Author Topic: Tsem Tulku connected to 103rd Gaden Tripa?  (Read 16537 times)

DharmaDefender

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Tsem Tulku connected to 103rd Gaden Tripa?
« on: April 24, 2017, 11:17:29 PM »
Im referring to the one whos just passed away. Was anyone aware that Tsem Tulku is connected with him? A Tibetan contact just forwarded these images to me. Tsem Tulku with the Gaden Tripa before he was on the throne, those were taken outside Tsem Ladrang in Gaden Shartse. Then theres some recent photos of monks in Nepal doing prayers for him? Nowt idea what any of the writing below the portrait means but their from the same monastery in Tibet and clearly reconnected again in this life. Theres also pictures of a Setrap and Shugden mural in Tsem Monastery.

But yeah, the 103rd Gaden Tripa Lobsang Tenzin who passed away recently came from Tsem Monastery. Its a small place, with around about 100 monks and it provides basic education for young monks before their further studies at two of the main Gelugpa monasteries: Gaden and Drepung. Learning, reading, writing, that sort of thing. And though their humble setup is relatively small, the monasterys become known for producing highly eminent monks. For example Gaden Shartses Khensur Jampa Yeshe Rinpoche who was one of Shartses previous abbots. This monastery, Tsem Monastery, has requested Tsem Tulku to visit many times and theyve been practising Shugden for many generations.

So what my contact told me is that Tsem Tulkus previous life was actually the 103rd Gaden Tripas uncle, and their from the Selsha clan. An interesting tidbit here is that Tsem Tulku is known as Selsha Kentrul in Yara, Tibet, since his previous incarnation was from that clan. And on his part, the 103rd Gaden Tripa was known as Gen Selsha cause he was from the same clan too. And since they came from the same monastery, clan and all that, turns out that the Gaden Tripa would visit Tsem Tulku, what with the personal family connection too.

And the 103rd Gaden Tripa is never going to tell you this but he even got sponsorship for his Labrang (household) from Tsem Tulku even though he knew Tsem Tulku is a Shugdenpa. At the time the Gaden Tripa was poor, he asked Tsem Tulku for help to raise construction funds for his Labrang. My contact told me that Tsem Tulku raised over 400,000 INR for the Gaden Tripa to build his house. Yeah thats right - the current house of the most recent Gaden Tripa was fully sponsored by Tsem Tulku. Didnt know that did you? 8) Tsem Tulku even found financial sponsorship for several of the Gaden Tripas personal students for many years, because the Gaden Tripa asked and because of their connection (familial, monastic). Tsem Tulku also found personal sponsors for the Gaden Tripa and sponsored his personal needs for many years.

Anyway, despite taking all of this help, the 103rd Gaden Tripa isnt beyond making some unbecoming remarks. The Gaden Tripa used to make regular visits Tsem Tulku at his home and on one of those trips, Tsem Tulku showed his altar to the Gaden Tripa. And despite knowing that Tsem Tulku is a devoted Shugden practitioner, the Gaden Tripa said he didnt believe in Gyenze.

But what are you going to do? Everyones free to say whatever they want. It didnt become an issue and their relationship continued until the ban on Dorje Shugden was enforced. It was only then, despite the help he had received, did the Gaden Tripa lessen his connection with Tsem Tulku. Oh yeah, and he didnt return any of the money or property offered to him by such a 'polluted' Shugden lama.

I will never understand this about them. Why hate the person practising Dorje Shugden but take their money? Tsem Tulku gave so much financial help to the Gaden Tripa. And when all of this help was taken, Dorje Shugden wasnt an issue...  :-\

Addendum by moderator:

Something thats recently become a talked-about topic is the use of oracles in Tibetan Buddhism to identify tulkus, for advice, blessings, that sort of thing. The topic was brought up by a Westerner who said she doesnt believe in deities who enter oracles, because Buddhas cant possibly enter oracles. This is being discussed here: http://www.dorjeshugden.com/forum/index.php?topic=5836.0

Apparently both she and the 103rd Gaden Tripa belong to the same line of thought which I find it disturbing because he lived in Gaden where he witnessed thousands of monks and high lamas going to see the oracles every month for advice. How can he then say something like he doesnt believe in Gyenze? Just really... strange.

So if he and this lady dont believe that Gyenze is real AND they dont like Shugden, are they saying that the high lamas of their era like Lati Rinpoche and Ling Rinpoche and Zong Rinpoche were wrong to consult Dorje Shugden? And only he, the 103rd Gaden Tripa, was right in all of Shartse Monastery to not believe in Shugden? He was correct over and above Lati Rinpoche and all that? Where does he come off saying things like that? But I guess because Dharamsala likes Nechung, itd be okay to consult Nechung huh? Or in his view, itd be okay for unenlightened deities to run around Sera Monastery like the oracles doing in the video below? Sounds political to me... sorry, just saying.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bi1pULEARXE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PcoVLsbIpg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iuyfo9KDR0U

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qxWKr0SADk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQ1VvvrAILo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rui7zVGV_eQ

According to oral tradition, it is believed that for a lama to occupy the Gaden throne of Lama Tsongkhapa, it takes a tremendous amount of merits and great learning is only a part of it. Since the tenure of Kyabje Ling Rinpoche, who occupied the Gaden throne as 97th Gaden Tripa, all Gaden throne holders have successfully completed their spiritual duties. They have done well during their tenure.

Among the senior lamas, it is well known that to occupy such a powerful and illustrious throne in a role representing Tsongkhapa, you must be highly attained, highly accomplished and must be well-practiced in tantra. Otherwise you will not successfully complete your term, and will take ill, resign or pass away. This is what is said in the monasteries. Any lama who is well practiced in tantra will have the abilities to have some nominal control over their bodies in regards to health and the timing they will pass away. Great Lamas like Ling, Trijang, Zong, Zemey and many more could extend their lives and also lived long lives. This is a hallmark of a powerful tantric practitioner.

Surely a Gaden Tripa, the head of the Gelug school of Buddhism and representative of Tsongkhapa will have these nominal tantric abilities to heal themselves and extend their lives. For example, the Dalai Lama is always saying to the press how long he will live and until when. This is a sort of hint to his powers acquired in tantra to control his body knowing when he will pass. The 103rd Gaden Tripa passing away suddenly after only four months on the throne is an embarrassment to the Gelug school and it shows he has not much accomplishments by way of tantra to control his body.

Even towards the end of his life, the severe deterioration of his body and the secrecy behind his disease added more negative questioning. People are suspecting in hushed tones now that he died of AIDS because in India, dirty needles are commonly used in village clinics to administer medicine. Lobsang Tenzin had been financially strapped for many years during his refugee stay in India (50 years or more), and could have easily gone for a simple injection at a local clinic and contracted AIDS. The other suspected cause of death might be he had cancer. Both AIDS and cancer would have given this wasting away appearance prior to death. Whatever it is, why the shrouded mystery to announce his illness?

Perhaps it is embarrassing and reflects his ordinariness, although rank-wise he was very high? Rank and attainments do not always go equally hand in hand as this Gaden Tripa showed. Since the position of Gaden Tripa is through meritocracy, not everyone who reaches it may have great tantric attainments and are therefore unable to sit for very long on the throne. This doesn't apply to other throne holders or offices of reincarnated positions. In those cases, it is the same person's mind returning again and again to occupy the throne, and hence they bring with them the same attainments from life to life. Being the same mindstream taking reincarnation to occupy the thrones, they draw on the same source of merits to support their occupancy of the throne.

• 97th Gaden Tripa Kyabje Ling Rinpoche 1903-1983
(Double tenure of 1965-1983)
• 98th Gaden Tripa Jetsun Jampal Zhenpen 1919–1989
(Tenure 1984–1989)
• 99th Gaden Tripa Yeshe Dhonden passed away in 1995
(Tenure 1989-1995)
• 100th Gaden Tripa Lobsang Nyima Rinpoche 1928-2008
(Tenure 1995–2003)
• 101th Gaden Tripa Lungrik Namgyal b.1927 
(Tenure 2003–2009)
• 102th Gaden Tripa Rizong Rinpoche b.1928
(Tenure 2009-2016)
• 103rd Gaden Tripa Lobsang Tenzin 1937-2017
(Tenure FOUR MONTHS)

Hence, we can see that previous Gaden Tripas had the merits to serve as Gaden throne holder for their allocated tenure. On the other hand, it was quite obvious that Tripa Lobsang Tenzin did not have the necessary merits to occupy the Gaden throne as he passed away just four months after his enthronement. In the monastery, he had a reputation of being a political lama and that did not serve him well. He was also highly critical of Dorje Shugden's practice, a view which didn't serve him as he collected a lot of negative karma for speaking against Dorje Shugden. Although given the opportunity to collect tremendous amounts of merits in his position as Gaden Tripa, his karma caught up instead. Due to his speaking against Shugden, he broke many other people's samaya with their gurus. One of his own gurus was Trijang Rinpoche and by criticising Dorje Shugden, he broke his samaya with his own teacher. The karma is heavy even if you are Gaden Tripa. Buddha gave no exceptions of karma and its results to anyone.

The final point of note: there are no reports of the Gaden Tripa even being in tukdam (death meditation) which I find to be unusual, to say the least. Wont a high lama like him be able to control his winds to sit in meditation even for a little while? I know its not a prerequisite that all lamas enter tukdam but youve got masters like Ling Rinpoche sitting in meditation for 21 DAYS, Trijang Rinpoche sitting in meditation for 19 DAYS and Zong Rinpoche sitting in meditation for 3 DAYS. For Gods sake you even have non-ranking lamas, ordinary geshes like, who enter death meditation for days.

So this affair? Its all very rushed and hush hush when they conducted this Gaden Tripas funeral so quickly. No tukdam, nothing. And the fact the entire affair was so secretive, that theres no information about why he died or HOW he died, and the fact he was cremated SO quickly just throws up a lot of questions. It feels like theres something to hide.

And not only was the cremation rushed but it was just very underwhelming in general. Look at photos online of Lati Rinpoches funeral then you tell me. By comparison, this Gaden Tripas funeral had very few international guests, and so few high lamas in attendance and presiding over the ceremony. We are talking about the head of the lineage here. Shouldnt he be getting more respect? Lets face it, its not as though his passing was a surprise. Its not as though people didnt know the cremation was going to take place eventually since he had already been so sick. In fact, he didnt look very good during his enthronement, like he was sick before he took office then started to degenerate really quickly as soon as he sat on the throne.

Where are the government dignitaries? Where are the high lamas? This is the head of the lineage; flipping eck, where was the Dalai Lama who appointed him to this position? Where is the pomp and ceremony of the funeral like Lati Rinpoche was afforded? It all adds up that the funeral was only done because they had to due to his status, and not because people actually wanted to be there or that they revered him.





« Last Edit: April 28, 2017, 07:03:11 PM by DharmaDefender »

KarmaRangdrol

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Re: Tsem Tulku connected to 103rd Gaden Tripa?
« Reply #1 on: April 25, 2017, 02:52:13 AM »
Is that the ambulance they brought him in? A little unceremonious compared to someone else like maybe Penor Rinpoche? And why the secrecy surrounding his death? What did he die of, don't people deserve to know?

Anyway RIP Rimpoche. Hope you have a swift rebirth.

Ringo Starr

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Re: Tsem Tulku connected to 103rd Gaden Tripa?
« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2017, 08:03:45 AM »
Im referring to the one whos just passed away. Was anyone aware that Tsem Tulku is connected with him? A Tibetan contact just forwarded these images to me. Tsem Tulku with the Gaden Tripa before he was on the throne, and some recent photos of monks in Nepal doing prayers for him? Nowt idea what any of the writing below the portrait means but their from the same monastery in Tibet and clearly reconnected again in this life.

The first two pictures are definitely take at Tsem Ladrang in Gaden Monastery.

Ringo Starr

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Re: Tsem Tulku connected to 103rd Gaden Tripa?
« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2017, 08:08:59 AM »
Im referring to the one whos just passed away. Was anyone aware that Tsem Tulku is connected with him? A Tibetan contact just forwarded these images to me. Tsem Tulku with the Gaden Tripa before he was on the throne, and some recent photos of monks in Nepal doing prayers for him? Nowt idea what any of the writing below the portrait means but their from the same monastery in Tibet and clearly reconnected again in this life.


The picture you were sent can be found on H.E. Tsem Rinpoche's website:

http://resources.tsemtulku.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/3/files/tsem-tulku-rinpoche/tr75.jpg

Ringo Starr

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Re: Tsem Tulku connected to 103rd Gaden Tripa?
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2017, 08:23:37 AM »
The 103rd Ganden Tripa began his studies when he was 9 years old at Tsem Monastery.

Tsem Monastery or Tsemcholing is located around Lhasa



The stupa in Tsemcholing looks exactly like the one in H.E. Tsem Rinpoche's Kechara Forest Retreat:



http://retreat.kechara.com/news/vajrayogini-stupa-at-kechara-forest-retreat/

Ringo Starr

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Re: Tsem Tulku connected to 103rd Gaden Tripa?
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2017, 08:50:43 AM »
H.E. Tsem Rinpoche's Kechara Forest Retreat also has a large tree which I believe they call the "iconic" tree which looks very much the same as the tree in the picture of Tsemcholing.

Have a look and tell me if they look the same?




Dondrup Shugden

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Re: Tsem Tulku connected to 103rd Gaden Tripa?
« Reply #6 on: April 26, 2017, 07:26:09 AM »
This is mysterious that the death of the 103rd Gaden Tripa is not publicly announced.  When did he pass away?
What did he die of?

Yeap the pictures were definitely with Tsem Tulku.

michaela

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Re: Tsem Tulku connected to 103rd Gaden Tripa?
« Reply #7 on: April 27, 2017, 04:52:44 AM »
The 103rd Gaden Tripa had just been enthroned for several months before he fell ill and passed away. Therefore could not completed his tenure. Since he just had the opportunity to hold the position for several months, it was too early to tell as to what kind of legacy this Gaden Tripa would have created, if he had the chance to hold the position longer.

It is interesting that this Gaden Tripa was receiving help from a Shugden Lama although he himself did not believe in Shugden. At least he should have practice tolerance and be courteous to his sponsor by tolerating his belief.

Namdrol

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Re: Tsem Tulku connected to 103rd Gaden Tripa?
« Reply #8 on: April 27, 2017, 02:52:03 PM »
i noticed that dalai lama didnt even say a word about this 103rd gaden tripa's passing, why not? after all dalai lama is the one who appointed him as the 103rd gaden trip last year, and gaden tripa passed away in office as the highest throne-holder of the gelug sect, which is also dalai lama's sect, so why isnt dalai lama saying anything? an eulogy, a statement, a condolence...nothing...why???

well from the story shared by dharmadefender, it seems the 103rd gaden tripa is not a grateful person, he didn't seem to embody dharma but more like a political person. the gaden tripa seat is very sacred, it is like lama tsongkhapa on earth, previous gaden tripas are highly attained beings like panchen sonam drakpa, ling rinpoche...if one does not have enough merits, he cannot hold up to the name of gaden tripa, his lack of merits does not sustain it, looks like this is what happened to the 103rd gaden tripa.

then the next question is, why did the dalai lama appoint him as the 103rd gaden tripa? the dalai lama has no clairvoyance to see that his merits (the lack of it) did not qualify? why still appoint him? perhaps he would not have died so early if the dalai lama did not appoint him as gaden tripa? why did the dalai lama do that???


Pema8

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Re: Tsem Tulku connected to 103rd Gaden Tripa?
« Reply #9 on: April 27, 2017, 03:42:13 PM »
This is really sad! As the 103rd Gaden Tripa, who does not believe in Dorje Shugden and Gyenze, receiving and accepting such huge gifts from a Dorje Shugden practitioner is quite interesting.

When one occupies this prestigious position as Lama Tsongkhapa's throneholder, one must be a true practitioner. Lama Tsongkhapa is not fooled by politics and without the true motivation to benefit others, one cannot hold up to this position I guess.

Thanks for the pictures who prove the connection of the 103 Gaden Tripa and Tsem Tulku. 

Big Uncle

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Re: Tsem Tulku connected to 103rd Gaden Tripa?
« Reply #10 on: April 27, 2017, 07:37:06 PM »
From reading this post, I feel that the Gaden Tripa Lobsang Tenzin was a highly political lama and that probably gotten him the position in the first place and that is why he didn't accumulate the merits to support his tenure. It's too bad that he was like that because that didn't serve his practice and as DharmaDefender had said, he didn't have the merits nor the tantric attainment to ward off unnecessary illnesses. At this point, nobody knows how he passed away which in itself is highly suspicious.

I am sorry but this is too bad because the Gaden Tripa should be a lama of the highest caliber and not just any ordinary monk. He is the head of the Gelug School and a lama of his caliber, much more is expected out of him because he was chosen amongst the most elite of the Gelug. Unfortunately, this lama reflects badly on the Gelug system and it shows that degeneration had set in and it seems that a lama who is political and against Dorje Shugden should never be allowed to rise to this level. 

Big Uncle

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Re: Tsem Tulku connected to 103rd Gaden Tripa?
« Reply #11 on: April 27, 2017, 07:53:03 PM »
The 103rd Ganden Tripa began his studies when he was 9 years old at Tsem Monastery.

Tsem Monastery or Tsemcholing is located around Lhasa



The stupa in Tsemcholing looks exactly like the one in H.E. Tsem Rinpoche's Kechara Forest Retreat:



http://retreat.kechara.com/news/vajrayogini-stupa-at-kechara-forest-retreat/


Tsem Monastery is not in Lhasa area, it is in Yarra. Tsemcholing is actually another monastery that belong to a very powerful incarnation line that used to serve as one of the regents of Tibet. So, I think you got your info mixed up. Furthermore, the shape of the stupa you pointed out is quite common in Tibet. You would see it almost everywhere in the Tibetan world.

Rowntree

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Re: Tsem Tulku connected to 103rd Gaden Tripa?
« Reply #12 on: April 27, 2017, 10:04:49 PM »
There are so much information to be digested in this post:
  • 103rd Gaden Tripa's early death
  • Tsem monastery
  • Relationship between 103rd Gaden Tripa and HE Tsem Tulku
  • Merits required for such a high post as Gaden Tripa
  • Qualities of the 103rd Gaden Tripa

Looking at the list of the previous Gaden Tripa, I noticed that they are all Dorje Shugden practitioners or never made negative comments about Dorje Shugden and break samaya. A monk who breaks own samaya definitely cannot be a representative of the Buddha's teachings, let alone being the Gaden Tripa. Earlier, I browsed through the two albums on the 103rd Gaden Tripa's Facebook Fanpage, I can see that he didn't looked good since his tenure as the Sharpa Choeje. I suspect he was already sick then and when his ascended to the Gaden throne, his karma took over and became extremely sick very quickly and eventually passed away.

A friend who had learned under him for few years told me things changed when he was chosen as a Sharpa Choeje, and obviously very into the power and title. My friend also told me someone told him off directly for his change of behaviour as a Sharpa Choeje and warned him that will not serve him well. Obviously, since that is against the Buddha's teachings to begin with. My friend also told me that he was a good teacher in knowledge but I guess his interest in power overpowered the dharma and spiritual practice.

What my friend said further prove DharmaDefender's sharing on 103rd Gaden Tripa's personality and being ungrateful is just one of the many things he shouldn't be doing with such a sacred title. Any normal and ordinary people would understand being grateful and thankful is just something any normal persons would do as a common courtesy to so much help one received. HE Tsem Tulku on the contrary is a total opposite of the 103rd Gaden Tripa - genuine, generous, caring, appreciative, non-political, doesn't want attention, practitioner of dharma and devoted to his root Guru and Dorje Shugden.

Sera and Drepung have a reputation to produce sangha that are good in political relation, while Gaden, especially Shartse, famous for producing eminent dharma practitioner. This 103rd Gaden Tripa further 'endorsed' that reputation and so it is not a surprise that he didn't focus on dharma but politics. Political relation is not bad but focusing on it as a monk is definitely unnecessary and the result should set a good example for the future generation. I hope people will learn a good lesson from the 103rd Gaden Tripa's death and life story and really take karma and merits into serious considerations and work towards liberation from samsara.

Gabby Potter

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Re: Tsem Tulku connected to 103rd Gaden Tripa?
« Reply #13 on: April 27, 2017, 10:24:02 PM »
This is very sad, his tenure as the Gaden Tripa was a very short one. I heard that it's very inauspicious for someone like the Gaden Tripa to pass away during their tenure, especially one who has only been on the throne for 4 months. I wonder how will this make the others feel... To sit on such a huge throne, it requires a tremendous amount of merits to sustain that; If one does not have enough merits and they further criticize others' practice/ religion such as Dorje Shugden, he/ she collects demerits.

Dorje Shugden is an enlightened Buddha who's an emanation of Manjushri, can you imagine the amount of demerits one collects for criticizing Manjushri himself? People can argue all they want, they can say that Dorje Shugden is a spirit and therefore he took his revenge on the Gaden Tripa. But shouldn't a monk with vows intact be protected from spirit disturbances?  A monk/ nun who does their practices correctly and genuinely and keep their vows, even the robes that they wear can ward off spirits. So IF Dorje Shugden is a spirit (which he's not), why was he able to 'harm' the Gaden Tripa? Don't you think there's something wrong there?

AshRao

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Re: Tsem Tulku connected to 103rd Gaden Tripa?
« Reply #14 on: April 27, 2017, 11:01:04 PM »
DharmaDefender's post does indeed raise some interesting points about the late 103rd Gaden Tripa, but more than that, also about the state of affairs surrounding the appointment of the highest position within the Gelugpa hierarchy. Someone who can so blatantly tell someone else that what they are practicing is wrong, yet take funds to build his house, and then completely ignore the person who helped him, does not sound like the qualities a leader of such stature should have. For example, even the Dalai Lama doesn't condemn other religions, well...apart from the Holy Protector. Maybe that's a bad example.

In any case, in the modern world of religious pluralism, harmony, faith, and acceptance is what is need for the world to become the utopia it can be if we give it a try. An example such as this, would not inspire others to be the best they can in a world full of so much difference. Hindus and Muslims can live side by side, so why can't those who practice the Holy Protector and those who do not.

In the India the various traditions, sects and sub-sects all have their own version of Gaden Tripa, and their own thrones. Just like the various other Tibetan Buddhist traditions also have their own heads and thrones of their tradition. Some who sit on the throne are worthy of the position, others are not. And the differences between the qualities of these leaders, are clear for all to see. However, one thing is for certain. In the case where those that sit on the throne do not uphold their particular traditions and the teachings and practices, that particular tradition doesn't seem to flourish. No one is impressed by them, no one is inspired. On the other hand, those who are leaders with qualities worthy of such positions, make the tradition flourish. There have been some comments previously as to the specific qualifications it is said that a Gaden Tripa must have, and these are somewhat new to me, but do match my own experience of those who lead other traditions.

My teacher has always maintained that real masters are able to control their prana and chakras, so that they can heal themselves of any disease, and overcome any physical ailments. This is a sign of the siddhis that have gained from intense practice. In this regards i mean no disrespect, but if the 103rd Gaden Tripa was a real master, why did he not simply engage in prana meditation and heal himself of his disease? Wouldn't this have been even more of an inspiration for those in the tradition, and increase people's faith in the teachings?