Vegetarianism in Buddhism

[gbds3jewels]

Hey guys, thanks for this forum topic. I have head various opinions before on Vegetarianism and Buddhism. This topic provided a lot of solid information for me to contemplate if I should become a full vegetarian. What compels me is that being a vegetarian is not a hard discipline to maintain as there are so much choices of food available and it can nourish a compassionate heart. Don't mean to sound bitchy but practicing compassion on human can be much much harder, why not start by practicing compassion on "less fortunate" beings. Human is a strange species who spent so much time, effort and money on food which comes out eventually as shit anyways. Animals (most anyways) eats to survive and sustain their life.

[Rihanna]

Totally agree with all that is said here and they are all the contributing factors and reasons why one is a vegetarian (motivation, vows, lifestyle of a mendicant, etc) or not (due to medical reasons, karma, health, etc). For me it is something basic: the piece of meat came from a living being and images of the animals' eyes pleading not to be killed keeps flashing in my mind each time I see a piece of meat. And that immediately creates a lump on my throat.

[Midakpa]

Here are the thoughts of a Chinese Mahayana teacher regarding vegetarianism. According to Venerable Yin Shun, "Although it is not necessary for a Buddhist to be vegetarian, it is a good moral conduct in Chinese Buddhism and is something that should be promoted. The teaching of the Buddha says that becoming a vegetarian will cultivate one's loving kindness and compassion. By not harming the life of other living beings, not eating the meat of the other animals, one will reduce one's karma of killing and strengthen one's sympathy towards the sufferings of mankind. Mahayana Buddhism advocates the practice of vegetarianism, and says that to be a vegetarian has great merits in cultivating one's mind of loving kindness and compassion."

Ven. Yin Shun also said that: "To practise Buddhism and to be a vegetarian are not the same thing. Some people who become Buddhists do not learn much about the teachings but only know how to be vegetarians. This causes unhappiness among the members of the family. They feel that it is too troublesome to be a vegetarian. In fact one who is practising the teaching of the Buddha should, after becoming a Buddhist, first understand the teaching of the Buddha and behave according to the teaching in both the family and the society. Purifying one's conduct and mind, so that the members of the family feel that one has changed for the better should be the goal. If before becoming a Buddhist, one was greedy, had strong hatred and lacked a sense of responsibility and loving kindness; and after practising the Buddha's teaching, one becomes less greedy, less paranoid and shows more care to the others with a stronger sense of responsibility, then the members of the family would see the benefit of practising the Buddha's teaching. At that time, if one wants to be a vegetarian, the family members would not object to it. In fact, they may also be encouraged to have sympathy towards other living beings and follow one to be vegetarians. If one only knows [how] to be a vegetarian after becoming a Buddhist and does not learn about others, one will surely encounter obstacles and cause misunderstanding.

[cookie]

If one believes in cultivating Compassion and Loving Kindness in their minds, there is no need to debate on whether one should be vegetarian or not. Obviously, consuming meat increases your killing karma (whether done with your own bare hands or killed by others for your consumption).
Many continue to consume meat despite having such knowledge, is mainly caused by the poison of strong attachment and desire for meat !

[psylotripitaka]

Here's a great book by the Yogi Shabkar, emanation of Jetsun Milarepa:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/1590301161/ref=mp_s_a_1_4?qid=1411608375&sr=8-4&pi=AC_SX110_SY165_QL70

And here's a few considerations of my own:

Examining our predicament very carefully we realize it is nearly if not completely impossible to avoid killing or receiving benefit in some way from activities that resulted in the death of sentient beings. The situation is very complex and it would be quite difficult to ascertain the number and ways sentient beings died for us to live or enjoy things. There are countless mother beings that die during the cultivation and culling of crops, as well as the delivery process. Some die to make ingredients of all sorts of things we use. Though it may not be intentional, and though we may take many precautions, killing and death occur.

Considering this inevitable aspect of samsara, we should nurture the wish to end samsara for ourself and others. Our physical activities should help nurture the principal training of the mind, especially in wisdom realizing emptiness.

Meat we eat was killed for us even if the butchers/fishermen aren't calling us out by name. Our very consumption of it is a dependent-relationship supporting the process of killing. But this logic can go on and on, like, stop driving because it kills, and stop walking because it can kill and so on. If we do eat it we should make special dedications with gratitude on behalf of the mother who gave their flesh for us.

We may feel that the meat will be there even if we stop eating it, so it essentially comes down to our intention, our karma of working to minimize our impact on the death of others, and training our mind in Dharma.

Growing our own organic fruit and vegetables will also minimize the death of living beings, especially if we take great care when harvesting.

The mere fact we have to be so careful should itself ignite deep renunciation, bodhichitta, and training in wisdom realizing emptiness.

[psylotripitaka]

Another consideration related to this is how stealing fits in. Milk and eggs are stolen for us for example. If we dig deeper and deeper into the simplest things such as how tofu got to our plate, non-virtue and suffering are present for sure. So do what you can temporarily, but the most change of all in our lifestyle will always be to make more time to meditate deeply on Holy Dharma.

[grandmapele]

People choose to be vegan for health, environmental, and/or ethical reasons. For example, some vegans feel that one promotes the meat industry by consuming eggs and dairy products. That is, once dairy cows or egg-laying chickens are too old to be productive, they are often sold as meat; and since male calves do not produce milk, they usually are raised for veal or other products. Some people avoid these items because of conditions associated with their production. Many vegans choose this lifestyle to promote a more humane and caring world. They know they are not perfect, but believe they have a responsibility to try to do their best, while not being judgmental of others.

http://www.vrg.org/nutshell/vegan.htm


Guess that sums it up very simply without bringing religion and compassion in yet.

[Rihanna]

Dear dsiluvu,

You wrote : I posted this article on my FB page and got a lot of funny comments that wanted only to debate on the fact that consuming meat has not negative karma in itself, apparently, and that it is not a non-virtuous action...

My opinion: all these people who commented on your facebook , if they had used their time more wisely by studying the dharma instead of using it to debate on a topic to make them feel less guilty because they refuse to give up their attachment, that would be better. There is no bad religion. There are only bad followers who interpret a teaching and twist it to suit their convenience.

[Tenzin Malgyur]

Dear dsiluvu, in my opinion, it is rightly not make one OK to eat meat even if one does not personally kill the animal the its meat. One would surely not escape the negative karma of eating meat, as mentioned in the article. Yes, I fully agree that if we continue to consume meat in our diet, we are creating a demand for the animals to be butchered even though we do not kill the animal with our hands. In fact, due to our craving for meat, we have caused the butcher to slaughter the animal and creating a negative karma for killing.
In these days, we have many choice of meatless sustenance to help our body function properly. I might add that going meatless is also a healthier alternative. Even when there is not a vegetarian in sight, we can always request for a dish to be cook without meat. When there is less demand for meat, the killing of animals for their meat would also decrease.

[fruven]

The masses from 1-2 generations started having meat in their food. Before this most of us are mainly plant eaters.

The truth is we have been supporting animal killing because of our taste bud. Listen to what people say when they go out to eat. How often do you hear people say such and such is delicious as compare to such and such is healthy? We never concern about our health when it comes to eating meat.

If we can reduce and cut down meat eating definitely we are choosing control over our senses. Think about it.

[Midakpa]

In the Amagandha Sutra, the Buddha said: "Neither meat, nor fasting, nor nakedness, nor shaven heads, nor matted hair, nor dirt, nor rough skins, nor fire-worshipping, nor all the penances here in this world, nor hymns, noroblation, nor sacrifice, nor feasts of the season, will purify a man overcome with doubt." Eating meat by itself does not make a man impure. A man becomes impure because of evil thoughts and actions. The only advice given by the Buddha to his followers is that they should not be involved in killing intentionally or ask others to kill any living being for them. People who criticise Buddhists who eat meat do not understand the Buddhist attitude towards food. If one eats without attachment and without directly being involved in the act of killing but merely to sustain the physical body, he is practising self-restraint.

[psylotripitaka]

Midakpa,

Maybe you could give us some examples of meat that has not been killed for your consumption. The butcher may not have named you directly, but you are definitely included in the target market he has killed for. We may not have the intention to kill, but by consuming meat we necessarily support a chain of dependent-relationship that involves murder.

The argument that we need meat to sustain the physical body or for health reasons is simply an excuse of the self-cherishing mind. We live in a world with amazing resources for a wholesome diet of fruits, vegetables, legumes, grains, superfoods and so on, all of which provide everything the human body requires. That's right, everything. If a person if truly able to "eat without attachment" then they'd stop making up ridiculous reasons to keep eating meat, or anything super tasty for that matter.

But alas, as I've said elsewhere, there is also murder involved in the cultivation, transportation, and presentation of all the other wholesome foods too, so it boils down not just to attempting to minimize our contribution to the dependent-related murder as much as possible, but to cultivate the three principle aspects of the path and get the hell out of samsara.

[icy]

His Holiness the Gyalwang Drukpa is encouraging vegetarian in his monasteries and nunneries:

I have a good friend in South India who has a monastery with hundreds of monks. We met and discussed about the importance of monasteries and nunneries being meat free. He broke into tears, saying that he did not manage to do so and every week, 20 cows and buffaloes had to be sacrificed for his monks. I felt so sad and regretful that I didn't make all my monasteries and nunneries meat free until more than 20 years ago that I managed to gradually ban meat, yet not all have been changed. I started with Druk Amitabha Mountain. Imagine if our community of more than 500 nuns were to be eating meat, how many animals would be sacrificed! We as practitioners of Buddha Dharma need to reflect on our motivation and action all the time. Some Buddhists say that in Buddha's time and back in Tibet, monks and nuns were not necessarily vegetarians. But come on, this is 21st century, vegetables and delicious non-meat food are available everywhere. We don't need to eat the meat of other beings to survive, especially if we claim to be spiritual practitioners. I personally do not like taking the lives of others, I hope and pray from the depth of my heart that we will have a meat-free world where we live in harmony with nature and in love with all the beings. ~ His Holiness the Gyalwang Drukpa at the 7th Eco Pad Yatra

[psylotripitaka]

Icy,

If we kill precious mother beings in order to eat, we clearly do not believe Dharma to be telling the truth. If we really believed in the law of karma or the sufferings of lower rebirth, we would starve to death before murdering our mothers for a few temporary mouthfuls of food. It is sad to read that these monasteries and nunneries are not practicing the most fundamental Buddhist trainings, that they prefer the path of an ordinary initial scope being concerned only for this very brief life.

If we see ourselves as a traveler bound for future worlds, there is some hope we will begin to untangle the actions of our three doors from the 8 worldly concerns, and so, create some fertile ground for the development of true renunciation, bodhichitta, and wisdom realizing emptiness. If we cannot stop killing out of selfishness, we will never progress in our training.

[psylotripitaka]

Buddha said that if we have received teachings on karma, but nevertheless continue to engage in non-virtuous actions we are like a person with good eyesight who walks straight over a precipice.

Buddha also said that: "Those who harm others are not my disciples".