dorjeshugden.com
About Dorje Shugden => General Discussion => Topic started by: DharmaSpace on May 21, 2018, 07:41:44 PM
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In 1996 the Tibetan Government in Exile, under the direct control of the Dalai Lama, issued an official ban on the centuries-old Tibetan Buddhist practice of Dorje Shugden.
Prior to this point Dorje Shugden was widely practised amongst the largest school of Tibetan Buddhism and according to Thupten Wangchen of the Central Tibetan Administration approximately 30% of all Tibetans used to practice this protector Deity.
The Dalai Lama told his government to release an official decree to all Tibetans stating that, “Propitiating Dolgyal [Dorje Shugden] does great harm to the cause of Tibet. It also imperils the life of the Dalai Lama.”
A few days later the Dalai Lama then instructed his government to tell all of its employees, “not to indulge in the propitiation of Shugden.”
This was the beginning of the Dalai Lama’s great purge of Shugden Buddhists from all aspects of mainstream Tibetan society. People were forced to either give up their faith or lose their job.
In 2008 the Dalai Lama forced all monasteries in South India to expel any monks who still refused to give up their practice of Dorje Shugden.
As Rebecca Novick (author and editor of 6 books on Tibetan Buddhism and culture) stated in an article for the Huffington Post, “Shugden practitioners gradually became social pariahs. Shopkeepers refused to sell to them, and landlords refused to rent to them. In 2008 the Tibetan leadership ordered the monasteries in South India to purge their populations of Shugden devotees. Monks who had formerly lived like brothers were now forbidden to talk to one another.”
During this time the Dalai Lama was travelling throughout the West preaching a message of inter-religious tolerance and love, while at home he was ruthlessly persecuting and suppressing his own people.
Rather than speaking out against religious discrimination the vast majority of Western Buddhist organisations actually spoke out in support of such actions. One such group, the German Buddhist Monastic Association (DBO) issued a press release stating, “In any society it is necessary for the protection of freedom of the majority…to exclude [Dorje Shugden] advocates from public institutions.”
The unquestioned acceptance of the Dalai Lama as some kind of perfect being by the media, coupled with the support for his own discrimination and prejudice by groups such as the DBO further emboldened him.
On March 17th 2014 the President of the Dalai Lama’s government, Lobsang Sangay passed a resolution in their Parliament which criminalized all Shugden Buddhists. In the resolution it stated that it, “recognises also the Dolgyal [Dorje Shugden] followers…as criminals in history.”
Just this week Lobsang Sangay delivered the Berman lecture at Emory University in Atlanta, GA. In it he explained the way that democracy works in the Tibetan exile community, “when the Tibetan cabinet makes a decision, they send the notice to Tibetans around the world and it is followed by all, irrespective of the size of the Tibetan community in the place.”
It is clear therefore that since 1996 the Dalai Lama has effectively banned the practice of Dorje Shugden within the Tibetan community. He has expelled people from jobs, monasteries, and even told people directly to leave his teachings if they practice Dorje Shugden.
Can you imagine the headlines if the Dalai Lama banned Jews, Muslims, or Christians from attending any of his public teachings? Why is it acceptable therefore for him to ban Shugden Buddhists?
The Dalai Lama’s persecution of Shugden Buddhists is also evident to prominent Buddhist scholars such as Dr Robert Barnett at Columbia University who said, “As you know, the exile authorities do not accept that there is a ban on Dorje Shugden practice…and does not accept that there is discrimination towards Dorje Shugden practitioners within the exile community…my view is the opposite on both these questions.”
Dr Barnett also stated to the BBC World Service that Dorje Shugden practitioners in the Tibetan exile community have faced persecution as a result of the Dalai Lama’s actions towards them.
Dr Nathan Hill of the SOAS University in London, England also confirmed that discrimination towards Shugden Buddhists has arisen as a result of the Dalai Lama’s actions, “There is absolutely no doubt at all that individuals are discriminated against: they have lost their jobs, they have been told they must not enter restaurants, shops and businesses.”
Even one of the Dalai Lama’s two personal emissaries, Samdhong Rinpoche, tasked with representing him on foreign trips stated, “It seems that there are some who feel we should make some concessions to the Dholgyal [Dorje Shugden] worshipers who are unable to stop the worship so that they could return to the mainstream society.”, adding, “On our part, it is an easy job to come up with a clear demand. That is to ask them to stop the worship of Dholgyal [Dorje Shugden]. On the very day that they stopped the worship, they could readily enter into the old community. If one asks if there is any way by which they could receive acceptance without having to stop the Dholgyal [Dorje Shugden] worship, then, decidedly, the answer is that there is none.”
As recently as March 2017 the Dalai Lama held a prayer session in which he had 170 members of his security department make a pledge to never associate with any Dorje Shugden practitioners which he, “joyfully accepted”.
Clearly the Dalai Lama is the driving force behind the segregation and discrimination of Shugden Buddhists within the Tibetan community. He is acutely aware of the impact of his actions and the suffering they cause within the society he is supposed to cherish and protect. Yet he still expects people to pledge to continue this discrimination. Both of his emissaries, Lobsang Sangay and Samdhong Rinpoche support the criminalization and marginalization of Shugden Buddhists, and yet the Dalai Lama continues to be praised as an icon of peace, love and tolerance.
How much longer can the west turn a blind eye to the suffering of religious apartheid that the Dalai Lama is inflicting on his own people?
https://artvoice.com/2018/04/11/dalai-lama-preached-message-religious-tolerance-abroad-ruthlessly-persecuting-people-home/#comments
Very factual and point form about the Dorje Shudgen ban. The truth can never to be suppressed.
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Till today, many Tibetans are repeating themselves like a broken radio that there is no ban. They choose to ignore the signs that were placed outside all government departments including hospitals, schools, library etc. and the shops and insisted there is no ban because they do not dare to face the reality and truth. It is amazing how they can just ignore the harm imposed on the Dorje Shugden people and continue to deny their rights to practice. This is a sign of uneducated and uncivilized people.
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The Dalai Lama’s persecution of Shugden Buddhists is also evident to prominent Buddhist scholars such as Dr Robert Barnett at Columbia University who said, “As you know, the exile authorities do not accept that there is a ban on Dorje Shugden practice…and does not accept that there is discrimination towards Dorje Shugden practitioners within the exile community…my view is the opposite on both these questions.”
Dr Barnett also stated to the BBC World Service that Dorje Shugden practitioners in the Tibetan exile community have faced persecution as a result of the Dalai Lama’s actions towards them.
Dr Nathan Hill of the SOAS University in London, England also confirmed that discrimination towards Shugden Buddhists has arisen as a result of the Dalai Lama’s actions, “There is absolutely no doubt at all that individuals are discriminated against: they have lost their jobs, they have been told they must not enter restaurants, shops and businesses.”
We Dorje Shugden people have to endure so much and people who are in the know and can see the truth do not deny it but are astonished how Buddhist practitioners can be banned from teachings, talks and monasteries.
It is so upsetting that this happens in the Tibetan community amongst Tibetans, their friends and family, and it is high time that this stops.
We have endured so much but we never give up trust that the Dalai Lama will show compassion and stop this very sad situation.
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The ban is illogical from any angle and any proof that is given by the CTA can be refuted easily with solid proof taken from scripture, ancient paintings and simple logic. The reason why the ban can be so widespread and still alive to this day is that of the faith and loyalty of Tibetans to His Holiness the Dalai Lama.
Although it is good that the Tibetans have such strong and unwavering faith in His Holiness, but one also needs to have logic and think things through and not just accept it blindly. I have full faith in His Holiness and his actions but I also believe that this ban is some sort of divine play that His Holiness is doing for a bigger and better picture for the benefits of all sentient beings. We will never be able to understand His Holiness's intention behind his perfect and sharp mind.
We should just continue to do what matters to us the most without hurting anybody. Even if we disagree with His Holiness, we can still respectfully disagree with him. There is no need to get rude or start accusing of His Holiness being someone evil or deviant in nature. Aside from the ban, His Holiness has done a lot to help mankind and he worked really hard for it. We should still remember his kindness.
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The article states so clearly that the ban is in place and that many foreign observers agreed to this fact. They also agreed that the DS practitioners suffered tremendously from this ban. What I am astonished about is why had not these observers done anything to help the DS practitioners or at the very least bring the matter out to the world? In the West, even abused animals had their instant supporters to voice out for justice. Why is it that the DS practitioners do not garner even an iota of such sympathy or kindness? Where is the social justice in that? So many groups advocating freedom of this or that rights but never stepping forward to help the DS practitioners regain their freedom of choice in religious practice. Strange, don't you think?
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What have the Dorje Shugden followers done to be called a criminal? Did they kill someone? Did they hurt someone? Did they shorten the life of the Dalai Lama? None of the above, so it is simply ridiculous for Lobsang Sangay to officially criminalised Dorje Shugden practitioners.
If you look at the recent history of Tibetan Buddhism in India, the Dorje Shugden lamas have contributed greatly to the re-establishment of the monastic educational system in India and also the spreading of Tibetan Buddhism in the west. Some of the famous Dorje Shugden lamas at the time include Trijang Rinpoche, Zong Rinpoche, Lama Yeshe, Lobsang Tarchin Rinpoche, Geshe Tsultrim Gyeltsen, Zemey Rinpoche, Domo Geshe Rinpoche, Lati Rinpoche and many more. So with the new resolution passed in the parliament in 2014, these lamas are now criminals? The whole Gelug lineage stems from criminals? No one should still study the Gelug tradition if that is the case.
Well, the west doesn't really care if the CTA and the Dalai Lama are discriminating against the Dorje Shugden practitioners. They want to use the Tibet issue to irk China, to undermine China. Without the Tibet issue, there is really nothing the western power can use to put China down. Why do you think western countries are still giving donations to the CTA? Why are the western countries not giving the same support to other refugees?
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Even one of the Dalai Lama’s two personal emissaries, Samdhong Rinpoche, tasked with representing him on foreign trips stated, “It seems that there are some who feel we should make some concessions to the Dholgyal [Dorje Shugden] worshipers who are unable to stop the worship so that they could return to the mainstream society.”, adding, “On our part, it is an easy job to come up with a clear demand. That is to ask them to stop the worship of Dholgyal [Dorje Shugden]. On the very day that they stopped the worship, they could readily enter into the old community. If one asks if there is any way by which they could receive acceptance without having to stop the Dholgyal [Dorje Shugden] worship, then, decidedly, the answer is that there is none.”
Samdhong Rinpoche is known to be a very strong practitioner of Dorje Shugden. His ladrang was known to have extensive preparation 3 days prior to the monthly Dorje Shugden puja he does. Even he follows the Dalai Lama's advice although his root guru is Trijang Rinpoche. The Dalai Lama is in full control of the Tibetans for sure!
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Even one of the Dalai Lama’s two personal emissaries, Samdhong Rinpoche, tasked with representing him on foreign trips stated, “It seems that there are some who feel we should make some concessions to the Dholgyal [Dorje Shugden] worshipers who are unable to stop the worship so that they could return to the mainstream society.”, adding, “On our part, it is an easy job to come up with a clear demand. That is to ask them to stop the worship of Dholgyal [Dorje Shugden]. On the very day that they stopped the worship, they could readily enter into the old community. If one asks if there is any way by which they could receive acceptance without having to stop the Dholgyal [Dorje Shugden] worship, then, decidedly, the answer is that there is none.”
Samdhong Rinpoche is known to be a very strong practitioner of Dorje Shugden. His ladrang was known to have extensive preparation 3 days prior to the monthly Dorje Shugden puja he does. Even he follows the Dalai Lama's advice although his root guru is Trijang Rinpoche. The Dalai Lama is in full control of the Tibetans for sure!
Isn't Samdhong Rinpoche supposedly a emanation or incarnation from the Dorje Shugden line? Why is he so Anti-himself? Isn't he also the brother of the Dalai Lama? If so then I guess he is supporting his sibling? And having to be at odds with himself probably makes him more overt in showing his Anti-Shugden stance? Anyone care to enlighten me?
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The article states so clearly that the ban is in place and that many foreign observers agreed to this fact. They also agreed that the DS practitioners suffered tremendously from this ban. What I am astonished about is why had not these observers done anything to help the DS practitioners or at the very least bring the matter out to the world? In the West, even abused animals had their instant supporters to voice out for justice. Why is it that the DS practitioners do not garner even an iota of such sympathy or kindness? Where is the social justice in that? So many groups advocating freedom of this or that rights but never stepping forward to help the DS practitioners regain their freedom of choice in religious practice. Strange, don't you think?
You are right but as strange as it may seem, humans will only fight for something they can relate to and they themselves believe in. Dorje Shugden issue is a very niche issue and to others who are not Shugdenpas or Buddhist, they cannot relate and feels it has nothing to do with them and hence would rather turn to issues that are more universal and relatable such as animal rescue or environment issues.
So the angle to which DS ban should be voiced out must come from a common interest such as human rights issues. This is something people can relate to and would probably strike up more interest. And perhaps then people will start investigating for themselves and see the truth behind this awful.
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Isn't Samdhong Rinpoche supposedly a emanation or incarnation from the Dorje Shugden line? Why is he so Anti-himself? Isn't he also the brother of the Dalai Lama? If so then I guess he is supporting his sibling? And having to be at odds with himself probably makes him more overt in showing his Anti-Shugden stance? Anyone care to enlighten me?
I don't know about Samdhong Rinpoche being an emanation or incarnation from the Dorje Shugden line but I know for sure he is NOT the Dalai Lama's brother. The 14th Dalai Lama's brother is Gyalo Thondup and one of the people of the alleged masterminds behind the assassination attempt on the crown prince of Bhutan. You can read about him and his crime here http://www.dorjeshugden.com/all-articles/bhutan-the-rise-of-kings-and-dorje-shugden/ (http://www.dorjeshugden.com/all-articles/bhutan-the-rise-of-kings-and-dorje-shugden/) It is shocking how the Dalai Lama's brother can do such harm. You would think that since he is the Dalai Lama's brother, he would know better. Things just don't flow according to logic sometimes, just like the Dorje Shugden ban imposed by the Dalai Lama!
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Thank you dssnowlion for your answer. I do agree that the issue of the Dorje Shugden ban needs to be relatable to the people who are not into Tibetan Buddhism and as such presented as a human rights violation is something that they understand. It is a human rights violation as we are violated of our rights to freedom of choice in religious practice and we only wish to practice in peace. Some may be far from the CTA and the Tibetan settlements but the effects of the illogical ban had spread far and wide to affect every practitioners, from online abuse (such vulgarity that seemed to be the national language of Anti-DS), the not so secret ostracism with public notices hung up to prevent DS practitioners from entering, some DS practitioners discouraged and brainwashed to the point where they either hate or leave Buddhism and accused as being a Chinese spy. I mean What? A Chinese spy? Haha! All those James Bond movies must have clouded their minds.
Thank you Rowntree your sharing. It is senseless that the brother of the Dalai Lama, emanation of the Compassion Buddha, could actually mastermind such dastardly act of attempted assassination of the Crown Prince of Bhutan. Yes, you are right. There are many contradictions of things that should be and DS ban is absolutely uncalled for. Such division of the Tibetans and world wide DS practitioners. How could the head of Tibetan Buddhism, the Dalai Lama practice such disharmony for his people? Some say a 'Divine Play" to cleanse the practitioners from real or fake as well as to spread the precious beneficial practice of DS. But the tremendous sufferings that came from this Ban seems so at odds with the practice of compassion.
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The article states so clearly that the ban is in place and that many foreign observers agreed to this fact. They also agreed that the DS practitioners suffered tremendously from this ban. What I am astonished about is why had not these observers done anything to help the DS practitioners or at the very least bring the matter out to the world? In the West, even abused animals had their instant supporters to voice out for justice. Why is it that the DS practitioners do not garner even an iota of such sympathy or kindness? Where is the social justice in that? So many groups advocating freedom of this or that rights but never stepping forward to help the DS practitioners regain their freedom of choice in religious practice. Strange, don't you think?
There is a definitely a ban on Dorje Shugden practice, there are many proofs to it. Dorje Shugden practitioners are being discriminated badly. The only way to be treated like a normal Tibetans is to give up Dorje Shugden practice. If this is not a ban, what is it then? Only the CTA and the Dalai Lama think there is no ban.
Why is there no one has done anything to help DS practitioners? Very simple, there is no economic benefit in helping DS practitioners. Nobody wants to spend the time and effort to bring justice to the Dorje Shugden practitioners. In a way, it is kind of sad that sufferings of the animals are more than the sufferings Dorje Shugden practitioners have to go through.
If for the past 20 years, not a single activist group has offered help to the Dorje Shugden practitioners, I don't think there will be any in the future. Therefore, all Dorje Shugden practitioners should work together to give pressure to the CTA to lift the ban. There is no point to wait for a good Samaritan to suddenly appear to help.
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It is actually quite difficult for any Tibetan activist group to stand up and fight for the rights of Dorje Shugden practitioner. The effect of the ban is at its peak in Tibetan communities. Everyone will not want to have anything to do with you if they know you are a Dorje Shugden practitioner. They will not tolerate someone that does not agree with the Dalai Lama in their community.
Even those who are not Tibetan and staying far away from a Tibetan community, he/she can still experience the discrimination online. It is a common sight to see Tibetans going to Dorje Shugden practitioner's social pages to post nasty comments condemning them for their practice. They use vulgar words and curses the person openly on those social media websites.
How is there not a ban when the public can react in such a way to Dorje Shugden practitioners. If it is merely an "advise", the public would not have reacted in this way and they really wanted Dorje Shugden practitioners to be out of their community. I hope His Holiness the Dalai Lama can reconsider the ban and not create unnecessary suffering.
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There is a definitely a ban on Dorje Shugden practice, there are many proofs to it. Dorje Shugden practitioners are being discriminated badly. The only way to be treated like a normal Tibetans is to give up Dorje Shugden practice. If this is not a ban, what is it then? Only the CTA and the Dalai Lama think there is no ban.
Why is there no one has done anything to help DS practitioners? Very simple, there is no economic benefit in helping DS practitioners. Nobody wants to spend the time and effort to bring justice to the Dorje Shugden practitioners. In a way, it is kind of sad that sufferings of the animals are more than the sufferings Dorje Shugden practitioners have to go through.
If for the past 20 years, not a single activist group has offered help to the Dorje Shugden practitioners, I don't think there will be any in the future. Therefore, all Dorje Shugden practitioners should work together to give pressure to the CTA to lift the ban. There is no point to wait for a good Samaritan to suddenly appear to help.
I agree that ALL Dorje Shugden practitioners should bend together, to unite to work on lifting the ban. Great, powerful Dorje Shugden lama like H.H. Trijang Choktrul Rinpoche, H.H. Gaden Trisur Lungrik Namgyal, H.E. Gangchen Rinpoche, H.E. Gonsar Rinpoche, Lama Jampa Ngodup Rinpoche and Zava Damdin Rinpoche should get together and form a coalition of powerful Shugden Lamas to pressure CTA to remove the band.
I am sure with these big Lamas joining forces, backed up by powerful sponsors, there is a high chance. What would even be better, since CTA is still irking China with that stupid sleazy Sangay flying here and there in small European countries, bad mouthing China, if China were to join in to back these Shugden Lamas, then they really have to shut their gap and bend? Especially since His Holiness has made it clear he want to return to Tibet. And so since these anti-Shugden cronies always call us Chinese spies and all that jazz, it wouldn't matter anymore cos hey look who wants to return to China? Why don't they call Dalai Lama a Chinese dxx/spy?
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There is a definitely a ban on Dorje Shugden practice, there are many proofs to it. Dorje Shugden practitioners are being discriminated badly. The only way to be treated like a normal Tibetans is to give up Dorje Shugden practice. If this is not a ban, what is it then? Only the CTA and the Dalai Lama think there is no ban.
Why is there no one has done anything to help DS practitioners? Very simple, there is no economic benefit in helping DS practitioners. Nobody wants to spend the time and effort to bring justice to the Dorje Shugden practitioners. In a way, it is kind of sad that sufferings of the animals are more than the sufferings Dorje Shugden practitioners have to go through.
If for the past 20 years, not a single activist group has offered help to the Dorje Shugden practitioners, I don't think there will be any in the future. Therefore, all Dorje Shugden practitioners should work together to give pressure to the CTA to lift the ban. There is no point to wait for a good Samaritan to suddenly appear to help.
I agree that ALL Dorje Shugden practitioners should bend together, to unite to work on lifting the ban. Great, powerful Dorje Shugden lama like H.H. Trijang Choktrul Rinpoche, H.H. Gaden Trisur Lungrik Namgyal, H.E. Gangchen Rinpoche, H.E. Gonsar Rinpoche, Lama Jampa Ngodup Rinpoche and Zava Damdin Rinpoche should get together and form a coalition of powerful Shugden Lamas to pressure CTA to remove the band.
I am sure with these big Lamas joining forces, backed up by powerful sponsors, there is a high chance. What would even be better, since CTA is still irking China with that stupid sleazy Sangay flying here and there in small European countries, bad mouthing China, if China were to join in to back these Shugden Lamas, then they really have to shut their gap and bend? Especially since His Holiness has made it clear he want to return to Tibet. And so since these anti-Shugden cronies always call us Chinese spies and all that jazz, it wouldn't matter anymore cos hey look who wants to return to China? Why don't they call Dalai Lama a Chinese dxx/spy?
That would be grand won't it? The union of forces by all the DS Lamas and with the Panchen Lama which China advocates. I really don't quite understand why these powerful DS Lama remain so complacent and not unite to stand for their lineage practice which is their right. In union, they could do so much to counter CTA who only rely on begging for their own benefits. When there is a powerful union, people will gain trust to defy CTA's ban and start to stand up for their rights to practice. The Dalai Lama should lift the ban and work with the DS Lama to fulfill his wish to go back to China. It was DS who helped the Dalai Lama escape from Tibet and it will be DS who help bring him back to Tibet.
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There is a definitely a ban on Dorje Shugden practice, there are many proofs to it. Dorje Shugden practitioners are being discriminated badly. The only way to be treated like a normal Tibetans is to give up Dorje Shugden practice. If this is not a ban, what is it then? Only the CTA and the Dalai Lama think there is no ban.
Why is there no one has done anything to help DS practitioners? Very simple, there is no economic benefit in helping DS practitioners. Nobody wants to spend the time and effort to bring justice to the Dorje Shugden practitioners. In a way, it is kind of sad that sufferings of the animals are more than the sufferings Dorje Shugden practitioners have to go through.
If for the past 20 years, not a single activist group has offered help to the Dorje Shugden practitioners, I don't think there will be any in the future. Therefore, all Dorje Shugden practitioners should work together to give pressure to the CTA to lift the ban. There is no point to wait for a good Samaritan to suddenly appear to help.
I agree that ALL Dorje Shugden practitioners should bend together, to unite to work on lifting the ban. Great, powerful Dorje Shugden lama like H.H. Trijang Choktrul Rinpoche, H.H. Gaden Trisur Lungrik Namgyal, H.E. Gangchen Rinpoche, H.E. Gonsar Rinpoche, Lama Jampa Ngodup Rinpoche and Zava Damdin Rinpoche should get together and form a coalition of powerful Shugden Lamas to pressure CTA to remove the band.
I am sure with these big Lamas joining forces, backed up by powerful sponsors, there is a high chance. What would even be better, since CTA is still irking China with that stupid sleazy Sangay flying here and there in small European countries, bad mouthing China, if China were to join in to back these Shugden Lamas, then they really have to shut their gap and bend? Especially since His Holiness has made it clear he want to return to Tibet. And so since these anti-Shugden cronies always call us Chinese spies and all that jazz, it wouldn't matter anymore cos hey look who wants to return to China? Why don't they call Dalai Lama a Chinese dxx/spy?
There are many famous and powerful Dorje Shugden lamas around the world, but they have been very quiet about the ban. The only lama who is very vocal and really educates the public about the ban and Dorje Shugden is Tsem Rinpoche. He alone has done so much to create awareness of the ban on his personal blog site for the past 2 or 3 years.
Maybe these lamas don't want to have a dialogue with the CTA because they are worried about their lives. Trijang Rinpoche has personal bodyguards protecting him when he goes out. It must mean the CTA is capable of plotting to assassinate the lamas. Imagine if this group of high lamas travels to meet the CTA or the Dalai Lama and they are murdered? This is just too risky. The Tibetan leadership is well known of murdering people if you read their history.
I think instead of having a dialogue with the CTA, these lamas should make a closer connection with China. Then they can go back to China to spread the teachings to millions of people. When they become very powerful in China, the CTA will have to come to them for help to reconcile with China.
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There is a definitely a ban on Dorje Shugden practice, there are many proofs to it. Dorje Shugden practitioners are being discriminated badly. The only way to be treated like a normal Tibetans is to give up Dorje Shugden practice. If this is not a ban, what is it then? Only the CTA and the Dalai Lama think there is no ban.
Why is there no one has done anything to help DS practitioners? Very simple, there is no economic benefit in helping DS practitioners. Nobody wants to spend the time and effort to bring justice to the Dorje Shugden practitioners. In a way, it is kind of sad that sufferings of the animals are more than the sufferings Dorje Shugden practitioners have to go through.
If for the past 20 years, not a single activist group has offered help to the Dorje Shugden practitioners, I don't think there will be any in the future. Therefore, all Dorje Shugden practitioners should work together to give pressure to the CTA to lift the ban. There is no point to wait for a good Samaritan to suddenly appear to help.
I agree that ALL Dorje Shugden practitioners should bend together, to unite to work on lifting the ban. Great, powerful Dorje Shugden lama like H.H. Trijang Choktrul Rinpoche, H.H. Gaden Trisur Lungrik Namgyal, H.E. Gangchen Rinpoche, H.E. Gonsar Rinpoche, Lama Jampa Ngodup Rinpoche and Zava Damdin Rinpoche should get together and form a coalition of powerful Shugden Lamas to pressure CTA to remove the band.
I am sure with these big Lamas joining forces, backed up by powerful sponsors, there is a high chance. What would even be better, since CTA is still irking China with that stupid sleazy Sangay flying here and there in small European countries, bad mouthing China, if China were to join in to back these Shugden Lamas, then they really have to shut their gap and bend? Especially since His Holiness has made it clear he want to return to Tibet. And so since these anti-Shugden cronies always call us Chinese spies and all that jazz, it wouldn't matter anymore cos hey look who wants to return to China? Why don't they call Dalai Lama a Chinese dxx/spy?
There are many famous and powerful Dorje Shugden lamas around the world, but they have been very quiet about the ban. The only lama who is very vocal and really educates the public about the ban and Dorje Shugden is Tsem Rinpoche. He alone has done so much to create awareness of the ban on his personal blog site for the past 2 or 3 years.
Maybe these lamas don't want to have a dialogue with the CTA because they are worried about their lives. Trijang Rinpoche has personal bodyguards protecting him when he goes out. It must mean the CTA is capable of plotting to assassinate the lamas. Imagine if this group of high lamas travels to meet the CTA or the Dalai Lama and they are murdered? This is just too risky. The Tibetan leadership is well known of murdering people if you read their history.
I think instead of having a dialogue with the CTA, these lamas should make a closer connection with China. Then they can go back to China to spread the teachings to millions of people. When they become very powerful in China, the CTA will have to come to them for help to reconcile with China.
Yes, it seems only this Tsem Rinpoche is the only one vocally dispelling the allegations from CTA of Dorje Shugden practice with easy to understand logic. NKT used to hold demonstrations wherever the Dalai Lama had public events but not anymore. I could understand the safety issue but there are so many ways to work towards lifting of the ban. These are very high Lamas and surely they must know other means of helping?
Dialogue with CTA? No point. They have no basis to lift the ban nor will they as the ban works in their favour. The dialogue should really be with the Dalai Lama who was the initial instigator of this ban with his pronouncement that Dorje Shugden is a demon spirit and bad for practitioners. To me only the Dalai Lama can lift the ban once and for all. The petition should be sent to the Dalai Lama and be made very public so that the issue will not be evaded. Just as the victims of Sogyal sexual molestations, the Dalai Lama was forced to meet them due the publicity given.
There are so many people in China that needs the Dharma after such a long time of depravation. I think many thirst for it, so it would be kind for the DS Lamas to spread their pure lineage teachings and practices into China. With the Dalai Lama wishing to go back to Tibet China, these DS Lama will have a trump card to assist him in fulfilling his wish. It is time for unification of the DS Lama to push for lifting of the Dorje Shugden ban.
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There is a definitely a ban on Dorje Shugden practice, there are many proofs to it. Dorje Shugden practitioners are being discriminated badly. The only way to be treated like a normal Tibetans is to give up Dorje Shugden practice. If this is not a ban, what is it then? Only the CTA and the Dalai Lama think there is no ban.
Why is there no one has done anything to help DS practitioners? Very simple, there is no economic benefit in helping DS practitioners. Nobody wants to spend the time and effort to bring justice to the Dorje Shugden practitioners. In a way, it is kind of sad that sufferings of the animals are more than the sufferings Dorje Shugden practitioners have to go through.
If for the past 20 years, not a single activist group has offered help to the Dorje Shugden practitioners, I don't think there will be any in the future. Therefore, all Dorje Shugden practitioners should work together to give pressure to the CTA to lift the ban. There is no point to wait for a good Samaritan to suddenly appear to help.
I agree that ALL Dorje Shugden practitioners should bend together, to unite to work on lifting the ban. Great, powerful Dorje Shugden lama like H.H. Trijang Choktrul Rinpoche, H.H. Gaden Trisur Lungrik Namgyal, H.E. Gangchen Rinpoche, H.E. Gonsar Rinpoche, Lama Jampa Ngodup Rinpoche and Zava Damdin Rinpoche should get together and form a coalition of powerful Shugden Lamas to pressure CTA to remove the band.
I am sure with these big Lamas joining forces, backed up by powerful sponsors, there is a high chance. What would even be better, since CTA is still irking China with that stupid sleazy Sangay flying here and there in small European countries, bad mouthing China, if China were to join in to back these Shugden Lamas, then they really have to shut their gap and bend? Especially since His Holiness has made it clear he want to return to Tibet. And so since these anti-Shugden cronies always call us Chinese spies and all that jazz, it wouldn't matter anymore cos hey look who wants to return to China? Why don't they call Dalai Lama a Chinese dxx/spy?
There are many famous and powerful Dorje Shugden lamas around the world, but they have been very quiet about the ban. The only lama who is very vocal and really educates the public about the ban and Dorje Shugden is Tsem Rinpoche. He alone has done so much to create awareness of the ban on his personal blog site for the past 2 or 3 years.
Maybe these lamas don't want to have a dialogue with the CTA because they are worried about their lives. Trijang Rinpoche has personal bodyguards protecting him when he goes out. It must mean the CTA is capable of plotting to assassinate the lamas. Imagine if this group of high lamas travels to meet the CTA or the Dalai Lama and they are murdered? This is just too risky. The Tibetan leadership is well known of murdering people if you read their history.
I think instead of having a dialogue with the CTA, these lamas should make a closer connection with China. Then they can go back to China to spread the teachings to millions of people. When they become very powerful in China, the CTA will have to come to them for help to reconcile with China.
There are tons of Dorje Shugden lama out there but most of them stayed quiet or pretend that they do not practice Dorje Shugden. Some of the lamas chose to stay quiet because they are afraid of the rejection and discrimination from their own community. Some of the lamas are working for the Tibetans government. Some of the lamas are holding a powerful position in the monastic community and it will create more trouble if they reveal themselves as Dorje Shugden practitioners. Some of them just want to do their practice secretly without anyone troubling them.
Most lamas are afraid of exposing themselves as Dorje Shugden practitioners because anyone that does not follow Dalai Lama's way will be labeled as anti-Dalai Lama and they will face severe discrimination and even harassment. Sometimes, the harassment might be life-threatening.
Yes, the only Dorje Shugden lama that is outspoken and defending the Dorje Shugden practice is only Tsem Rinpoche. His work is truly amazing because the information on Dorje Shugden's lineage is so clear and it is very hard to find such complete information elsewhere online. It is quite sad to see only him alone that is doing all the defending work. Famous lamas like Trijang Rinpoche is not exactly outspoken on Dorje Shugden practice but he is openly doing it. We need more Lams like Tsem Rinpoche so that CTA will know Dorje Shugden people are not afraid of them.
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There are many famous and powerful Dorje Shugden lamas around the world, but they have been very quiet about the ban. The only lama who is very vocal and really educates the public about the ban and Dorje Shugden is Tsem Rinpoche. He alone has done so much to create awareness of the ban on his personal blog site for the past 2 or 3 years.
Maybe these lamas don't want to have a dialogue with the CTA because they are worried about their lives. Trijang Rinpoche has personal bodyguards protecting him when he goes out. It must mean the CTA is capable of plotting to assassinate the lamas. Imagine if this group of high lamas travels to meet the CTA or the Dalai Lama and they are murdered? This is just too risky. The Tibetan leadership is well known of murdering people if you read their history.
I think instead of having a dialogue with the CTA, these lamas should make a closer connection with China. Then they can go back to China to spread the teachings to millions of people. When they become very powerful in China, the CTA will have to come to them for help to reconcile with China.
Yes indeed it is true what you say that only Tsem Rinpoche seems to be the vocal one these days. And why has Geshe Kelsang stopped? His voice was just as powerful. It would great if these two Lamas join forces and together with other erudite high lamas like H.H. Trijang Rinpoche, Gangchen Rinpoche, Gonsar Rinpoche etc. I am sure we will have strong enough voice to have a proper dialogue with H.H. the Dalai Lama but that is not going to happen because it seems everyone is busy doing their own thing and that basically makes it all the more difficult to spread the lineage teachings.
And I like your idea of how these Lamas should make friends and create a good relationship with China! Well, since CTA is always accusing us as being paid by China, well so be it. We wish we were so we can make Dharma grow LOL, and what is so wrong with that? Dalai Lama has Chinese students and I am sure they donate to him and his many projects so why don't they say he taking Chinese money too?!
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The Dorje Shugden ban has brought a lot of sufferings to Dorje Shugden followers. But it has also benefited many. Just look at what is happening in China now. Many lamas who are close to the Chinese government are actually Dorje Shugden followers.
Because of the ban, the Chinese government knows that the Dorje Shugden lamas does not have any contact with the Dalai Lama or the CTA. The Dorje Shugden lamas are sincere practitioners who just want to spread Dharma. The Chinese government see this that's why they are giving Dorje Shugden lamas a lot of support to help them spread Dharma. For example Lama Wangchuk, the 11th Panchen Lama, Denma Gonsa Rinpoche, etc.
The disconnection with the Dalai Lama became an advantage to the Dorje Shugden practitioners. Not only the Chinese government give the Dorje Shugden lama full support to spread Dharma, they also allocate fund to help to rebuild their monasteries. The Dharma work of the Dorje Shugden lamas in China is growing and flourishing.
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Who would have thought that the man who won Nobel Peace prize had initiated a ruthless ban on Dorje Shugden religion? On top of that, that is in his own religion and he is splitting his whole community apart. There is no problem prior to the ban, everyone is united, peaceful and respectful of each other. Everyone openly practices Dorje Shugden and there is not one single problem.
Since the ban has been implemented, there is so much chaos and suffering. Wherever there is Dorje Shugden practitioner, there will be discrimination and suffering. Monks are being expelled from monasteries. People are being barred from using the hospitals. Children are being barred from schools. How is the ban benefitting the people? It has done more harm than good.
I pray that His Holiness the Dalai Lama will lift the ban as soon as possible. Restore the Tibetan Buddhist scene into a loving and happy one. People are being segregated and forced to form their own community for survival. This is not how things are. Buddhism suppose to be good, peaceful and uniting. They are not supposed to be used to segregate and penalise people.