Author Topic: Tathag Rinpoche - who is this especially spiritual man?  (Read 4968 times)

DSFriend

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Tathag Rinpoche - who is this especially spiritual man?
« on: August 24, 2010, 07:06:47 PM »
Other than the below,  I can’t seem to find much information about Tathag Rinpoche. Dalai Lama, at six years of age nominated Tathag RInpoche when Reting Rinpoche gave up his Regency.
Anyone out there has more details? Who is this " especially spiritual man and very warm and kind.." lama.


Source : http://www.reting.org/retingtulku5.html
Dalai Lama (1990, 1998). Freedom in Exile. The autobiography of His Holiness the Dalai Lama of Tibet. London: Abacus

At the time of my induction, there were rumours that Reting Rinpoche was not fit to perform the hair-cutting ceremony. It was suggested that he had broken his vows of celibacy and was therefore no longer a monk. There was also open criticism of the way he had punished an official who had spoken against him in the National Assembly. Nevertheless, in accordance with ancient custom, I forfeited my name Lhamo Thondup and assumed his, Jamphel Yeshe, along with several others, so that my full name now became Jamphel Ngawang Lobsang Yeshe Tenzin Gyatso.

In addition to Reting Rinpoche as Senior Tutor, I was appointed a Junior Tutor, Tathag Rinpoche, was an especially spiritual man and very warm and kind. […] These arrangements did not last long, however, for soon after I began my novitiate, Reting Rinpoche gave up the Regency, mainly on account of his unpopularity. Despite my being only six years old, I was asked who I thought should replace him. I nominated Tathag Rinpoche. He then became my Senior Tutor and was replaced as Junior Tutor by Ling Rinpoche.






hope rainbow

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Re: Tathag Rinpoche - who is this especially spiritual man?
« Reply #1 on: August 24, 2010, 09:49:13 PM »
So what happened to Tathag Rinpoche?
It's not nothing to be appointed tutor of His Holiness... there must be some kind of record right?

jessicajameson

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Re: Tathag Rinpoche - who is this especially spiritual man?
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2010, 06:08:28 PM »
According to Liberation in the Palm of Your Hands, it is written that Tathag Rinpoche was one of the FOUR MAIN DISCIPLES of Pabongka Rinpoche (along with Ling Rinpoche, Trijang Rinpoche and Khangsar Rinpoche). Tathag Rinpoche was the main teacher of HHDL when he was a child and gave him his novice ordination.

It is written in HHDL biography from the age of 6, whenever HHDL lessons with Tathag Rinpoche were finished, they would engage in casual talks and and joke about. It was written that it was to give HHDL a "measure of kinship, which he so badly desired.".

Also, Reting Rinpoche (former regent, who brought HHDL into power) would always hand over the reigns of government over to Tathag Rinpoche whenever he was absent.

From what I gather, I think that Tathag Rinpoche was a spiritual and kind man who was also known to be strict due to how he governed Tibet after Reting Rinpoche "lax-ed" term. It was seen to be more stringent, as he followed through with an ethnic to bring integrity back to his position.

It seems that Tathag Rinpoche has always been there for HHDL in both spiritual guidance and as his friend. They seem to have very strong ties..





hope rainbow

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Re: Tathag Rinpoche - who is this especially spiritual man?
« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2010, 01:32:27 AM »
Thanks Jessica for always finding new info and sharing with us.
I had heard of Tathag Rinpoche being one of the four main student of Pabongkha. Just that is actually mind blowing... What a reference that is!

thor

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Re: Tathag Rinpoche - who is this especially spiritual man?
« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2010, 05:40:59 AM »
Tathag Rinpoche (Ngawang Sungrab Thutob) is also sometimes spelt as Taktra Rinpoche or Tadrag Rinpoche. He was the teacher of Reting Rinpoche as well as many others, including the previous Kyabje Ling Rinpoche. Some sources say that Reting Rinpoche nominated Tathag Rinpoche to assume the position of regent for a period of 2 - 3 years, under the understanding that power would be handed back to Reting Rinpoche after the time was up. However after 3 years, the reigns of power continued to lie in the hands of the Regent Taktra Rinpoche, who did not hand back power, triggering a series of events including the attempted murder of Taktra Rinpoche with a package bomb in the late 1940s. This culminated in the death of Reting Rinpoche in prison.

"One day, whilst I was watching a debate, I heard the sounds of shots being fired. The noise came from the north, in the direction of Sera monastery. I rushed outside, full of excitement at the prospect of doing some real work with my telescope. Yet, at the same time I was also very troubled as I realised that gunfire meant killing. It turned out that Reting Rinpoche, who had announced his political retirement six years previously, had decided to claim the Regency back. He was supported in this by certain monks and lay officials who organised a plot against Tathag Rinpoche. This resulted in Reting Rinpoche’s arrest and the death of a considerable number of his followers."
From the Dalai Lama's autobiography, Freedom in exile

When Tathag Rinpoche became the regent of Tibet, the Dalai Lama was a minor and the position of Regent was all powerful. Tathag Rinpoche remained in the position of Regent for fourteen years. And with the Chinese invasion of Tibet, power was eventually transferred to the young Dalai Lama in early November 1950

During Taktra Rinpoche's reign, the Foreign Bureau of the Tibetan Government was set up and it was also during his reign that the Chinese invasion of Tibet stepped a notch up.


WisdomBeing

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Re: Tathag Rinpoche - who is this especially spiritual man?
« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2010, 06:31:28 AM »
Although i don't find it mentioned anywhere on the net, I surmise that Taktra Rinpoche was a Dorje Shugden practitioner since he was a student of Pabongka Rinpoche.

To add to this topic, i found this from wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ngawang_Sungrab_Thutob:

Ngawang Sungrab Thutob (1874-1952) was the second Taktra Rinpoche, Wylie transliteration: sTag-brag pandita and regent of Tibet. He was responsible for raising and educating the 14th Dalai Lama, Tenzin Gyatso.

As a regent he succeeded the fifth Reting Rinpoche, Jamphel Yeshe Gyaltsen, at the beginning of 1941, with whom he got into conflict later. The Reting Rinpoche rebelled, got captured and lost life in the prison under the Potala Palace.
Kate Walker - a wannabe wisdom Being

thor

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Re: Tathag Rinpoche - who is this especially spiritual man?
« Reply #6 on: August 30, 2010, 04:22:35 AM »
Although i don't find it mentioned anywhere on the net, I surmise that Taktra Rinpoche was a Dorje Shugden practitioner since he was a student of Pabongka Rinpoche.

To add to this topic, i found this from wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ngawang_Sungrab_Thutob:

Ngawang Sungrab Thutob (1874-1952) was the second Taktra Rinpoche, Wylie transliteration: sTag-brag pandita and regent of Tibet. He was responsible for raising and educating the 14th Dalai Lama, Tenzin Gyatso.

As a regent he succeeded the fifth Reting Rinpoche, Jamphel Yeshe Gyaltsen, at the beginning of 1941, with whom he got into conflict later. The Reting Rinpoche rebelled, got captured and lost life in the prison under the Potala Palace.



I would imagine he was a Dorje Shugden practitioner as his picture is listed in the Great Masters section of this website. Is anyone else able to confirm this?

DSFriend

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Re: Tathag Rinpoche - who is this especially spiritual man?
« Reply #7 on: September 04, 2010, 07:57:58 AM »
Tathag Rinpoche (Ngawang Sungrab Thutob) is also sometimes spelt as Taktra Rinpoche or Tadrag Rinpoche. He was the teacher of Reting Rinpoche as well as many others, including the previous Kyabje Ling Rinpoche. Some sources say that Reting Rinpoche nominated Tathag Rinpoche to assume the position of regent for a period of 2 - 3 years, under the understanding that power would be handed back to Reting Rinpoche after the time was up. However after 3 years, the reigns of power continued to lie in the hands of the Regent Taktra Rinpoche, who did not hand back power, triggering a series of events including the attempted murder of Taktra Rinpoche with a package bomb in the late 1940s. This culminated in the death of Reting Rinpoche in prison.

"One day, whilst I was watching a debate, I heard the sounds of shots being fired. The noise came from the north, in the direction of Sera monastery. I rushed outside, full of excitement at the prospect of doing some real work with my telescope. Yet, at the same time I was also very troubled as I realised that gunfire meant killing. It turned out that Reting Rinpoche, who had announced his political retirement six years previously, had decided to claim the Regency back. He was supported in this by certain monks and lay officials who organised a plot against Tathag Rinpoche. This resulted in Reting Rinpoche’s arrest and the death of a considerable number of his followers."
From the Dalai Lama's autobiography, Freedom in exile

When Tathag Rinpoche became the regent of Tibet, the Dalai Lama was a minor and the position of Regent was all powerful. Tathag Rinpoche remained in the position of Regent for fourteen years. And with the Chinese invasion of Tibet, power was eventually transferred to the young Dalai Lama in early November 1950

During Taktra Rinpoche's reign, the Foreign Bureau of the Tibetan Government was set up and it was also during his reign that the Chinese invasion of Tibet stepped a notch up.



Thanks for the info and especially the variation of how Tathag Rinpoche's name is spelt. Sometimes I feel quite put off with the politics surrounding Tibetan Buddhism..but thinking abit deeper, I do feel encouraged that we are all human and under the influence of the 3 poisons. Yet, so many masters arose from following this path. And with that, my mind feels at peace and happy.

Ensapa

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Re: Tathag Rinpoche - who is this especially spiritual man?
« Reply #8 on: August 24, 2012, 09:55:35 AM »
Here's some information on Taktra/Tathag Rinpoche that I found on wikipedia. His current incarnation seems to have been recognized by the Dalai Lama and is one of the members of the 6th council of Buddhism in China. What I do find interesting is that now he seems to be against the Dalai Lama, much like Samding Rinpoche:

Quote
Ngawang Sungrab Thutob (1874–1952; ????????) was the third Taktra Rinpoche, Wylie transliteration: sTag-brag pandita and regent of Tibet.
He was responsible for raising and educating the 14th Dalai Lama, Tenzin Gyatso.[1]
As a regent he succeeded the fifth Reting Rinpoche, Jamphel Yeshe Gyaltsen, at the beginning of 1941, with whom he got into conflict later. The Reting Rinpoche rebelled, was captured and died in imprisonment in the Potala Palace.[2]
State-controlled media in China claims that he was responsible for the death of Jamphel Yeshe Gyaltsen, the teacher of 14th Dalai Lama. They praise Jamphel Yeshe Gyaltsen as a patriot and devout Buddhist while calling Ngawang Sungrab Thutob as a "pro-Britain, pro-slavery separatist".
[edit]4th Taktra

In 1955[3] (or 1954[4]), the 4th Taktra or Dagzhag (????,[3] ???? or ????[4]) born. He was recognized by the Chinese government and Dalai Lama in 1958[3] (or 1957[4]). His name was given by 14th Dalai Lama. One or two years later, Dalai Lama fled to India.
Ironically, even though mass media in China evaluate Ngawang Sungrab Thutob negatively, 4th Taktra became a member of the 6th council of the Buddhist Association of China and the Vice President of Tibetan Sub-Association of Buddhist Association of China. He was quoted to have pejoratively labeled the Dalai Lama;s supporters as the "Dalai Group" and blame them:
“   A few temple monks, following the scriptures poorly, do not comply with religious teachings; undermine religious order; promote anarchy; and, echoing with the Dalai clique, encourage separatist activities, sabotage Tibet's stability, damage the normal order of Tibetan Buddhism, doing evil to the religious community and the majority of believers, as well as the fundamental interests of Buddhism. We will never agree with their views and will strongly oppose them.



 

DharmaSpace

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Re: Tathag Rinpoche - who is this especially spiritual man?
« Reply #9 on: August 26, 2012, 01:56:19 PM »
I found some extra information about Taktra Rinpoche in the book on Dalai Lama
http://books.google.com.my/books?id=wLzA8YKI-coC&pg=PA52&lpg=PA52&dq=tathag+rinpoche&source=bl&ots=x9WLQfGHh3&sig=Ssihq0iO9KTxCxHRMiD9sQOFAy0&hl=en#v=onepage&q=tathag%20rinpoche&f=false

If this lama appears to do his work in China, I doubt very much he can say anything but the official stance about the Dalai Lama so he could be under duress to just function as a dharma teacher.  Confucius once said 'People are not obligated to keep promises made under duress'. 

Big Uncle

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Re: Tathag Rinpoche - who is this especially spiritual man?
« Reply #10 on: August 26, 2012, 11:27:15 PM »
Although i don't find it mentioned anywhere on the net, I surmise that Taktra Rinpoche was a Dorje Shugden practitioner since he was a student of Pabongka Rinpoche.

To add to this topic, i found this from wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ngawang_Sungrab_Thutob:

Ngawang Sungrab Thutob (1874-1952) was the second Taktra Rinpoche, Wylie transliteration: sTag-brag pandita and regent of Tibet. He was responsible for raising and educating the 14th Dalai Lama, Tenzin Gyatso.

As a regent he succeeded the fifth Reting Rinpoche, Jamphel Yeshe Gyaltsen, at the beginning of 1941, with whom he got into conflict later. The Reting Rinpoche rebelled, got captured and lost life in the prison under the Potala Palace.



I would imagine he was a Dorje Shugden practitioner as his picture is listed in the Great Masters section of this website. Is anyone else able to confirm this?


I think that he is a Dorje Shugden practitioner mainly from the virtue that he was one of the four main disciples of Kyabje Pabongka Rinpoche. It is sad that we didn't hear more of him and perhaps his incarnation is performing wondrous works in China to propagate the teachings and perhaps even spreading Dorje Shugden. I always believe that all students of Kyabje Pabongka Rinpoche would either propagate Dorje Shugden directly or have a fond recognition of this protector as a heart practice of this Lama/lineage Lama.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2013, 03:49:58 AM by Big Uncle »

Ensapa

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Re: Tathag Rinpoche - who is this especially spiritual man?
« Reply #11 on: April 04, 2013, 05:25:00 AM »
Although i don't find it mentioned anywhere on the net, I surmise that Taktra Rinpoche was a Dorje Shugden practitioner since he was a student of Pabongka Rinpoche.

To add to this topic, i found this from wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ngawang_Sungrab_Thutob:

Ngawang Sungrab Thutob (1874-1952) was the second Taktra Rinpoche, Wylie transliteration: sTag-brag pandita and regent of Tibet. He was responsible for raising and educating the 14th Dalai Lama, Tenzin Gyatso.

As a regent he succeeded the fifth Reting Rinpoche, Jamphel Yeshe Gyaltsen, at the beginning of 1941, with whom he got into conflict later. The Reting Rinpoche rebelled, got captured and lost life in the prison under the Potala Palace.



I would imagine he was a Dorje Shugden practitioner as his picture is listed in the Great Masters section of this website. Is anyone else able to confirm this?


I think that he is a Dorje Shugden practitioner mainly from the virtue that he was one of the four main disciples of Kyabje Pabongka Rinpoche. It is sad that we didn't hear more of him and perhaps his incarnation is performing wondrous works in China to propagate the teachings and perhaps even spreading Dorje Shugden. I always believe that all students of Kyabje Pabongka Rinpoche would either propagate Dorje Shugden directly or have a fond recognition of this protector as a heart practice of this Lama/lineage Lama.


Yeah I would agree with this point as well. Other than that, Taktra Rinpoche was recognized in China and remained in China, somewhat away from the Dalai Lama's ban on Dorje Shugden so he would not have adhered to the ban and he would have continued practicing Dorje Shugden. It is good to know that in the absence of Ling Rinpoche, Pabongkha and Trijang Rinpoche, Taktra, Reting and Samdhong Rinpoche are holding the Tibetans and they are all recognized by the government of China has Living Buddhas as well as being included into the special committee of Buddhism.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2013, 03:50:19 AM by Big Uncle »

Dondrup Shugden

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Re: Tathag Rinpoche - who is this especially spiritual man?
« Reply #12 on: June 04, 2015, 01:43:31 PM »
From this article it looks like many great Shugden lamas are ''forgotten'' and their incarnations never mentioned.  In this particular case of Tathag Rinpoche who in the previous incarnation was a student of Pabongka Rinpoche like Trijang Rinpoche and Ling Rinpoche.

Tathag Rinpoche was the tutor of the Dalai Lama when he was very young.

Where is this great incarnation.  Speculation is that he may be incarnated in China and doing DS work there.  Let us hope that soon all these great Lama will emerge and give the world the teachings of DS lineage.