Congress.

However, in 1989 the 10th Panchen Lama Lobsang Gyaltsen returned to Tibet, and during his visit he gave a speech mildly critical of China. Five days later he died, officially of a heart attack. He was 51 years old.

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: christine V on December 21, 2013, 08:31:51 AM

This is an important article whereby we could see the Panchen Lama placed Dorje Shugden practice so highly.

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“Panchen Lama’s refusal to denounce the Dalai Lama as a traitor brought him into disfavour with the Chinese government, which imprisoned him in Beijing in 1964. … Panchen Lama never at any time denounced or criticized His Holiness the Dalai Lama. For this he was beaten and tortured many times, but his mind could not be swayed.”
At here, it is clearly seen that Panchen Rinpoche is not some one that can be easily mind swayed.   

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“When someone of Panchen Rinpoche’s stature practices Dorje Shugden, has a special temple and chapel for this protector and also writes rituals and rites for this deity, we have no doubts Dorje Shugden is important and enlightened. “
As what have quoted in the article, Panchen Lama have practices Dorje Shugden , it showed that Dorje Shugden is not ordinary deity or unenlightened being. How could an emanation of a Buddha Amitabha practices spirit worshiping, it does not make sense. Don't even said Panchen Lama wrote Dorje Shugden's prayer. Thus to say Dorje Shugden is a spirit is completely pure lie

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: vajrastorm on December 21, 2013, 08:32:27 AM

The 10th Panchen Lama was loved and respected by the Tibetan people even until his death. The fact that he  he was of the firm mind that Tibet was part of China, whereas HH Dalai Lama and most Tibetans felt that Tibet should be independent of Tibet, did not detract from the fact that he was a person of great integrity and his stance stemmed from a sincere conviction. His differing stance did not reflect any insincerity on his part or that he was playing up to the Chinese.

This sterling quality of integrity can be seen by his unwavering refusal to criticize or denounce the Dalai Lama to the Chinese, for which he was tortured in prison. Hence, when this great Lama of such sterling qualities believes Shugden to be a Buddha and propitiates him and writes prayers and rituals to honor him, there can be no doubt in the minds of others as to the fact that Shugden is an Enlightened Protector and not a spirit. His devotion to Shugden is reinforced by his building a temple and chapel to Shugden in the grounds of the Tashi Lhuenpo Monastery.
 

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: kris on December 21, 2013, 09:30:09 AM

Thank you for giving a brief background of Panchen Lama's lineage. Now that I recalled, I have watched quite a few of the Hong Kong movies on Panchen Lama when I grew up (although those movies are more fictitious and for entertainment).

Panchen Lama is of high caliber similar to HH Dalai Lama, and it is such a great news to know that Panchen Lama is also worshiping Dorje Shugden. This would definitely give confidence to a lot of practitioners. What is more important is this information will create curiosity in many Tibetans about "why ban Dorje Shugden if Panchen Lama is devoted practitioner?"

Hope this will be another great wave to educate people not just to blindly believe what CTA said..

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: Manjushri on December 21, 2013, 09:30:34 AM

Thank you for the article and highlighting the significance of the 10th Panchen Lama composing prayers, rituals and rites to Dorje Shugden. Just some of my thoughts below:

1. It can clearly be seen from this article that the Panchen Lama had stood firm for his believes and what he knew. Nothing would sway the mind of HH Panchen Lama. Whether he was tortured and put in jail by the Chinese for not speaking up against the Dalai Lama, or speaking up about the Chinese in the later stage of his life and risk putting his life at risk, the Panchen Lama was not moved by political nor material gains. Therefore, his trust and faith in the Dharma, and his practice of Dorje Shugden stemmed from pure knowledge, results, attainments and understanding. For the Panchen Lama to have practised Dorje Shugden so fervently, built a Dorje Shugden chapel in his home monastery can only mean that relying on Dorje Shugden,just as he did, is complimentary to one's practise of the Dharma.

2. The Panchen Lama, in all the pictures, is depicted to be of equal status with His Holiness. Since His Holiness is said to be an emanation of Chenrezig, and the Panchen Lama, Amitabah, both who are attained minds of Buddha, who is then 'right' or 'wrong'? The Buddha manifests in different vessels, but with the motivation to lead all sentient beings out of suffering. So, what basis is there to say that the believes and practices of HH Panchen Lama is less than the believes of His Holiness when both are Buddhas? Additionally, when HHDL passes on, it is the Panchen Lama who assumes responsibility of being the religious figure of the Gelug tradition. The Panchen Lama is the one who takes on the responsibility to find the incarnation of His Holiness. And vice versa. If by practising Dorje Shugden, whom the Dalai Lama claims is a wordly spirit, then the very basis of the 14th Dalai Lama's recognition would be questionable since the Panchen Lama practises a 'demon' and by that, would only serve to question the attainments of the Panchen Lama. But that cannot be the case since his line of reincarnations has returned and we all recognize the attainments of the Panchen Lama and what an erudite master he is. 

3. The 4th incarnation of the Panchen Lama who was first given the title of Panchen Lama (known as 4th Panchen Lama posthumously) by the 5th Dalai Lama was Panchen Lobsang Chokyi Gyeltsen. His Holiness the 5th Dalai Lama as well as Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen were both direct disciples of the 4th Panchen Lama. Both accomplished lamas, that is the 5th Dalai Lama and Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen, were greatly respected as pure and precious teachers when they lived together in Drepung Monastery. This shows what an incredible lama the Panchen Lama is, whose attainments, scholastic accomplishments and practices cannot be denied since he was the tutor to two great lamas themselves too. Futhermore, it was the 5th Dalai Lama who bestowed the title of Panchen Lama to this line of incarnations therefore, the 5th Dalai Lama himself recognizes the attainments of Panchen Lama and holds high respect and regards for him too. Therefore, again, it shows the level of attainments the Panchen Lama has therefore what he practices and teaches to spread the Dharma cannot come from an invalid source or cannot simply be accomplished by worshipping a demon.

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: WisdomBeing on December 21, 2013, 12:47:42 PM

The Dalai Lamas and the Panchen Lamas have an extremely spiritually intimate relationship. It is therefore completely incongruous that one would have such a vastly different view of a particular protector practice from the other. After all, the 14th Dalai Lama had written a prayer to Dorje Shugden so it only makes sense that the 10th Panchen Lama should have done so also.

The huge and majestic Dorje Shugden chapel in current day Tashi Lhunpo at Shigatse, Tibet, is proof that the Panchen Lama continues to uphold this practice. Of course there are differences of opinion over which is the authentic incarnation of the 10th Panchen Lama but if the 10th Panchen Lama was dedicated to Dorje Shugden, i am sure his incarnation, whoever he may be, would be too.

Also, since the Panchen Lama is an emanation of Amitabha Buddha, and Dorje Shugden's brother Dharmapala Setrab is also an emanation of Amitabha Buddha, there must be a very strong spiritual link between the Panchen Lama and Dorje Shugden.

May Dorje Shugden's practice continue to grow and benefit many.

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: Kim Hyun Jae on December 21, 2013, 01:11:27 PM

Quote from: WisdomBeing on December 21, 2013, 12:47:42 PM

Also, since the Panchen Lama is an emanation of Amitabha Buddha, and Dorje Shugden's brother Dharmapala Setrab is also an emanation of Amitabha Buddha, there must be a very strong spiritual link between the Panchen Lama and Dorje Shugden.

There is a lot of logical sense here that since Panchen Lama is an emanation of Amitabha Buddha and DS's brother Setrab is also the emanation of Amitabha Buddha, there MUST be a very strong spiritual link between DS and the Panchen Lama. The Panchen Lama himself propitiates to Dorge Shugden, built a monastery for DS and continues his practice under the eyes of the BAN that Dalai Lama's had imposed and yet he is on equal footing in spiritual stature with the Dalai Lama, equally respected in the world. Why doesn't the Dalai Lama tells Panchen Lama off for the continuation of Dorje Shugden practice? Illogical.

 

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: lotus1 on December 21, 2013, 04:40:55 PM

The Panchen Lama, a manifestation of Buddha Amitabah, influences and holds the ranking as high as HH Dalai Lama in Tibetan Buddhist.  Panchen Lamas are considered as the teacher of Dharma, give initiation, and usually are responsible for the recognition of the rebirths of Dalai Lamas. During the period of 9th, 10th, 11th and 12th Dalai Lama did not live long, Panchen Lama was the de-facto ruler who oversaw the government of Tibet too.  He is definitely can be trusted in his teachings and his lineage. As he had written prayer to Dorje Shugden, it is strong prove that he has endorsed on Dorje Shugden and Dorje Shugden’s practice. (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/0cover_thumb.jpg)

Furthermore, from the pictures, I can also see that his chapel to Dorje Shugden in Tashi Lunpo Monastery is being setup so well respected and properly. There is also a Dorje Shugden’s mandala house (tendoe) within this Tashi Lhunpo Chapel.
So, who can be trusted? The Panchen Lama or the CTA? I’m sure all of us know the answer!
(http://www.dorjeshugden.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/IMG_4383_thumb.jpg) (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/IMG_4381_thumb.jpg) (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/IMG_5336_thumb.jpg)(http://www.dorjeshugden.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/IMG_5337_thumb.jpg) (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/IMG_5357_thumb.jpg)

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: rossoneri on December 22, 2013, 09:03:45 AM

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H.H. Panchen Lama is regarding one of the most important and influential Lama and one of the previous reincarnation of Panchen Lama is the founder of the Gelug monastery in Tibet. He is the manifestation of the Buddha Amitabha which is also manifests as the Dharma Protector, Lord Setrab. If we are saying that by practicing Dorje Shugden would kill H.H. Dalai Lama, why would Panchen Lama will do that since he didn't denounced His Holiness to the Chinese government even he was tortured and imprisoned. Doesn't his loyalty proved something to all of us. Why would all the high lamas will continue to practice Dorje Shudgen if he is a demon? Are we saying that all the Highly Attained Lamas were wrong? They can't tell? then why are we believed in Buddhism in the first place, why are we practicing the teachings of the Buddha, if the lamas can't even tell the right or wrong.

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: dondrup on December 22, 2013, 03:17:13 PM

What better testimonial and recognition of Dorje Shugden than from the highly revered, respected, powerful and attained His Holiness 10th Panchen Lama? Furthermore He is an emanation of Buddha Amitabha!

He wrote prayers to and practiced Dorje Shugden just like other highly attained lamas did. If this fact cannot prove that His Holiness 14th Dalai Lama (HHDL) and Central Tibetan Administration (CTA) were utterly wrong about Dorje Shugden, then Tibetans can say His Holiness 10th Panchen Lama was as wrong about Dorje Shugden as all Gelug lineage masters like Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche, Kyabje Pabongka Rinpoche all the way to Buddha Tsongkhapa and Buddha Shakyamuni!
 
It is really damaging to Tibetan Buddhisn if HHDL, CTA and Dorje Shugden detractors still persist with their wrong views of Dorje Shugden.
 
Do you need to experience the effects of your negative karma from having wrong views of Buddha Dorje Shugden before you are finally convinced that HHDL was wrong?

What is the probability of HHDL being wrong against all Gelug Lineage Masters past and present whom you thought were wrong?

How about if we set up the traditional Tibetan debate and invite HHDL to debate with any of the Dorje Shugden high lamas about Dorje Shugden?  We can request the United Nations' as a witness and judge. This will dissolve the wrong views on Dorje Shugden once and for all and abolish the ban immediately! The irony is why has no one challenged HHDL to this debate?

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: vajratruth on December 22, 2013, 03:30:50 PM

The 10th Panchen Lama was certainly a man of integrity and who stood  by what he believed in without calculating the costs like a politician would. First he was of the view that Tibet was indeed under China's sovereignty and did not oppose the Chinese invasion and did not seek to escape from Tibet when the crunch came. Whether you agree with the Panchen Lama on his views or not, there is no denying that he stood by what he believed in regardless of how unpopular that may have made him.

Three years later in 1962, when the Panchen Lama saw how brutally the Tibetans were being treated by the Chinese, he wrote what was later known as the "70,000 Character Petition" which criticised Communist Party and sought much needed assistance for the suffering Tibetan people. At a time when it was dangerous to oppose Mao Zedong, the Panchen Lama did what was the right thing to do. That nearly cost the Panchen Lama his life and although he was spared by Mao Zedong, he was thrown into jail for over 9 years. Again, we saw a man who refused to compromise on his beliefs.

Even if we set aside the fact that the Panchen Lama is the Dalai Lama's spiritual equal, I would tend to believe a man who stands by his principles instead of hypocritically saying one thing to the world and doing the direct opposite at home. In that regard, the Panchen Lama's credibility is unassailable and it shows a learned man who is willing to support the course of truth all the way. If such a learned man should investigate Dorje Shugden and found him to be a Buddha that he is, I would tend to agree with such a man's beliefs.

Considering that the Panchen Lama is also an enlightened mind, there should be no question in anyone's mind about how wrong accusations against Shugden are. Who would you believe? A man who is learned, honest and courageous…or a proven politician?

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: Rihanna on December 22, 2013, 03:40:07 PM

I agree with everyone here that the 10th Panchen Lama was a bastion of Dharma within Tibet. And that H.H. Panchen Lama is regarded as one of the most important and influential Lama. His hierarchy is that of equal to HHDL. A testament to that is if you look at any photos of HHDL and the Panchen Lama walking, they are always walking together. Not one behind the other. In terms of official protocol, as in any country, it symbolises that both are of equal status. What is baffling is why does a dharma protector that is 'good enough' for the Panchen Lama and so highly revered by him to even compose a prayer to Dorje Shugden, is not good enough for others?

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: gbds3jewels on December 22, 2013, 05:12:58 PM

This article is very informative and shed a lot of light about Panchen Lama. However to say because the Panchen Lama practice Dorje Shugden and therefore Dorje Shugden is not unenlightened is a very very weak argument. Because this exact same statement would also make the statement because the Dalai Lama ban Dorje Shugden practice and therefore Dorje Shugden must be evil to be true.

The controversy of Dorje Shugden practice should be centered around which lama practices it and the credentials of these lamas. Then it becomes a comparison which lama is more attained and which lama action must be correct, not forgetting the Dalai Lama himself is one of the highly attained lama.

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: DS Star on December 22, 2013, 08:36:11 PM

Quote from: gbds3jewels on December 22, 2013, 05:12:58 PM

...However to say because the Panchen Lama practice Dorje Shugden and therefore Dorje Shugden is not unenlightened is a very very weak argument. Because this exact same statement would also make the statement because the Dalai Lama ban Dorje Shugden practice and therefore Dorje Shugden must be evil to be true.

I agree with your above statement as we cannot rely one particular lama's practice confirm or denounce the status of a particular deity. There have to be more than just one proof so to speak.

Quote from: gbds3jewels on December 22, 2013, 05:12:58 PM

The controversy of Dorje Shugden practice should be centered around which lama practices it and the credentials of these lamas. Then it becomes a comparison which lama is more attained and which lama action must be correct, not forgetting the Dalai Lama himself is one of the highly attained lama.

Yes the Dalai Lama is highly attained, so are the lamas in the list below that practice Dorje Shugden. The fact is, the current 14th Dalai Lama himself (before the ban) and his previous incarnations practice Dorje Shugden. All his tutors practice Dorje Shugden. Is this still not enough to confirm Dorje Shugden as enlightened protector for preserving Nagajurna's and Lama Tsongkhapa's teachings?

Well-known and highly esteemed Gelugpa practitioners of Dorje Shugden, past and present, include:

Past Masters
The 5th Dalai Lama, Ngawang Lobsang Gyatso
Losang Thubten Wangchuk Jigme Gyatso (head of the Gelugpa school of Buddhism in Mongolia)
Ngulchu Dharmabadra
The Indian master Shakya Shri Bhadra
The 11th Dalai Lama (who installed Dorje Shugden as the Protector of the Gelugpa tradition)
Gyara Tulku Rinpoche
Domo Geshe Rinpoche (regarded by the 13th Dalai Lama as an emanation of Lama Tsongkhapa)
Serkong Rinpoche (regarded by the 13th Dalai Lama as Vajradhara)
Dagpo Kelsang Khedrub Rinpoche
Pabongka Rinpoche
Trijang Rinpoche
Ling Rinpoche
Khangsar Rinpoche
Tathag Rinpoche (in charge of the Tibetan Government after the death of the 13th Dalai Lama)
Zong Rinpoche
Khen Rinpoche Losang Tharchin
Lati Rinpoche
Geshe Ngawang Dhargyey
Khechog Rinpoche
Lama Yeshe
Dagom Rinpoche
Present Masters
Lobsang Tamdin
Ribur Rinpoche
Geshe Rabten
Dagyab Rinpoche
Gelek Rinpoche
Lama Zopa
Geshe Kelsang Gyatso
Yongyal Rinpoche
The 14th Dalai Lama
Gonsar Rinpoche
Gangchen Rinpoche and others

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: thor on December 22, 2013, 08:52:39 PM

Any Tibetan-Anglo speakers here? I would really like to see the Panchen Lama's prayer to Dorje Shugden translated into English. I'd also like to hear what the Dalai Lama would say about this revelation about the Panchen Lama's prayer.

First off, I'm pretty sure that the Dalai Lama already knows about this prayer to Dorje Shugden, it having been written by the second highest gelug lama of all the. Perhaps he is hoping that this information would not come to light in circumstances such as these, as it would cast a huge shadow of doubt on the Ban and it's legitimacy.

Secondly, how would the Dalai Lama like to explain the fact that the omniscient Panchen Lama supports and promotes the practice of Dorje Shugden and even constructs temples for his worship? Surely the Dalai Lama will not dare imply that the great Panchen Lama made a mistake? Or would he try to brush it off by giving the Panchen Lama an exception to practice, just like how Trijang Rinpoche received a similar exception on the grounds of being attained enough? (By the way, the Dalai Lama himself, not to mention gangchen rinpoche, Domo Geshe rinpoche, Denma Gonsar rinpoche, etc are also sufficiently attained, surely?)

Thirdly, I wonder if the Dalai Lama would try to play down the prayer to Dorje Shugden and the praises therein expounding his enlightened nature and qualities. If he does, he is again questioning the Panchen lama's omniscience. If he doesn't, then dorje Shugden's qualities must be so.  Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't.

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: DharmaSpace on December 28, 2013, 02:59:48 PM

The 4th Panchen Lama, Panchen Chokyi Gyeltsen had two main eminent students Tulku Dragpa Gyeltsen and the 5th Dalai Lama.

The 4th Panchen Lama recognised Tulku Dragpa Gyeltsen as a tulku. Tulku Dragpa Gyeltsen is Dorje Shugden. So Panchen Lama is hence very very close to Dorje Shugden.

If Dorje Shugden was indeed a malevolent spirit and he had the confidence of Panchen Lama, well history indicated that Dalai lama and Panchen lama took turns to recognise each other. So would be just quite convenient for Dorje Shugden to influence the Panchen Lama to recognise an incorrect Dalai Lama.

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: dsiluvu on January 04, 2014, 07:19:47 AM

If the 10th Panchen Lama who is 2nd to HH Dalai Lama... who is officially the rightful leader and successor if HHDL is not around, busy and sorry to say, enters "clear light"... can write a prayer on Dorje Shugden... surely we can trust with further logical conviction that Dorje Shugden is not a demon. So what is HHDL gonna say? HH Panchen Lama is WRONG also?

So basically the whole entire pantheon of high Lamas and attained masters are all wrong except HH the Dalai Lama? I definitely do not buy in to this excuse and reason for this prayer is one of the many truths that presents the truth. How much more twisted reasons can the Dalai Lama come up with?? Will HHDL now say, surely he CANNOT, say that someone so highly attained like the Panchen Lama is wrong and has no clairvoyant to see who Dorje Shugden really is, let alone compose a prayer to Dorje Shugden.

Or we could also take the same approach and say well His Holiness you could be wrong too... like you said you were wrong about the DS practice in the beginning, you could also be wrong again now.... nothing seems logical anymore when we go that route.

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: dsiluvu on January 04, 2014, 07:26:39 AM

Quote from: thor on December 22, 2013, 08:52:39 PM

Any Tibetan-Anglo speakers here? I would really like to see the Panchen Lama's prayer to Dorje Shugden translated into English. I'd also like to hear what the Dalai Lama would say about this revelation about the Panchen Lama's prayer.

Here it is... think it's just been recently translated...

Jamgon Gyelway Tensung Gyalchen Dorje Shugden Rik-nga Drakpo Tselgyi Gangchok leshi Lhundrub-gyi Drubay Trajang Shejawa Shukso

Translation:

Manjunatha’s (Tsongkapa) Lineage protector Dorje Shugden and five forms wrathful propitiations and confessional prayers and fulfillment of activities rites

By 10th Panchen Lama

So if Dorje Shugden is not the protector of Tsongkhapa's lineage and teachings then why would the Panchen Lama say so. Up until now I do not understand what is so wrong with having a special protector to protect the teachings of Tsongkhapa which is in fact the essence of all the different Vajrayana school's teachings... that means, the Sakya, Kagyu, Nyingma... hence what's so sectarian about that? To protect Tsongkhapa's teachings would be equal to protecting the best of all the other lineage teachings.

There is no conflict on human greed, power, ego that is polluting the Dharma and creating chaos amongst people. Very sad indeed.

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: Big Uncle on January 04, 2014, 10:09:36 AM

This is a landmark discovery, a proof that all of us should be proud of and show to as many people as possible. This little prayer transcends just a mere praise but becomes a scriptural proof of Dorje Shugden's authenticity and benefit. This proof adds a sizeable recognition of Dorje Shugden's true nature and ability to bring benefit to practitioners.

With the deepest respect, it is time to drown out the Dalai Lama's rhetorics against Dorje Shugden and we have plenty of good explanations from across the greatest lamas like Kyabje Pabongka Rinpoche, Kyabje Trijang Rinpoche, Kyabje Zong Rinpoche (the previous incarnation), Lama Yeshe, Gonsar Rinpoche and now, the great Panchen Lama, which had been a mutual student and master of the Dalai Lama, thus an equal in stature and attainments, no less. This adds weight to the authenticity of Dorje Shugden's nature, identity, lineage and practice.

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: DharmaSpace on January 04, 2014, 01:43:56 PM

As mentioned in a previous comment in the forum the 4th Panchen Lama is was the teacher to both Tulku Dragpa Gyeltsen and Dalai Lama, which means the Panchen lama was the teacher to both Manjushri and Avalokiteshvara.

One needs to be the calibre of the previous Trijang Rinpoche to be able to handle the mantle of the teacher for HHDL or Tulku Dragpa Gyeltsen, want to see what level a person like Trijang Lama reached read the text below   
http://www.dorjeshugden.com/downloads/texts/download-kyabje-trijang-dorjechangs-autobiography/ (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/downloads/texts/download-kyabje-trijang-dorjechangs-autobiography/)
 
Trijang Dorjechang was under the care of Dorje Shugden since he was young, and looking at the activities of Trijang Lama he never stopped teaching and giving initiations non stop. How much benefit did he do in his long illustrious life? A true mahasattva of our times and century. The Panchen Lama line of incarnation cannot be questioned, if it is questioned then it puts the Dalai Lama line of incarnations in question.  Then when this question stop, when all the gelug lamas are put into question?

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: maricisun on January 04, 2014, 02:24:16 PM

The 10th Panchen Lama is well loved by the people of Tibet and it is no doubt that he is highly educated and respected by everyone in Tibet. Furthermore he is the emanation of Buddha Amitabha.
The Panchen Lama even composed prayers for the protector Dorje Shugden. If a highly revered Lama also practices Dorje Shugden then it means that the protector is an Enlightened Being and not a spirit.

If the protector is good enough for the Panchen Lama to even writes prayers  to then is Dorje Shugden not good enough for others?

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: Rihanna on January 05, 2014, 10:34:37 PM

The Panchen Lama is the highest ranking Lama after the Dalai Lama in the Gelugpa lineage of Tibetan Buddhism. And the Panchen Lama composed a prayer to Dorje Shugden. Even for the uninitiated to the practice, if they hear of this, the question will arise in their minds: a practice that is 'good enough' for the Panchen Lama is not good enough for CTA? Is this CTA's way of saying that they know better than the Panchen Lama???????

After reading this article, I am even more proud to be a Dorje Shugden practitioner.

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: yontenjamyang on January 06, 2014, 10:22:41 AM

Hurray to the Panchen Lama. Why would the Panchen Lama (or even the Dalai Lama himself) writes a prayer to a spirit. Hence, the World Peace Protector, Manjushri Himself, the Great Protector Dorje Shugden is an enlightened being. All the great Lamas has recommended His practice. Now we discovered the Panchen Lama, who is Amitabha and equal to the Dalai Lama has written a prayer for HIM.

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: icy on January 09, 2014, 09:56:54 AM

Yes the Panchen Lama and the Dalai Lama are equal in status and each played a role of teacher and disciple relationship in the past history.  Panchen Lama ruled and spread Buddhadharma inside Tibet while the Dalai Lama governs and teaches outside Tibet.  Their relationship will continue to intertwine in Tibet in the future when the Chinese and the 11th Panchen Lama will recognise and tutor the 15th Dalai Lama. 

As Panchen Lama is a well known Shugden lineage master, in the future the Dalai Lama will inherit, practise and become the lineage holder too. 

The ban will be gone with the wind!

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: pgdharma on January 10, 2014, 04:48:13 AM

The Panchen Lama who is an emanation of Amitabha is of equal status as the Dalai Lama. As a highly respected Lama he would not have composed a prayer to Dorje Shugden if Dorje Shugden is a spirit. Thus if Dorje Shugden is good for the Panchen Lama, why is it not good for others who are DS practitioners?

I hope the CTA will not be blinded by the truth. May the ban be lifted soon!

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: dsiluvu on January 12, 2014, 04:57:21 AM

Quote

Joyous Signs accompanies the birth of Panchen Lama’s “Dorje Shugden’s *Kangsol”

The 10th Panchen Lama Lobsang Trinley Chokyi Gyaltsen Rinpoche an accomplished master of Sutra and Tantra has written volumes of commentaries and sadhanas which are still widely used in Tibet today. One such powerful composition is the ritual of propitiating the great protector Dorje Shugden.

In the preface of this sadhana, it says that the Panchen Rinpoche have just commissioned a new painting of the five lineages of Dorje Shugden. Acharya Lobsang Jangchub and the Panchen Rinpoche both agreed that there is a need to have a shorter version of prayer for exhortation of activities from the protector.

Upon the request of Acharya Lobsang Jangchub, Panchen Rinpoche immediately wrote this prayer of the abbreviated form of Dorje Shugden’s Kangsol and named it “Manjunatha’s (Tsongkapa) Lineage protector Dorje Shugden and five forms wrathful propitiations and confessional prayers and fulfilment of activities rites” or “Melodious sound of Accomplishment of the Four Activities” for short.

Upon the completion of this prayer, he personally saw signs and had strong feelings that Dorje Shugden have been working hard to protect the Buddha Dharma in general and especially the lineage of Jamphel Nyingpo (Lama Tsongkhapa). He saw signs especially that the time has come for Dorje Shugden to show his miraculous powers.

True to his identity as a direct incarnation of Khedrup Je who studied under the great Lama Tsongkhapa himself, the Panchen Rinpoche also showed his mastery of composition and poetry in the Sadhana. An example of such poetry is in the praise of Dorje Shugden where the Panchen Rinpoche wrote the praise with the first letter of each verse with a Tibetan vowel. Such composition are only seen in praises to senior protectors such as Palden Lhamo and Kalarupa.

The Panchen Rinpoche also mentioned that he was filled with happiness and bliss throughout the duration of writing this sadhana. The Panchen Rinpoche signed off at the end of the composition with both his official name and also his ordination name, Tenzin Trinley Jigme Choje Wangchuk which endorses the validity of this piece of work. This sadhana was written in his own palace in Tashi Lhunpo in the Hall of Clear light and bliss.

We wish to share this important and exciting detail of this composition with everyone so that all who see this can benefit and may the auspiciousness of Dorje Shugden be with everyone!

Admin
[url]http://www.dorjeshugden.com/all-articles/dharma-readings/10th-panchen-rinpoche-announces-visions-of-dorje-shugden/[/url] ([url]http://www.dorjeshugden.com/all-articles/dharma-readings/10th-panchen-rinpoche-announces-visions-of-dorje-shugden/[/url])

If this is what the Panchen Lama can see and can composed and can feel about Dorje Shugden, even sealed the prayers with both his official official name for validity then I believe we can safely TRUST we are on the right mind and path.

The Panchen Lama also personally saw signs and had strong feelings that Dorje Shugden have been working hard to protect the Buddha Dharma! So what he saw fake signs? He is faking is?

So now what Dalai Lama? Will the Dalai Lama refute, reject and say Panchen Lama is wrong also, wow so daring, so brave, so arrogant? If the Dalai Lama dares to say this... then we can say with all due respect He is wrong. It just cannot be and totally ridiculous and a great defamation to start accusing and saying all these high beings and Lamas are wrong and and only the Dalai Lama is right? Cannot be!

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: Midakpa on January 12, 2014, 04:10:39 PM

The 10th Panchen Lama is highly respected in Tibet. He is equal to the Dalai Lama in terms of spiritual attainments. His prayer to Lord Dorje Shugden is proof that he propitiated Dorje Shugden as an enlightened Protector who is worthy of worship. Because of this, many Tibetans and non-Tibetans who respect the Panchen Lama will regard Dorje Shugden as enlightened and will see no harm in the practice. Those who propitiate Dorje Shugden will definitely benefit from the practice. The high lamas cannot be wrong! The 10th Panchen Lama cannot be wrong!

Title: Re: 10th Panchen Lama writes Prayer to Dorje Shugden
Post by: vajratruth on January 12, 2014, 09:54:13 PM

The Panchen Lamas are the spiritual equal of the Dalai Lamas and this an undeniable fact. That the 10th Panchen Lama should so revere Dorje Shugden is not surprising and in fact many Panchen Lamas in the past had very close relationships with the Protector.

In addition and quite importantly, Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen's teacher was the very first lama to hold the Panchen title, Panchen Lobsang Chokyi Gyaltsen and it was said that Panchen Lobsang Chokyi Gyaltsen was especially close to Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen who arose as Dorje Shugden.

For the Dalai Lama to say that Shugden practitioners are demon worshippers would mean that the Panchen Lamas were also demon worshippers. And since the Panchen line goes all the way back to Khedrub Je, that also infers that Khedrub Je too engaged in satanic practices. Why then would the Dalai Lama continue to use texts that Khedrub Je composed for the Kalachakra empowerment.

If the Dalai Lama is right about Dorje Shugden, he would also have studied very important texts composed by yet another in Dorje Shugden's
demonic" lineage, i.e. Panchen Sonam Drakpa.