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General Buddhism => General Buddhism => Topic started by: Aurore on March 03, 2012, 08:40:36 PM

Title: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: Aurore on March 03, 2012, 08:40:36 PM
Mantra is the speech manifestation and the wisdom energy of all Buddhas. It purifies our impure perception of sound. It is a means of protecting our mind from delusions hence the Sanskrit word for mantram that combines the root manas (mind) with tram (protection). Its literal meaning is mind-protection. It eliminates ignorance and opens the way to wisdom. It amplifies blessings and by it, tranquility can be obtained. It can save and alleviate beings from hundreds and thousands of miseries.

So here is an interesting story that I'd discovered:-
There is a teaching story about an educated practitioner who was worried about his mother who was not too bright, was illiterate and knew nothing of the Buddha's teaching.  He was worried that when she died, she would go to hell and suffer many lifetimes there, since she did not know how to pray.

He taught her that whenever she heard any kind of bell, she should immediately respond:

Om Ma-Ni Peh-Meh Hoong!

They would make a kind of game of it; he would ring the bell at the door; she would say the mantra; they would laugh. He jingled a few coins; at that metallic sound, she said the mantra. They both got a kick out of it. It got so that even when he was not there, like when she heard the collar bells of yaks and dris, she  automatically responded: Om Mani Pemeh Hoong! .

Now it came to pass, that the good mother died.  Due to her karma, she was whisked away to one of the hot hells where she found herself in a huge iron cauldron being stirred by a terrible demon with a great metal spoon.

But.
Inevitably, the spoon struck the rim with a resounding CLANGGGG!!!

The woman responded without even thinking, just as she had been taught:

Om Mani Pemeh Hooong

and zzzziiip -

There she was - in the Pure Land of Dewachen, the heaven of Buddha Amitabha where eventually, like everyone there, she became one of the Enlightened Ones.


What do you guys think? Can reciting mantras alone bring us to Enlightenment?
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: Q on March 04, 2012, 10:01:44 AM
I believe mantras are very powerful, but I do not believe that solely reciting mantras will bring us to enlightenment.

Why? because just by seeing the iconography on Buddhas (ie Tsongkhapa)... it takes wisdom and method to bring use to higher spiritual  practice and ultimately enlightenment. Just as seen in the Guru Tree.

Mantras is of course very important, but it doesn't provide us the wisdom and method that we badly need. When I say it doesn't provide wisdom, i'm not talking about the ability of mantras blessing our mind stream to allow us to understand the Dharma clearer, what I meant is, without even reading Dharma text... how does one convert the knowledge into wisdom when it is not there in the first place?

I have no doubt about the power of mantra, so I totally believe in the story that is posted. I know for a fact, that if a person recites just 1 mala of Om Mani Pedme Hung everyday until the end of their life, they will be saved from lower rebirths and take a fortunate human rebirth to have another chance to practice the Dharma. This story proves that. However, I doubt the lady in the story continued to recite mantras only when she arrived in Pure Land.

In short? I like to see Dharma as the medicine and mantras are the essential vitamin supplementary we take to nourish our spirituality.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: WisdomBeing on March 05, 2012, 06:38:56 AM
Sorry but I don't think we can gain Enlightenment by just reciting mantras. If we can gain Enlightenment just by recitation alone, parrots can gain Enlightenment. Perhaps the story about the lady who automatically recites is just to inspire people to recite and hope that Dharma will sink in to them later. Sometimes people start off reciting mindlessly but perhaps that plants Dharma seeds in them so that when the opportunity to learn Dharma later comes, the seeds can open up.

It is also not true that if someone just recites a mala of Om Mani Peme Hung daily for the rest of their life that it guarantees that they don't go to the three lower realms. I believe that you would have to hold certain vows to prevent you from incurring negative karma as well. I have heard that certain schools of Buddhism just tell you to recite a certain mantra daily and that will ensure you go to a particular heaven but i don't believe it. If it's so EASY, most of us would be in heaven. What about the purification of our negative karma? I don't think we can remove our negative karma just by reciting mantras. We need to work on our attitudes, our delusions, renunciation... the 6 perfections, lojong etc.. don't we?
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: lightning on March 05, 2012, 09:46:49 AM
That is only when you have the full mastery in understanding and actualization  of Buddha's manifestation body, enjoyment body and dharma body. It is just like an iphone , you need the complete software to run the full capability of an iphone.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: negra orquida on March 05, 2012, 03:12:15 PM
Thank you Aurore for sharing this story. It is quite light hearted and uplifting, very good to tell to young children =D

As what everyone else has said, I also don't think one can gain enlightenment just by reciting mantras.  That would be akin to telling someone "if you just believe in Me, you will go to heaven".  It goes against what we learn in Dharma!

Even doing elaborate pujas with all the ritual items and costumes and beautiful offerings on a daily basis does not automatically put us on the green lane to enlightenment.  If we are mean, unkind, arrogant, greedy during the times we are NOT doing pujas, then our pujas will not be effective.  How could they be?  The pujas I know of talk about dispelling hatred, ignorance and attachment, generating compassion, love and wisdom, clearing obstacles to our spiritual practice... so how can praying for all this be effective when we are not on our holy cushions, we do the exact opposite?  Definitely the Buddhas did not teach that hypocrites can become enlightened.

Likewise, with mantras, these are words/sounds that embody the qualities/energy of the deity to which the mantra relates.  For e.g. om mani padme hum, is the mantra of Avalokiteshvara.  Reciting this mantra can help us increase our compassion.  But if we recite it while we drown a snail with salt for fun, how effective could the mantra be?

In fact, this story clearly illustrates that if we recite mantras everyday in our human life and nothing else, it is very most probably/definitely that we will go to hell, just like the mother in the story.  Once we go down to the lower realms, it is very hard for us to remember a single word of Dharma, let alone see a Buddha's image.  However, the educated practitioner understood the value and workings of imprints and karmic seeds, and with genuine compassion, patiently and skilfully taught his mother how to remember and recite the mantra.  Because the imprints from reciting mantras in her human life was strong enough to surface in the mother's hell life despite the environment of tremendous pain and suffering, and she had planted enough seeds of enlightenment from reciting mantras earlier, she managed to open the chance to go to Amitabha's Pure Land and ultimately gain enlightenment when she heard the clanging spoon in hell.

But it is by sheer chance that she remembered the mantra at that point in time.  Perhaps the son was a highly attained practitioner and was able to give her a lot of blessings, or through clairvoyance was able to give her the right prescription to get out of hell asap.

So actually, the story is not as simple as it seems, and it is consistent with what we have been taught.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: shugdentruth on March 05, 2012, 05:22:41 PM
Mantras are extremely powerful for the person that recites it. But sometimes, we dedicate the mantras to our loved ones or to the people we are worried for. How does this help them?? They do not hear the mantra nor do they have the mantra resinating through their bodies. How does mantras help the person we dedicate them to??
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: lightning on March 06, 2012, 12:26:50 AM
Mantras are extremely powerful for the person that recites it. But sometimes, we dedicate the mantras to our loved ones or to the people we are worried for. How does this help them?? They do not hear the mantra nor do they have the mantra resinating through their bodies. How does mantras help the person we dedicate them to??
You can still dedicate to them silently or far away. As long as you focus on the person whom you wanted to dedicate the merits, they will receive it. Depending on the function of mantra, you can apply what you hope what blessing they receive.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: jeremyg on March 06, 2012, 05:47:35 AM
Quote
Most Buddhist traditions recognize that the path to Enlightenment entails three types of training: virtue (s?la); meditation (samadhi); and, wisdom (paññ?).

Just based from this quote I can tell you that mantra's mean nothing without wisdom. That how do we practice compassion through mantra's. Maybe if we are highly practiced and almost at the state of enlightenment, where we have all the wisdom, and virtue, maybe mantra's will be the last link.

They way I see mantra's is as a practice to help you practice even more. They bring you power, and help you open up, close, or purify karma.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: vajraD on March 06, 2012, 09:44:40 AM
I don’t think just by reciting mantras one can gain enlightenment. If is that easy all of us can just sit home and chant and gain enlightenment. However mantras can help purify our negative karma or lessen them. By chanting one can also open up the karma of the Dharma. It can strengthen one practice in Dharma and open up our wisdom so that we are able to absorb the Dharma teaching that is given to us.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: triesa on March 06, 2012, 10:36:49 AM
Mantra definitely have power, I myself have real life experience of the power of mantra. As to whether you can gain enlightenment just by chanting mantra, I wish enlightenment is that easy........ ;D

Chanting mantra is a way to use words of buddha to bless our mindstream, sounds have power and certain sound can actually heal our mind and body as well....like the mantra of medicine buddha and white tara, for instance. Certain mantra can even dispell black magic.

Chanting mantra is also one great way to collect merits, it is like making offerings to the three jewels. There are many ways and methods to collect merits, but merits are important for us to further our dharma growth, it is kind of like a building block, it faciliates our undertanding of the dharma text, it can also support our dharma work.

Chanting can help our path to enlightenement, but solely alone, I do not think we can reach full liberation. 
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: yontenjamyang on March 06, 2012, 10:56:35 AM
Nice story Aurore. Reciting mantras alone would not get us to Enlightenment. We need to take vows and follow a path recommended  to us by a Guru. However, definitely mantra are within the practice as invocation of the energy to the particular Yidam or deity. It is the sound energy of the deity. It one has faith and practice that particular deity or protector then in certain times of need we can invoke the deity's energy by the recitation of the mantra.

Most importantly, we need to internalise the practice and mantra by our daily prayers and meditations for it to be effective. On its side, the mantra has certain efficacy. Like a tool, even a novice can use it. But to be really effective we need to be skilled.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: pgdharma on March 06, 2012, 02:38:06 PM
Definitely mantras have power as they are the holy words of the Buddha but it will not get us to Enlightenment just be reciting. If it is that easy, then we would all be enlightened.

As in the case of the woman in the story, it shows that even though she recited mantras when she was alive, she still went to hell when she died. However as she was so used to reciting mantras whenever she hears a bell sound, it created a very strong imprint in her which she carried along when she died. So that strong imprint opened up again and she responded to the mantras when she heard the bell sound in hell which eventually led her to the Pure Land. If she did not created that very strong imprint she would not have remembered to recite the mantra and would have remained longer in hell.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: Manjushri on March 06, 2012, 08:15:31 PM
What an interesting share, Aurore. Thank you.

Mantras alone cannot bring you to enlightenment. No, definitely not. Lets say one minute you are reciting mantras, creating merit through your speech, and the next minute, you start screaming, putting down, lying and using profanities at others, creating demerit. You create more demerit than merit, more negative karma than positive karma,..how are you able to gain enlightenment that way?

Anyways, from my little understandings, attainments come from realizations. It is from the mind. From learning, from practicing the 2 lineages - compassion and wisdom. Chanting mantras alone will not educate you, it will not bring wisdom to you if you have no dharma knowledge. Yes it definitely will create imprints, which can open up in future, and have you receive blessings on ur spiritual journey, but definitely not to enlightenment by solely chanting alone. Enlightenment is not that easy!   

Just a sidetrack - the story reminded me of something I read in a Psychology book - how people train their pets with a bell, associating the bell to food, likewise in this case, the son taught the mum to associate the ringing of a bell to a mantra. How cute, and ingenius. Ringing of the bell and recitation of the mantra - both have sound energy, just that one is holy and blessed compared to the other. :)
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: Midakpa on March 08, 2012, 03:55:33 PM
I agree that mantras are powerful and have many benefits.  For example, some people are able to cure themselves of their illnesses by reciting mantras without resorting to medication or other methods. According to Lama Govinda, "the real power of mantras resides less in their sound than in the mind of the mantra-wielder." The efficacy of mantras depends on the trust we have in them, not so much the meaning. We don't even have to know the meaning.

But I don't think mantras alone can lead us to enlightenment. But one can become a stream enterer like Shariputra when he first heard the pratitya-samutpada mantra:

OM YE DHARMA HETU-PRABHAVA HETUM TESHAM TATHAGATO HYAVADAT TESHAM CHA YO NIRODHA EVAM VADI MAHASHRAMANAH SVAHA

This mantra is a summary of the Buddha's teachings. The arhat Assaji, one of Buddha's five disciples, was asked by Shariputra what his master taught. Assaji replied with this statement which became a famous mantra. The translation is: "Regarding dharmas that arise from a cause, the Tathagata taught their cause and also their cessation. Those were the words of the Great Mendicant."

Upon hearing these words, Shariputra attained the first stage of the path, entering the stream. Nowadays, this mantra is used to stabilize the power of blessings in one's mantra recitation as well as to purify dharma practice, especially any misunderstanding of the view.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: Jessie Fong on March 10, 2012, 12:55:02 PM
Wouldn't everyone on earth be enlightened if all one needs to do is just chant mantra.  Not difficult right?  Chanting mantras help us along the way as these are Buddhas holy words.  But we must also remember that Buddha did not become enlightened because he chanted mantras only.

I think she was able to be reach Pure Land because of her practice not only in the recent previous life but in all her other lives.  It had to be an accumulation of all her good merits.

I like the story though - if only we could be enlightened by daily mantra chanting, how easy it would be for us. No need to transofrm our mind, take the easy way out.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: ratanasutra on March 11, 2012, 02:57:10 AM
i don't think we can gain enlightenment by just only reciting mantra but it definitely bring us a good result. Therefore for those children who too young to understand and do the practice and those people who too old to do the practice we only can teach them to recite mantra because it only thing they are able to do in order for them to collect some merit.
 
But for those who are not too young and too old, we study and practice dharma, hold vows, do meditation, make offering, do prayer ect as there are more things required to do in order for us to gain more merit and have realization to gain enlightenment.

If only recite mantra we can gain enlightenment then the world won't be generated as today because everyone already gain enlightenment.     
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: biggyboy on March 11, 2012, 05:41:24 AM
Reciting mantras definitely have power.  There are holy words of the Buddha but it will not ensure us of Enlightenment by just reciting them.  Wow! How I wish we can just recite mantras and be enlightened that easy.  To reach enlightenment one has to have achieved true selflessness and compassion and realised all things around us are non true existence.  With what we have now in this present time of age and strong attachment on top of non consistent in re habituating our mind, how can we be enlightened with just reciting mantras? Reciting mantras definitely helps to bless our mindstream and its sounds have power to heal our mind too.

Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: Klein on March 15, 2012, 05:50:56 PM
I don't think we can gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras. We need to realise perfect compassion and perfect wisdom in order to gain Enlightenment. So other practices are required to achieve the latter.

Reciting mantras will generate merits. Different mantras will focus on different objectives. For example, reciting manjushri mantras will help the person increase memory and improve one's speech. Some mantras can help overcome specific obstacles such as spirit disturbances and illnesses.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: Reena Searl on March 17, 2012, 02:21:52 AM
I do not think through chanting Mantra will get enlightenment.

Mantras definitely provide us with the power to attain our goals and lift ourselves from the ordinary to the higher level of consciousness. They give us the power to cure diseases; ward off evils; gain wealth; acquire supernatural powers; worship a deity for exalted communion .

A Mantra chanted correctly or incorrectly, knowingly or unknowingly, carefully or carelessly, is sure to bear the desired result for physical and mental well being. It is also believed by many that the glory of Mantra chanting cannot be established through reasoning and intellect. It can be experienced or realized only through devotion, faith and constant repetition of the Mantra."
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: goldengirl on March 22, 2012, 05:11:18 PM
Yes we can. Mantra is very power.   May 2006 - In the holy land of Padmasambhava, Bhutan, a blind accomplished master know his time of his death in advance and sat in crossed vajra posture while passing into parinivana. This accomplished adept attained his realization and liberation through the recitation of Vajra Guru Mantra. Due to his blindness day or night was no difference to him, he solely rely on this practice and began to recite the mantra diligently day and night, eventually he went on to achieve an astounding level of realization. A True Account of An Accomplished Practitioner of the Vajra Guru Mantra in Recent Time . source: http://bodhiactivity.wordpress.com/2009/09/18/hello-world/ (http://bodhiactivity.wordpress.com/2009/09/18/hello-world/)   
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: Positive Change on March 24, 2012, 10:15:42 AM
Interesting story albeit kindergarten-ish... kinda reminds me of fables or tales told to children in order for them to do or believe in something.

However don't get me wrong, any method to instill that in a person surely helps but as much as I know Tibetan Buddhists believe that saying any mantra (prayer), for example, Om Mani Padme Hum, out loud or silently to oneself, invokes the powerful benevolent attention and blessings of Chenrezig, the embodiment of compassion.

Viewing the written form of the mantra is said to have the same effect -- it is often carved into stones, like the one pictured above, and placed where people can see them.

Spinning the written form of the mantra around in a Mani wheel (or prayer wheel) is also believed to give the same benefit as saying the mantra, and Mani wheels, small hand wheels and large wheels with millions of copies of the mantra inside, are found everywhere in the lands influenced by Tibetan Buddhism.

I also came across this interesting story. It shows that the motivation behind one's recitation:

An old story speaks about a similar problem. A devoted meditator, after years concentrating on a particular mantra, had attained enough insight to begin teaching. The student's humility was far from perfect, but the teachers at the monastery were not worried.

A few years of successful teaching left the meditator with no thoughts about learning from anyone; but upon hearing about a famous hermit living nearby, the opportunity was too exciting to be passed up.

The hermit lived alone on an island at the middle of a lake, so the meditator hired a man with a boat to row across to the island. The meditator was very respectful of the old hermit. As they shared some tea made with herbs the meditator asked him about his spiritual practice. The old man said he had no spiritual practice, except for a mantra which he repeated all the time to himself. The meditator was pleased: the hermit was using the same mantra he used himself -- but when the hermit spoke the mantra aloud, the meditator was horrified!

"What's wrong?" asked the hermit.

"I don't know what to say. I'm afraid you've wasted your whole life! You are pronouncing the mantra incorrectly!"

"Oh, Dear! That is terrible. How should I say it?"

The meditator gave the correct pronunciation, and the old hermit was very grateful, asking to be left alone so he could get started right away. On the way back across the lake the meditator, now confirmed as an accomplished teacher, was pondering the sad fate of the hermit.

"It's so fortunate that I came along. At least he will have a little time to practice correctly before he dies." Just then, the meditator noticed that the boatman was looking quite shocked, and turned to see the hermit standing respectfully on the water, next to the boat.

"Excuse me, please. I hate to bother you, but I've forgotten the correct pronunciation again. Would you please repeat it for me?"

"You obviously don't need it," stammered the meditator; but the old man persisted in his polite request until the meditator relented and told him again the way he thought the mantra should be pronounced.

The old hermit was saying the mantra very carefully, slowly, over and over, as he walked across the surface of the water back to the island.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: tsangpakarpo on March 28, 2012, 04:20:34 PM
I believe we can get enlightened just by reciting Mantras but it highly depends on our karma.

Let's say we have been very evil in our lives...and at the same time we recite Mantras every day..the mantras  will definitely not bring us to enlightenment!

But if our actions are pure and our motivation is to gain bodhicitta and realization of emptiness..then yes definitely by reciting mantras we can be enlightened.

We are all planted with seeds of enlightenment. It is just a matter of time for the seed to open and ripen. For it to open, an action is required. That action could be recitation of mantras for example. The Buddha once said there will be a time where all sentient beings are enlightened, so I believe this is one way for us to gain enlightenment.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: ilikeshugden on March 31, 2012, 12:03:49 AM
I believe mantras are very powerful, but I do not believe that solely reciting mantras will bring us to enlightenment.  If we can gain Enlightenment just by recitation alone, parrots can gain Enlightenment. But, this story is quite light hearted and uplifting, very good to tell to young children so that their mind will be able to understand more Dharma and/or be motivated by this story. Mantras also mean nothing without any wisdom. If you truly want to be Enlightened, do what your guru says then you will gain Enlightenment one day but it is faster than just reciting mantras deluding yourself into thinking that Enlightenment is super easy to attain.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: RedLantern on March 31, 2012, 07:57:04 AM
Mantra is made up of one or two syllables and almost any syllable can be used as a mantra.Dzigar Kongtrol Rinpoche quote "A mantra is like meeting the Buddha or Bodhisattva himself"It is powerful,effacacious and deserves respect.A mantra is "mind protection like a fence protect a plot of land.However,by chanting mantra alone doesn't bring us to enlightenment.It is only part of the parcel.We must practise compassion,true understanding and wisdom,which is the essense of Buddhism.By following our Guru's advice and teachings,as he is one with the Buddha.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: vajratruth on April 08, 2012, 04:21:55 PM
I would imagine that whether we gain enlightenment or not depends on a combination of factors that arises out of our practice. And reciting mantras and our sadhanas are definitely important parts of the practice. It is just my gut feel but if a mantra is chanted perfectly and with the right concentration I believe it will give us tremendous realizations.

Mantras are said to be holy words and their very sounds embody the attributes of the  various Buddhas. I remember reading somewhere that when chanted properly the Mantra is believed to contain the same power as the entire version of some prayers. Personally I don't think the sound itself has the power but i can see how the sound of the syllables of the mantra, combined with proper concentration and good motivation can serve to invoke the power of the Buddhas, and this makes mantras powerful

The thing with Mantras is that when we chant it correctly we feel it resonate in our chest area and I was told that it can also have the power to move our winds. For me, reciting mantras never fail to help me concentrate and calm my mind when I am feeling anxious.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: bambi on April 21, 2012, 04:20:41 AM
I personally think that by reciting the mantras alone, one can gain Enlightenment but probably in a longer period. Mantras are definitely one of the most powerful method for our mind. The effects are just fantastic! In time, we can see and feel the mind transformation getting better. This is when we apply the transformation for higher practices. We should be more compassionate, loving, kinder, forgiving, understanding, patient, etc. With the combination of mantras and practices, it will also lead to higher realizations.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: Tenzin Malgyur on May 06, 2012, 12:03:27 AM
In my opinion, I don't think we can gain enlightenment just by reciting mantras. I think the story is actually encouraging us to recite mantra always and in whatever situations that arise. Even hearing the sound of some coins jingling would trigger the old mother to say her mantra. It is one of his skillful way to help remind his mother to say her mantra because he knows he can't be with her always,even after she died and went to hell,she still remember to say the mantra because it has become an automatic response.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: Positive Change on May 06, 2012, 05:05:44 PM
As meritorious as chanting mantras may be, I do not think that is THE way to gain enlightenment and is a quick "ticket" out of samsara... if it were possible to achieve enlightenment merely by relying on chanting alone with no transformation, a criminal charged for murder and jailed for life, chanting mantras all day and night in his/her cell could be enlightened too no?

Sure mantras has its benefits AND does play a role in purifying, blessing and even assisting us in our spiritual growth and journey but it cannot be the only method to gaining enlightenment.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: Aurore on May 12, 2012, 05:44:48 PM
Thank you all for shedding your thoughts and opinions on this story. There are definitely benefits to reciting mantras but reciting mantras alone and still being a selfish, horrible person is definitely not going to bring anyone to Enlightenment.

There are also some mantras which can lower blood pressure. I guess it's got to do with the wind channels. If such mantras can prolonge our lives, while protector mantra can clear outer and inner obstacle to gear us towards spiritual path, mantras to increase memory and hence absorb dharma with better understanding. With all these benefits, if one translate proper mantra recitation into practice and one can eventually gain enlightenment.

What mantras do you guys do and what benefits have you experienced from it?
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: Dondrup Shugden on February 20, 2015, 06:16:29 AM
Whether we can gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?  It is my humble opinion that it is not that easy to gain Enlightenment by just reciting a Mantra.  However at the moment of death if we are not grasping onto our attachments and concentrate on a Mantra (which are very powerful) it releases our mind to a better rebirth.  With the better rebirth, maybe we will have the opportunity to practice the Dharma with more knowledge and better conditions. These are good imprints to have at moment of our mind leaving the physical body.

Also place in our minds that the Mantra recitation is the least form of practise and it is possible that when alive and we are always reciting the Mantra, there is a high possibility of blessings from the Buddhas for a form of mind transformation which is the ultimate form towards enlightenment.

These are my humble opinions and shall appreciate your comments.  Simple context to this post but high enticement to deeper practice of Dharma. Om Mani Pe Me Hum.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: fruven on February 22, 2015, 04:18:03 AM
For the majority of us who are uninitiated lay practitioners I don't think we can gain enlightenment just by reciting mantras in a short single human lifespan. When do our mantra recitation regularly it helps us to cultivate a good habit of connecting with our meditation deity.

As some have mentioned that what is the use of reciting mantra while still committing non-virtue. I agreed that it is better to abandon non-virtue then accumulate negative karma and reciting mantra at the same time. For example there are some people who are in a difficult situation of running a family business such as animal sales and trading. In that case they should do mantra recitation regularly until such a time they can avoid from it.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: MoMo on February 22, 2015, 03:45:41 PM
When we read or heard someone mentioned that one could achieve liberation or enlightenment simply by reciting a certain mantra, this statement should not be taken literally that it is all that one need to do.
The question of whether it will lead to cessation can be held to be true was that  mantra was the condensation of 84,000 bundle teachings of an enlightened being, the speech aspect of a Buddha. Simply by the virtue of an enlightened being serves as the cause, it cannot ripen into more suffering or a mundane fruition.
An example would be in the case of Devadatta, his meeting with Lord Buddha serves as the conditions for his ill-will, jealousy and other harmful deeds to manifest which led him to be swallowed by the earth. At the same time, in this meeting with Lord Buddha and the leaving a holy life in early part of his monkhood ensured that he would become a Pratyekabuddha named Atthisara in future.
We can understand by analysing the above example that all conditioned phenomena must have its causes. It can be further studied as in Dependent Arising (paticcasamuppada) and Transcendental Dependent Arising (upanisa sutta) from this web article http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/authors/bodhi/wheel277.html (http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/authors/bodhi/wheel277.html)

Mundane Order
Ignorance (avijja)
Kamma formations (sankhara)
Consciousness (viññana)
Mentality-materiality (namarupa)
Sixfold sense base (salayatana)
Contact (phassa)
Feeling (vedana)
Craving (tanha)
Clinging (upadana)
Existence (bhava)
Birth (jati)
Suffering (dukkha)


Transcendental Order
Faith (saddha)
Joy (pamojja)
Rapture (piti)
Tranquillity (passaddhi)
Happiness (sukha)
Concentration (samadhi)
Knowledge and vision of things as they are (yathabhutañanadassana)
Disenchantment (nibbida)
Dispassion (viraga)
Emancipation (vimutti)
Knowledge of destruction of the cankers (asavakkhaye ñana)

Suffering as in the mundane world now serves as the platform for faith to arise followed by the rest until final cessation.
I’m very sure at the beginning if one can recite mantra diligently he must have some level of understanding of suffering and have faith in the 3 jewels, in particular to the mantra, now this faith give one’s strength to stay on path that lead to joy, rapture….wisdom.
More example of why faith was important could be found on page 239,240 of “Liberation in the palm of your hand”.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: psylotripitaka on June 09, 2015, 02:55:26 AM
In the Root Tantra of Chakrasamvara, it says the supreme attainment can be accomished merely through reciting the mantras such as the 3-OM mantra of Vajrayogini, however, there are various meanings of this.

It doesn't mean that the mantra recitation is the only condition by which the final Union of No More Learning is attained, but through the recitation all the conditions for accomplishing the common and supreme attainments can be produced. How quickly it produces these conditions depends on the altitude of the practitioner, the degree of their faith, correct view, correct intention, level of concentration, frequency of application and so forth. This is a wonderful encouragement actually. Even if a practitioner recites with a little faith and poor concentration, powerful imprints will be left in their mind, and it will also start to gather conditions for faith, concentration, and other good qualities and conditions to increase.

Strictly speaking, it is necessary to gather many conditions together to complete the path. In particular, it is finally necessary for the practitioner to progress through the actual completion stage meditations. Vajra Recitation is the ultimate mantra recitation and we can understand how this leads to the attainment of final enlightenment by studying commentaries on the practice.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: psylotripitaka on June 09, 2015, 03:01:33 AM
...'aptitude' of the practitioner....

Not 'altitude'
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: kelly on June 10, 2015, 07:41:15 AM
mantra recitation is very powerful I personally has experience it even a person who do not know why he or she has to recite mantra it still benefits them a lot, I will not be surprise that just reciting mantra can attain enlightenment with proper visualisation and faith it can unblock our chakra .
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: cookie on June 24, 2015, 11:41:56 AM
Mantras are very powerful and beneficial to get attainments. But on it's own one cannot be enlightened. Chanting mantras and doing sadhannas regularly are very crucial in our Dharma practice. But what is even more important is when we are off the prayer cushion; how we live our lives with the other sentient beings, our thoughts, actions and speech must always be virtuous, for the benefit of others.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: pinecone on June 27, 2015, 02:19:01 PM
Similar question contrary to the above topic is “if one knows how to cycle a bicycle, can he or she ride a motorbike? “ The answer is yes one has to learn the tactic of operating the mechanism before mastering it. Similarly, if by chanting the mantra, one could lead to enlightenment and continuously killing, harming and performing non-virtuous deed, what is the point of striving to learn and practise the dharma . Further, why does Buddha tirelessly gave thousands of dharma teachings in order to educate beings to lead them to a better path and eliminate their suffering.
Title: Re: Can we gain Enlightenment just by reciting Mantras?
Post by: yontenjamyang on June 28, 2015, 05:31:22 PM
In the Root Tantra of Chakrasamvara, it says the supreme attainment can be accomished merely through reciting the mantras such as the 3-OM mantra of Vajrayogini, however, there are various meanings of this.

It doesn't mean that the mantra recitation is the only condition by which the final Union of No More Learning is attained, but through the recitation all the conditions for accomplishing the common and supreme attainments can be produced. How quickly it produces these conditions depends on the altitude of the practitioner, the degree of their faith, correct view, correct intention, level of concentration, frequency of application and so forth. This is a wonderful encouragement actually. Even if a practitioner recites with a little faith and poor concentration, powerful imprints will be left in their mind, and it will also start to gather conditions for faith, concentration, and other good qualities and conditions to increase.

Strictly speaking, it is necessary to gather many conditions together to complete the path. In particular, it is finally necessary for the practitioner to progress through the actual completion stage meditations. Vajra Recitation is the ultimate mantra recitation and we can understand how this leads to the attainment of final enlightenment by studying commentaries on the practice.

Mantras are the speech form of the Buddha of that particular mantra and it represent,

1) the aeons of merits that the Buddha generated
2) the enlightened qualities of the Buddha
3) the qualities that is stated in the particular mantra that act as an aspiration for the reciter.

Mantras hence represent the entire 84000 teachings of the Buddha. However, for the side of the reciter, how quickly one can achieve enlightenment given humans can only live about 80 plus years on the average, depends on the root merits already generated most likely from previous lives. Like Chuda who fined liberation just by sweeping the floors, the person must already have tons of merits and the mantra recitations or sweeping of the floor is the "last stamp in the redemption card".

Yes, reciting mantras alone can lead to enlightenment but I don't think it is the recommended way when we have more methods available. For most of us, it will take aeons.