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General Buddhism => General Buddhism => Topic started by: Mana on January 02, 2012, 08:40:19 PM

Title: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: Mana on January 02, 2012, 08:40:19 PM
Some dental experts claimed that the Buddha tooth relic in Singapore's Buddha Tooth Relic Temple is fake, that it could not be a human's tooth, more likely an animal's tooth.

If the tooth is ABSOLUTELY not Buddha's tooth, does it still have power/blessings if one chooses to believe it is? Does making offering to it still collect merits by sheer faith?




source: http://www.buddhistchannel.tv/index.php?id=57,4484,0,0,1,0 (http://www.buddhistchannel.tv/index.php?id=57,4484,0,0,1,0)

Buddha tooth relic a clear fake, say experts

Singapore Dental experts have raised doubts over the authenticity of a purported Buddha's tooth in a Singapore temple, claiming it could not have come from any human being, The Sunday Times reported.

More than 60,000 donors poured 45 million Singapore dollars (905 million baht) and 27 kilogrammes of gold into the four-storey building where the tooth, said to be one of Buddha's molars, is kept in a 3.6-metre-high stupa made of gold.

''There is absolutely no possibility that it is a human tooth,'' Dr Pamela Craig, a senior lecturer at the University of Melbourne's school of dental science, was quoted as saying.

After examining photographs, Ms Craig said it probably came from a cow or water buffalo, but definitely not a human.

Human teeth should be rounded with a short crown and a comparatively longer root, but the picture clearly shows a long crown and a shorter root, she noted.

''Looking at a photo is clear enough, because it's so obvious that it's not a human tooth,'' she said. ''It's like comparing a pear and an apple.''

Four other dentists, including two forensic dental experts, agreed with the conclusion that the tooth could not have come from a human.

''This is an animal cheek tooth _ that is, a molar at the back of the mouth,'' Professor David Whittaker at Cardiff University in Britain told the newspaper.

The Buddha Tooth Relic Temple in Singapore's Chinatown said that the tooth was discovered by a monk in 1980 in Burma. He gave it to Venerable Shi Fazhao, the temple's abbot, in 2002.

The public is allowed to see the tooth twice a year, on Buddha's birthday and the first day of the Chinese New Year.

''To me, it has always been real, and I have never questioned its authenticity,'' Venerable Shi Fazhao told the newspaper.

As for the assessments of the dental experts, he said: ''I don't care what they say. If you believe it's real, then it's real.''

The temple dismissed the suggestion of conducting DNA tests on its relic.

''It is unlikely that any Buddhist temple or its devotees will agree to subject any sacred Buddha tooth or relic to such a test,'' the temple said in a statement.

Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: WisdomBeing on January 03, 2012, 02:10:38 AM
This reminds me of the Tibetan story about a tooth relic.

Let me quickly share it here - There was a trader who often went travelling to India and his mother had implored him to bring back the Buddha's tooth as a relic for her. The trader was often busy and each time he came back from his travels, he forgot to look for a relic for his mother. One day as he was on his way home from yet another trip, he remembered that he had yet again not brought back a relic for his mother. As he looked around, he saw a dog carcass on the roadside and he quickly took a tooth from the dog's skull, cleaned it, wrapped it in brocade and took it home.

He presented it to his mother who immediately prostrated to the tooth and put it on her altar. Soon after, the trader left on yet another trip and he intended to get a genuine relic to replace the dog tooth. However, as usual, he forgot until he was on his way home. When he arrived home, he saw crowds outside his house. When he went in, he saw many people prostrating to his mother's altar. On the altar was a tooth which was radiating light. He asked his mother where this relic came from, as it was undoubtedly a genuine relic. His mother told him it was the one he brought back for her. Immediately the son also prostrated to the altar.

This story is a great example of the power of faith. It did not matter that the tooth came from a dog but because of the faith of the mother, it became transformed into a sacred object. The mother did not need to seek confirmation or proof that it was the Buddha's tooth. She simply believed.

It's like Buddha saying that if you see your teacher as an ordinary being, you will receive the blessings of an ordinary being. But if you see your teacher as a Buddha, you will receive the blessings of a Buddha. I do believe that we create our own reality.

Relics have been highly treasured throughout the ages by pilgrims and people of faith. I do believe that holy objects DO have power in the form of positive energy imbued in the item because of having been near a holy person or being. However, the intrinsic power of the object can be changed by the imputed power of the object. We actually do that all the time with secular items. For example, a t-shirt is a t-shirt, but when it is branded with the logo of Chanel on it, it is deemed as having immediately increased in value!

So to go back to the original question of whether the tooth in the Buddha tooth relic temple in Singapore is real or not - in a way, it doesn't matter. If many people have been inspired and blessed by the tooth relic in the temple, the relic is real to them.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: Tammy on January 03, 2012, 04:07:06 PM
Agree with Wisdombeing!

It does not matter whether the tooth relic if real or not, most importantly is our mind. if those who visited it and pray in front of it believe it is real, it is real for them. and the merits collected by paying respect and making offerings to it is real.

The power of visualization! Offering a sand mandala is as good as offering mandala made of pure gold and flawless diamonds - the essence is how it is being visualized.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: vajrastorm on January 04, 2012, 08:36:34 AM
Yes, it's not about whether the relic is a real one or a fake. It's about one's faith in Lord Buddha, as the story WB cited from the Lamrim shows. The relic is an object which forms the basis for one to pay homage to Lord Buddha. Thus it was really unnecessary for dentists to prove that the relic was not a real human tooth. Are they trying to discredit the people who are behind the setting up of the tooth relic temple or are they trying to cast doubts on people's belief in Buddha?.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: Dolce Vita on January 04, 2012, 03:52:48 PM
It is our view/perception that give the power to an object. If we see the 'fake tooth' as the genuine one, we will be able to to get the blessings and it becomes powerful. Same logic as the 'placebo' effect in medical field.

Placebo effect quoted from wikipedia:

"A placebo (play /pl??sibo?/; Latin: I shall please[2]) is a simulated or otherwise medically ineffectual treatment for a disease or other medical condition intended to deceive the recipient. Sometimes patients given a placebo treatment will have a perceived or actual improvement in a medical condition, a phenomenon commonly called the placebo effect... The placebo effect points to the importance of perception and the brain's role in physical health"
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: diamond girl on January 04, 2012, 05:54:33 PM
I understand the points here about the power of faith. Faith is the strong belief that something is true and thus practices accordingly. The mind thus controls the faith and belief. So, my question is, once a doubt is casted in the mind on the authenticity of an object of faith (in this case the tooth relic), how strong is the faith now? Is it not tainted with doubt even slightly? Would it not then reduce the power of faith? Are not the minds of believers affected?
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: WisdomBeing on January 04, 2012, 07:12:34 PM
I guess that's when we realise the strength of our faith - when it is being tested. How easily our faith is shaken is a wonderful self-check on how strong our faith is. We always think that our faith is strong but when we hear something not so pleasant about a Dharma centre or our teacher or our practice - is our mind swayed? Even just a little? If so, it is time to contemplate why. In the gospels, Peter was told by Jesus that he would deny him three times before the cock crowed and Peter scoffed at it. But when push came to shove, the prediction came true as Peter was more concerned about his own skin than that of Jesus. I think that our faith is usually shaken when our egos come up – when we start to think of our own skin, our reputation or our comfort zone. When that is perceived to be threatened, then we may start to wonder if this is the right path for us and look for an escape – only to find that there actually is none.

Dorje Shugden practitioners are often tested as people will be quick to criticise, and often scathingly. I find that when people start being negative, it merely lets me reinforce my resolve and faith in Dorje Shugden. I guess it’s just how we look at it.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: DSFriend on January 04, 2012, 08:14:53 PM
I do think people will receive blessings by sheer faith thought the object may not be what it is. Reason being, the faith is towards the three jewels.

So does that give people the license to make fake objects? Obviously not!

Realistically, we are living in the Kali Yuga age where morality is far less compared to the time of the golden age. People will do anything and everything just to make a few bucks.

Just to be very clear, I am only making this as a general statement and in no way referring to authenticity of the Singapore's Buddha tooth relic temple.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: Dondrup Shugden on January 05, 2012, 04:09:43 AM
Buddhism is about education and knowledge and with such education and knowledge, creates our faith in the Buddhas.  Faith is within oneself and the object of belief, it really does not matter whether the tooth is a fake or not but if we have faith in the divine, does scientific logic really play a part.

So many "things" in life cannot be proven but happens, so if we create the CAUSE for "things" to happen it will.  All "CAUSES" happen due to belief and conviction. 

It is beyond any doubts, with faith and conviction, fake becomes real and vice versa.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: Galen on January 05, 2012, 06:52:30 AM
It boils down to the power of the mind which is so ever powerful. If we believe that the tooth relic is real, then it is real for that person and will forever be real. There is no point in testing the authenticity of the tooth as what benefits will it bring to the people? As of now, the temple is flourishing and has brought hope and prosperity for the people in Singapore. And this is what is more important.

With or without the relic, the temple is a point to spread buddhism. And there has been troves of people visiting the temple. The Sangha members and the practice is what is more important.

Just like when we pray to a buddha statue. Different statue looks different especially when it comes from different countries. The Thais, Burmese, Tibetans, Chinese etc. have different images of Buddha and is reflected in the statues. So which one is the real image of Buddha? Is it important? The faith in Buddhism is more important and the image is to help us in our visualisation.

 
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: Midakpa on January 05, 2012, 12:57:01 PM
The question is not about whether the tooth is real or fake. The question is about one's faith. If one believes that it is the Buddha's tooth, then one will receive the benefits of one's faith. If we do not believe, nothing will happen. It is like the story of the old woman who was able to cook stones by reciting the mantra her guru gave her. Although she recited the mantra wrongly, it still had results and it saved her from dying of famine. All because she had faith in her guru's advice.  But when her son, who was a monk, told her that the mantra was wrong, she began to have doubts and her faith was destroyed.

Similarly, as a result of negative comments from the "scientific experts", some people will begin to have doubts. But those who continue to have faith will have positive results.

So what is faith? "Faith is a naturally virtuous mind that functions mainly to oppose the perception of faults in its observed object." (Geshe Kelsang Gyatso, Joyful Path of Good Fortune) Faith is essential in Dharma practice, especially faith in one's guru, because faith is the root of all good qualities and realisations. Whether the guru is really a Buddha or not is not so important. What is important is to regard the guru as a Buddha. This is called believing faith. It is the first of the three types of faith. The other two are admiring faith and wishing faith.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: pgdharma on January 05, 2012, 02:43:19 PM
It does not matter if the relic is real or not. It still has powers. If one views the object as real then the object of veneration becomes holy and sacred, it has blessings. One still collects merits from sheer faith as faith is within us and not from the object. The story from WisdomBeing is a clear indication of how a dog tooth becomes a sacred object for veneration due to pure faith.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: Big Uncle on January 05, 2012, 04:13:30 PM
I think the earthly remains of a Buddha is merely a receptacle for enlightened energy. The same thing can be said of any statue, clothing or personal artifacts of the Buddha. What imbues this energy is by the power of the Buddha's mind. All it takes is faith and conviction to tap into the Buddha's mind and any item can be energized with the Buddha's energy especially when it is subject is the Sangha.

Even if the relic is not really the Buddha's relic, it became a relic through powerful prayers and aspirations by faithful pilgrims and the Sangha community. Anyway, relics are used not for fanatical worship but to be used to open up virtuous aspirations and prayers from a previous life so transformation of the mind can take place and the person can resume the spiritual practice of previous life. If there is none, it will plant the right seeds for the future. It does protect physically and has power to avert disasters and so forth but that is considered secondary or an ordinary blessing.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: Tammy on January 15, 2012, 08:59:30 AM
In my humble opinion, it is all depends on our mind! If we believe the tooth to be real and we pay homage to it in order to make karmic connection with the enlightened one, by sheer mind power, WE make the tooth real.

In Tibetan Buddhism, visualization is an important part of prayer ritual (or puja), by the power of our mind we mentally fill the space with offerings and make connection with the deity of the object..

Therefore, it is really deosnt matter if the tooth relic is real, because the prayers and real..

 
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: kris on January 21, 2012, 09:01:53 PM
I felt it all depends on our faith in the Buddha. Whether the tooth is fake or not, if we have faith in Buddha, we will get the blessing and we will collect merits.

I once heard of a story. A women was reciting a mantra given by a monk everyday. She had faith in the monk and the mantra, and she has helped many people with the mantra. Until one day, someone told her that the mantra she had not been reciting the mantra correctly. She started having doubt, and from that day onwards, her mantra became less and less effective.

I think the moral or the story is that if we have faith in what we believe in, then it will definitely bring benefits to us, regardless if we are reciting mantra wrongly or offering to the "fake" tooth
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: yontenjamyang on January 22, 2012, 08:11:06 AM
Yes. A Buddha relic does not depends on the physical make up of the relic itself. Basically, everything is made up of energy. It makes no differences if it is the Buddha's tooth or an animal's tooth. It is made if the same thing.

However, if the devotees needs it to be 'real' then, to those devotees the power definitely will dwindle. It is because the actual power depends on our side, not on the tooth's ultimately.

I am afraid to say that in this day and age, if the tooth relic is proven to be not from the Buddha, then to many there is no power anymore because of their faith.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: lightning on January 29, 2012, 11:06:10 AM
Have anyone wondered why displaying Buddha Relics and what are the benefits:
1) Buddha relics are from Pureland and they are here for sentient beings to enjoy, whereas 1st ground Bodhisattvas can enjoy seeing Enjoyment Body of Buddhas.
2)  Buddha relics inspire faith in Buddha Teachings and make them pursue Buddhism.
3) Seeing Buddha relics can accumulate massive merits, get rid of negative karma and most importantly plant positive karma imprint in sentient beings mind so as to propel them towards Enlightenment, making them easier to meet good Spiritual Guides in future and making them easier to meet Buddhas in future.
4) In Maha Paramita Sutra stated by seeing Buddha relics is equivalent to seeing Thatagatha and in this lifetime, they will not befall into Hell realm.
5) By approaching Buddha Relics, they have huge amount of positive blessing energy bestowed. You can hold them or place it on top of your head.
6) By making offering to the Buddha relics such as offering flowers, is equivalent to offering to Buddha Himself. The merit accumulated is much stronger than Buddha statue, as most of us do not know how to visualize the 3 body of Buddha when they are doing offerings.

An Actual Buddha relics can reproduced itself with smaller relics and if measured by energy detector have strong positive energy measured or captured under aura photograph, these relics have strong purple lights which consist of magical qualities. If a small amount can be remove for DNA test, the history of relics will be around the Buddha's time around 2500 yrs ago, no matter if the small relics are reproduced recently.
The Buddha tooth relics could have grown over ages and it may not be of the actual human size, hence the dentist maybe inaccurate in this sense.

To prove whether the relics are real by age, DNA lab test will find out when the relics belong to and energy test to confirm its authenticity and the relics curators to verify them.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: Klein on January 29, 2012, 05:46:00 PM
"It's like Buddha saying that if you see your teacher as an ordinary being, you will receive the blessings of an ordinary being. But if you see your teacher as a Buddha, you will receive the blessings of a Buddha. I do believe that we create our own reality."


I've heard from dharma talks about the above. We create our own realities. Such is the power of our mind. It sounds cliche but I'm sure we all have experienced glimpses of this.

How we are in our life is our own creation. Regardless of external factors, at the end of the day it's how we perceive them and react to them. That's the sum of our reality.

Likewise, if the Buddha tooth is not genuine but we perceive it to be genuine, it still has power. Why? This is because our entire mindset and actions reflect this belief. Since there is karma to our actions, the result should resemble the cause.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: Manjushri on February 16, 2012, 11:05:22 PM
I think a 'fake Buddha tooth' still does have power... Do not underestimate the power of faith, as faith alone can create a field of merit. If one believes that an object is holy, and offers water/offerings/incense etc. on a daily basis, by power of holding on to their believe, their vow, their determination and dedication, it creates all the blessings necessary that is needed to make the object holy already.

I really like the example that if you believe your guru is a Buddha, then you will attain the blessings of a Buddha. If you view your guru as an ordinary being, your actions alone will not push you to create the conditions necessary to generate a field of merit to gain the blessings. You have already limited your ability to do even more. It is all in the mind, I feel. Having the faith will push you beyond boundaries. When there is no faith, you have already in your mind failed yourself, because you will not strive to achieve the results.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: jeremyg on February 19, 2012, 10:30:56 AM
Yes why not?

It is exactly the same case with Stupas, texts, and statues. They many not be the real thing, but we visualize and imagine them to be the enlightened mind, enlightened speech, and the enlightened body; this making them real. So why not? As long as the motivation is there, and your mind changes for the better, then why not?
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: vajraD on February 19, 2012, 12:07:01 PM
Yes. It is not about the tooth relic real or fake is it about once person faith in it. If one have strong faith in it. It will have is power and is effect. Similar to reciting a prayer. I was questions many times if they have recite mantra out of tune will it still have its effect. May reply is if you have faith in then it will have its effect but if you have doubt then there is no effect to it.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: ratanasutra on February 26, 2012, 09:05:33 AM
I feel that it doesn't matter that the tooth is the real or fake as it have been believed its a tooth buddha relic so it depend on one faith.

By making offering we collect amount of merit with it depend on 3 parts below;
1) the receiver : the high lama, just normal monk or fake monk etc : the highest one is the buddha
2) the object of offering : where you get it from, its from virtuous work, clean, cheating or mistaken
3) motivation of people who make offering : pure, faith, want  something in return, want fame, been force etc

to apply to this case if the relic is real then the donor with faith will collect lot of merit as the 3 parts are pure, if the relic is fake then the donor with faith still collect merit as the receiver not real relic but because of the place also have sanghas who hold vows who represent it.

Hence for the donor side they still collect merit but for the dentist who claimed without proof and make people faith shaken, they collect lot of negative karma by doing that.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: hope rainbow on February 26, 2012, 04:27:08 PM
A person that says: "this tooth is not the real tooth of the Buddha, therefore your worship does not have a basis", can only come to that thinking process and conclusion if he has imputed real power to the genuine tooth of the Buddha in a rather mystical, almost magical way.
So? was this said by a scientific person (a dentist)? Or by someone believing in magic?

A dead tooth does not have power, our thoughts, speech and actions have power.

Would a dead tooth affect our actions for the better, then that dead tooth has power.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: lightning on February 27, 2012, 04:19:42 PM
A Buddha Relic is an actual manifestation Buddha body!
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: fruven on October 26, 2012, 07:10:58 AM
If our motivation is good our actions will bear good results therefore we develop faith or our faith becomes stronger. When we have faith we develop good motivation when we pray and thoughts of others therefore the tooth is not a fake anymore.

If we are having doubts because of what people had said perhaps we should question ourselves whether we have good motivation on the Buddha's relic in the beginning and whether we have faith in the Buddha and the blessings from his tooth.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: WisdomBeing on October 26, 2012, 07:05:38 PM
Just to address the point that the Buddha’s tooth does not look like a human tooth, if we look at the description of the Buddha, he definitely did not sound like a typical human being. Finely webbed toes and fingers? Thousand-spoked wheel sign on feet? Hands reaching below the knees? With those kind of descriptions, I am not the least surprised if Buddha’s teeth did not conform to traditional dimensions!

From Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physical_characteristics_of_the_Buddha (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physical_characteristics_of_the_Buddha)), it says that the Buddha is traditionally regarded as having the Thirty-two Characteristics of a Great Man (Skt. mahapurusa laksa?a). These thirty-two characteristics are also regarded as being present in cakravartin kings as well.

The Digha Nikaya, in the "Discourse of the Marks" (Pali: Lakkha?a Sutta) (DN 30) enumerates and explains the 32 characteristics. These are also enumerated in the Brahmayu Sutta of the Majjhima Nikaya (MN 91).

The 32 major characteristics are:
1.   Level feet
2.   Thousand-spoked wheel sign on feet
3.   Long, slender fingers
4.   Pliant hands and feet
5.   Toes and fingers finely webbed
6.   Full-sized heels
7.   Arched insteps
8.   Thighs like a royal stag
9.   Hands reaching below the knees
10.   Well-retracted male organ
11.   Height and stretch of arms equal
12.   Every hair-root dark colored
13.   Body hair graceful and curly
14.   Golden-hued body
15.   Ten-foot aura around him
16.   Soft, smooth skin
17.   Soles, palms, shoulders, and crown of head well-rounded
18.   Area below armpits well-filled
19.   Lion-shaped body
20.   Body erect and upright
21.   Full, round shoulders
22.   Forty teeth
23.   Teeth white, even, and close
24.   Four canine teeth pure white
25.   Jaw like a lion
26.   Saliva that improves the taste of all food
27.   Tongue long and broad
28.   Voice deep and resonant
29.   Eyes deep blue
30.   Eyelashes like a royal bull
31.   White urn a curl that emits light between eyebrows
32.   Fleshy protuberance on the crown of the head
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: buddhalovely on October 26, 2012, 10:58:40 PM
In another Lianhe Zaobao commentary published on July 6, Chinese Buddhism studies researcher and lecturer Wan Bingyan cited religious and historical texts supporting the popular belief that only two of Buddha's teeth are left in this world.

They are now believed to be at the Temple of the Sacred Tooth Relic in Kandy, Sri Lanka, and the Ling Guang Monastery in Beijing, China.

When a third surfaced in 1998 after a Tibetan monk smuggled it out and handed it to Taiwan's Venerable Master Hsing Yun of Fo Guang Shan Temple, it was fingered by Chinese officials as a fake.Buddha's relics are venerated by Buddhists worldwide and held up as national treasures in Sri Lanka and China.

China had allowed its Buddha tooth relic to go on tour to Thailand, Hong Kong and thrice to Myanmar at the government's invitation.

Two tooth relic pagodas were later built in Yangon and Mandalay, one housing an ivory replica tooth and the other, donated religious items.Mr Kyaw Swe Tint, counsellor at the Myanmar Embassy here, said that as far as he knows, there has been no evidence of genuine tooth relics in his country.

'This (the one believed to be housed here) could very well be a fake,' he said.

But Venerable Shi Fazhao said Venerable Cakkapala had given him the tooth; it was a private matter between two people and not between two countries. 'Don't politicise it,' he said.

Would he let an expert examine the tooth in Singapore? He replied: 'It's mine, why should I let you examine it? Why don't you go examine what's in Sri Lanka and China first?'

Venerable B. Dhammaratana, religious adviser of the Buddhist Research Society, explains that different Buddhist societies would subscribe to different versions of Buddha's legends.

'You can't say which is right or which is wrong.'
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: fruven on October 06, 2014, 12:07:30 AM
I like the story very much.

This is also about the power of truth. Buddha's gave many teachings, one of them is impermanent, the impermanence in things, events and so on. This is not only one truth Buddha has taught but there are many others.

Therefore if one has faith in Buddha then one also faith in the truth of his teachings and advice. Of course Buddha has also advice that we don't take what he said without checking and validation but we must not use it to detrimental of losing faith and become very one-sided black and white on his words.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: maricisun on October 12, 2014, 03:01:27 PM
Totally agree with Wisdombeing.

All it takes is simple faith. If you believe it is real or genuine then it is real even though it may be fake.
Even if it is real but nobody believes in it then the power is not there. All it takes is to believe in it and have faith in it.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: Kim Hyun Jae on October 12, 2014, 04:11:20 PM
Whether the tooth in the temple in Singapore is fake or not, this depends on the faithful and loyal practitioners who goes there. Did they make offerings in the temple with good motivation and sincerity? If they did and believed the tooth relic in Singapore was "real" to them, then it is real.

I am sure the Government of Singapore wouldn't endorse such a temple location near China Town to hold "fake" tooth in it. And if the government did, then they would be faking the whole spiritual practice of the temple and of Singapore's image too.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: angelica on November 05, 2014, 04:17:12 PM
The power of the Buddha tooth does not depend on the genuinity of the tooth. The power come from the faith of the people. Therefore, if we believe and have faith, then it will have power.

Sharing a story on the importance of faith:
 
There was a mother in India that used recite the mantra of Buddha Chunda. The mother was recitING the mantra, the actual mantra is OM CHALE CHULE CHUNDE SOHA, but she has been reciting OM BALE BULE BUNDE SOHA, completely something else. But she was able to cook and eat stones, they became soft, cooked and she could eat. Probably, it means when there is a famine, no food, then this particular purpose of the deity, of course ultimate purpose is to become liberated from samsara and attain enlightenment. Her son who was a monk, getsul living in 36 vows, came home and heard her reciting the mantra, He told her the way she was reciting it was wrong, but when she tried to recite it correct, it didn't function to cook the stones.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: Matibhadra on November 06, 2014, 08:23:01 PM
Quote
Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?

For us, ordinary beings, there is no such thing as a “Buddha tooth” which is not fake. If it is a Buddha tooth, it is necessarily fake.

And why? Because a Buddha tooth is imagined to be what it is not, such as a Buddha tooth which is not merely called a “Buddha tooth”.

As far as we, ordinary beings, are concerned, “to exist” is tantamount to be fake.

Besides, whatever exists, being merely designated as such, is necessarily just imagined.

Therefore, a more meaningful question would be: “Does the mental image of a Buddha tooth have the same power of an imagined Buddha tooth?”
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: Matibhadra on November 06, 2014, 08:38:33 PM
Quote
Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?

For us, ordinary beings, there is no such thing as a Buddha tooth which is not fake. If it is a Buddha tooth, it is necessarily fake.

And why? Because a Buddha tooth is imagined to be what it is not, such as a Buddha tooth which is not merely called a Buddha tooth.

As far as we, ordinary beings, are concerned, to exist is tantamount to be fake.

Besides, whatever exists, being merely designated as such, is necessarily just imagined.

Therefore, a more meaningful question would be: Does the mental image of a Buddha tooth have the same power of an imagined Buddha tooth?
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: lotus1 on November 09, 2014, 06:14:45 AM
Agreed with Galen. If we believe it is real, and when we do offerings, the offerings are towards the three jewels.
I remembered there is a Buddha story that a child offered sand to Buddha. As the sand is all that he has and he offered with a very sincere and pure heart, he was born as a king in his next life.
For me, the result is that the temple now is spreading Buddhism and that is more important.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: Matibhadra on November 09, 2014, 03:02:38 PM
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If we believe it is real, and when we do offerings, the offerings are towards the three jewels.

Since buddhas are supposed to be all-pervading, or omnipresent, one makes no mistake imagining the Buddha in any piece of bone, or whatever else; anything will always be correctly imagined as the Buddha.

Therefore, and since as far as we, ordinary beings, are concerned, to exist means to be fake, or not to exist as imagined to, one should understand that the Buddha tooth is fake, and then make fake offerings to it, and such offerings will be towards the the fake Three Jewels, thus producing immeasurable fake merits for the benefit of all fake sentient beings.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: RedLantern on November 09, 2014, 04:29:38 PM

Buddhist worship is not the most important factor in discerning whether a relic is really from the body of the sacred Buddha. It is what the believers witness while in it's presence. It is how people react to them. As for the authencity of the tooth,what's sacred is in the eye of the beholder.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: Matibhadra on November 09, 2014, 04:42:10 PM
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Buddhist worship is not the most important factor in discerning whether a relic is really from the body of the sacred Buddha.

Since no one here has ever proposed such view, you remark is irrelevant.
Title: Re: Does a fake Buddha tooth still have power?
Post by: gbds3jewels on November 20, 2014, 02:07:28 AM
It is my understanding that sacred relics belonging to highly attained and holy beings do hold special powers. Buddha is enlightened and by that very nature of enlightenment is not bound by physical law of nature. If one truly believe the tooth to be of Buddha's and treat it as such, then I believe the "fake" tooth can materialized as the actual relic tooth if Buddha. If one does not believe or does not have the karma for it even the actual relic tooth could become a fake tooth. What is this world and every in it but an illusion. Since everything is an illusion, we become the creator of what we want to believe and make real. Only those fortunate ones who have broken free from the boundary of this world see pass the illusion and what is the pervasive truth. Until then for the rest of us mortals in samsara, fake or genuine tooth it is up to every individual mind what they choose for it to be.