Author Topic: Pabongkha Rinpoche Vajrayogini Commentary reprint  (Read 4338 times)

psylotripitaka

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 616
Pabongkha Rinpoche Vajrayogini Commentary reprint
« on: August 07, 2015, 09:17:18 PM »
Dear Friends,

Due to overwhelming demand, Dechen Ling Press has run a second printing of The Extremely Secret Dakini of Naropa - Je Pabongkhapa's extensive commentary on Vajrayogini practice.

https://dechenlingpress.org/product/the-extremely-secret-dakini-of-naropa/

eyesoftara

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 314
Re: Pabongkha Rinpoche Vajrayogini Commentary reprint
« Reply #1 on: August 11, 2015, 07:21:38 AM »
Thanks Chokyi Dorje for the information. I aspire to practice the tantra of Vajrayogini as it can bring enlightenment within 14 lifetimes. However, we need to complete the preliminaries according to one's lineage. It can 100,000 times of prostrations, water offerings, mandala offerings, Vajrasattva mantras, 35 confessional Buddhas, Guru Yogas or Light offerings. This should be according to the Guru's instructions. Usually, 4 to 5 of the above.

Before completing the preliminaries and getting the permission of the Guru, we cannot read the commentaries of the tantras or do the mantras. However, we can generate the aspirations of doing some minor tantric practices like tea offerings. Again, it should be on the advise of the Guru.

psylotripitaka

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 616
Re: Pabongkha Rinpoche Vajrayogini Commentary reprint
« Reply #2 on: August 13, 2015, 04:03:37 AM »
Thanks Chokyi Dorje for the information. I aspire to practice the tantra of Vajrayogini as it can bring enlightenment within 14 lifetimes. However, we need to complete the preliminaries according to one's lineage. It can 100,000 times of prostrations, water offerings, mandala offerings, Vajrasattva mantras, 35 confessional Buddhas, Guru Yogas or Light offerings. This should be according to the Guru's instructions. Usually, 4 to 5 of the above.

Before completing the preliminaries and getting the permission of the Guru, we cannot read the commentaries of the tantras or do the mantras. However, we can generate the aspirations of doing some minor tantric practices like tea offerings. Again, it should be on the advise of the Guru.

What you've said can be misleading, because these days it is not necessary to meet such strict requirements before receiving initiation or before reading tantric commentaries or receiving such teachings. The strict traditional approach you mention may be the case with your particular Lama, but it has not been the case within the international Buddhist community for a long time. It is still said that people need initiation to practice tantric sadhanas. Even though some texts - such as the one I mention in this thread - are "restricted", people can and will read these texts prior to receiving initiation. Perhaps, as is my own case, they may read such books not understanding the restriction and their karma to enter the path ripens powerfully - that is what really matters. Also, the translator of the above book said to me that the "restricted" notice is generally speaking and intended to encourage people to receive the initiation before engaging in deep study of the subject. The reality is, such texts are 'locked from the inside', and though people will read these things they will not be able to enter the mandala or truly comprehend the profound meanings without initiation.

As for preliminaries, experience of lamrim is important and the 9 preliminaries help prepare the mind for realizations, but these things are no longer prerequisites for being able to receive an initiation. There's not much time left, so it is more important for people to connect to the Yidams and have the door opened for them to practice. Then, just as when you sow an apple seed and pear seed together the trees will grow and bare fruit together, so, having received initiation people can train in Sutra and Tantra together.

Also, there are some of the 9 preliminaries people can work on before receiving empowerment, collecting 100,000 of each: refuge and bodhichitta, Guru Yoga, prostrations, mandala offerings, water bowls, and images. They can also recite 100,000 confession verses such as that in Ganden Lhagyema as an alternative to the Vajrasattva mantra if they don't have a Vajrasattva jenang.

I've commented on tantric initiation in several other somewhat recent threads if you care to consider my view further. Thanks for reading.


fruven

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 659
Re: Pabongkha Rinpoche Vajrayogini Commentary reprint
« Reply #3 on: August 17, 2015, 12:15:30 AM »
Thanks Chokyi Dorje for the information. I aspire to practice the tantra of Vajrayogini as it can bring enlightenment within 14 lifetimes. However, we need to complete the preliminaries according to one's lineage. It can 100,000 times of prostrations, water offerings, mandala offerings, Vajrasattva mantras, 35 confessional Buddhas, Guru Yogas or Light offerings. This should be according to the Guru's instructions. Usually, 4 to 5 of the above.

Before completing the preliminaries and getting the permission of the Guru, we cannot read the commentaries of the tantras or do the mantras. However, we can generate the aspirations of doing some minor tantric practices like tea offerings. Again, it should be on the advise of the Guru.

What you've said can be misleading, because these days it is not necessary to meet such strict requirements before receiving initiation or before reading tantric commentaries or receiving such teachings. The strict traditional approach you mention may be the case with your particular Lama, but it has not been the case within the international Buddhist community for a long time. It is still said that people need initiation to practice tantric sadhanas. Even though some texts - such as the one I mention in this thread - are "restricted", people can and will read these texts prior to receiving initiation. Perhaps, as is my own case, they may read such books not understanding the restriction and their karma to enter the path ripens powerfully - that is what really matters. Also, the translator of the above book said to me that the "restricted" notice is generally speaking and intended to encourage people to receive the initiation before engaging in deep study of the subject. The reality is, such texts are 'locked from the inside', and though people will read these things they will not be able to enter the mandala or truly comprehend the profound meanings without initiation.

As for preliminaries, experience of lamrim is important and the 9 preliminaries help prepare the mind for realizations, but these things are no longer prerequisites for being able to receive an initiation. There's not much time left, so it is more important for people to connect to the Yidams and have the door opened for them to practice. Then, just as when you sow an apple seed and pear seed together the trees will grow and bare fruit together, so, having received initiation people can train in Sutra and Tantra together.

Also, there are some of the 9 preliminaries people can work on before receiving empowerment, collecting 100,000 of each: refuge and bodhichitta, Guru Yoga, prostrations, mandala offerings, water bowls, and images. They can also recite 100,000 confession verses such as that in Ganden Lhagyema as an alternative to the Vajrasattva mantra if they don't have a Vajrasattva jenang.

I've commented on tantric initiation in several other somewhat recent threads if you care to consider my view further. Thanks for reading.

It is a general advise to do preliminaries practices. Who are you to decide? You're basically sending people going to Vajra hell. You don't go to university without learning the ABC do you?



psylotripitaka

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 616
Re: Pabongkha Rinpoche Vajrayogini Commentary reprint
« Reply #4 on: August 17, 2015, 01:36:50 AM »
Fruven,

As for your ABC comment, I wrote: "Then, just as when you sow an apple seed and pear seed together the trees will grow and bare fruit together, so, having received initiation people can train in Sutra and Tantra together." If that doesn't make sense, my meaning is that people will build the ABC's while they also sow seeds for tantric realization. Also, I did not tell anyone not to do preliminaries or suggest they aren't important nor have I decided anything for anyone or sent them to Vajra Hell. I have merely explained the current circumstances of Vajrayana initiation and instructions within the international Buddhist community which has been mentioned by various Vajra Masters in general and to me directly, so it doesn't matter who I am.

Also, if you look at the situation carefully, it is quite clear that the sealed-in-secrecy commands made by the Dakinis and Lamas during a certain era have been lifted. There are many examples of such strict commands lifting throughout the history of the Gelugpa lineage. Here are a few examples: the sealed-in-secrecy commentary to the five completion stages of Ghantapa by the Panchen Lama Losang Chokyi Gyaltsen is now available for the general public, Geshe Chekawa revealed secret Lojong teachings, the Panchen Lama Chokyi Gyaltsen compiled Lama Chopa, Lamas have given Secret Mantra initiation since the 70's to thousands of people internationally without the disciple/Guru checking procedure, Geshe Kelsang Gyatso Rinpoche has revealed many instructions of the Ganden Oral Lineage to the public and even gave a transmission of the uncommon yoga of inconceivability of Vajrayogini to over 10,000 people many of which did not have initiation. This last one used to be under a strict command that it only be given to a small handful of people at a time, once a year, and that they must definitely meet certain qualifications.

So Fruven, you are telling me these Masters are sending all these people to Vajra Hell? Yep, that is what you just said, but you phrased it as me sending them to such a hell for explaining the facts.

It is important to have refuge in the Three Jewels as the principal prerequisite for receiving initiation. Other than that, to also examine a Guru's qualifications, train in Lamrim and Lojong, and to do the ngondro are all important, but they have not been absolute requirements for receiving initiation. Reading and receiving teachings before initiations are a motivator for receiving the initiations. Geshe Kelsang's method is a good example of this and the result is thousands of people having the opportunity to enter progress on and complete the path. This does not however invalidate some Lamas strict approach for they have a different karma with their disciples. I think Tsem Rinpoche is a good example of this. He is very strict and requires much from his students before he is going to grant Highest Yoga Tantra initiation such as Vajrayogini. He wrote a wonderful explanation on his blog of his vision, preparing students, entering retreat and people achieving realizations. I think it was called 'Relying on Vajrayogini Right Now' or something like that.

Anyways, everyone has freedom, and following the Guru's lineage is important. I have presented my understanding and my view here in a recent post about receiving initiations sooner than later in part to show people here that the strict approach is not the only opportunity available to them. I know some people who despite knowing this have waited many years training in Sutra before they felt what they personally decided was "ready" for them to receive initiation. I admire that, but such an approach is not for everybody, so out of unbelievable kindness the Guru has manifested a quick alternative for those who wish to train in Highest Yoga Tantra now. The union of Sutra and Tantra will lead you to realization one way or the other, so relax, choose your own approach, and respect that there are different ways my friend.

fruven

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 659
Re: Pabongkha Rinpoche Vajrayogini Commentary reprint
« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2015, 11:35:05 PM »
So Fruven, you are telling me these Masters are sending all these people to Vajra Hell? Yep, that is what you just said, but you phrased it as me sending them to such a hell for explaining the facts.

My message is towards you.

You cannot claim what you have written as fact when it is your own observation.

psylotripitaka

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 616
Re: Pabongkha Rinpoche Vajrayogini Commentary reprint
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2015, 04:16:51 PM »
Fruven, I've been told these things by Masters, and I have checked my observations with Masters. Otherwise I would definitely not say these things. Thank you for expressing your concern and sharing this dialogue.

DharmaSpace

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1470
Re: Pabongkha Rinpoche Vajrayogini Commentary reprint
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2015, 05:40:32 PM »
Not being a tantrika, I may not know everything there is to know about tantric practices. And I would follow my teachers advice about how I should get tantric initiation. According to Tibetan Buddhism every lama has their own 'style' to disseminate the dharma and ripen their students.

I can only conclude that anyone who promotes a certain view about tantric approach is responsible for their own actions and no one is above karma. Another downside about sharing incorrect dharmic information will be to the detriment of tantric practices, if tantra is practiced incorrectly and yield no results it can only shorten the lifespan of tantric practices in our world.

psylotripitaka

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 616
Re: Pabongkha Rinpoche Vajrayogini Commentary reprint
« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2015, 08:08:54 PM »
For those interested in the opportunity to train in the Vajrayana, the empowerments of Heruka body mandala and Vajrayogini within the New Kadampa Tradition will be given in the Fall of 2016. Local Centres can provide you with the support you need to understand and prepare for this, which includes extensive teachings and training in Lamrim and Lojong, ngondro, and clarification of what Vajrayana empowerment and practice entails. There are many Teachers and fellow practitioners with experience who can aid you in cultivated a very blessed and well-rounded practice of the Union of Sutra and Tantra. To find updated information you can contact a local Kadampa Centre, or check the NKT Festivals website.